Posted on Apr 12, 2021
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Has anyone seen the story out of Virginia about 2LT Caron Nazario. I'm looking for some feedback on his actions and the police reactions. Is this acceptable conduct for an officer in the US Military Has anyone else had this kind of interaction?
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SSG Edward Tilton
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“We can’t see your tag”
“ it’s in my rear window”
“ can’t see it, it’s tinted”
“ OK, I will fix it”
EOM
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CPO Leonard Orth
CPO Leonard Orth
3 y
The 2nd lt was stopped and cited for speeding about a month before this latest interaction. The officer that gave him his speeding ticket also said, on camera, that he didn't see the license plate. 2nd lt said it was a paper tag. Cop looked with a flashlight and saw it.
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SSG Edward Tilton
SSG Edward Tilton
3 y
Tag not visible is not a felony
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LCpl Sidney Green
LCpl Sidney Green
3 y
SSG Edward Tilton - I can see the tag in the video. Besides, cops have spot lights and flashlights they can use to help them see better.
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SFC Casey O'Mally
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I have had multiple interactions with the police. Multiple. Never anything like this. Yes, it is possible the LT could have been more compliant. Yes, he DID drive a SHORT period extra to get to a well-lit area. Both are true. BUT....

The LT was overall compliant, his action to drive to a well-lit area is ROUTINE and even encouraged by most PDs. The LT never once escalated anything nor did he return the Officers' escalation. He remain calm throughout and the only "struggle" he provided was resisting being thrown to the ground - which I think is a pretty natural reaction.

It is a popular opinion that we should just comply with the police, no matter how badly they abuse us or violate our rights. I do not happen to agree with that opinion. I have absolutely nothing to hide in my home. When the cops come by, they do NOT have permission to enter. I have absolutely nothing to hide in my vehicle. When I get pulled over, they do NOT have permission to search. And they get nothing other than license, registration, and insurance. I am polite, but volunteer no information. "Do you know why I pulled you over?" "Why don't you tell me, Officer?" "Show me your hands." "They are right here, Officer." "Do you have any weapons?" "I have no firearms, officer, if that is what you are asking." If they ask me to exit the vehicle, the first thing I am going to do is ask them why. If they tell me again, I am going to ask if I am being detained, and why I am being detained. And I will comply, but announce my actions. - "I am going to remove my seat belt now. I am opening the door now." And I will move slow as hell while doing so.

No law requires us to be complicit in our own abuse or in the violation of our own rights. Period.
You seem to be implying that if this LT had just went along with being racially profiled, abused, and having his rights completely trampled, he would have been fine.

No, I do not think - based on what little is shown - that he did anything wrong.
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TSgt James Warfield
TSgt James Warfield
3 y
wow, you must saw a different video then I saw. The one I saw was the actual body cams from the police officers. Oh and not to mention, narrated by a Black Military Veteran who has his own pod cast, and didn't take the side of Lt and saw what I saw, someone who refused to follow orders given by a police officer. Didn't even try to clarify, I agree with the narrator, the Lt escalated the problem by refusing to obey.
I also agree with the pod cast narrator, the Lt didn't act scared or concern for his safety was smug and used the race card and military card as well as the officer card to not comply.
Also please look at CW4 Lou Quiñones Post and watch the video of a routine traffic stop, go wrong and police officer was shot by a man who resisted arrest. Which by the way is happening more then blacks getting shot. So yes the police officers had the right to be concerned, they even tried to explain this the LT who was smug and righteous. This is caused by the media and people who are so afraid to speak out against what is truly not a problem but was made a problem by media, and political officials
99% of all black shot were due to resisting arrest. Don't care what your race is, follow commands, of police officers, if you think they are being bullies, or over asserting their power, then make a former complaint.
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TSgt Chuck Mankin
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His conduct was a disgrace to the uniform. He acted ignorant and used his uniform as an attempt to better his position because he knew he was in the wrong from the time he got told about the plate the 1st time he was caught doing 54 in a 35mph zone on a foggy morning.
When the police attempted to stop him he should have stopped. Because he didn't the officers assumed he was fleeing from them. This changes the entire dynamic of the stop from a simple license plate violation to a felony traffic stop. This is done because it is possible that a person fleeing the police has done something bad.
Once he finally pulled into the gas station and stopped. All he had to do at that point was obey the officers commands, had he done this it would be a non-event. The cops would have asked him why he didn't stop and he would have told them. They would have told him that was a bad idea and that was why he had guns pointed at him. They then would have given him a verbal or at worst a written warning about his tag. He would have gone on his way better educated to avoid those things in the future.
I honestly believe the whole thing was an attempt by him to get a big payday for himself. Also, he is a National Guard soldier working in VA but from GA. Maybe he's on orders to the National Guard Bureau. The video from the 1st traffic stop shows his arm patch clearly with ARNG Honor Guard which is the Army National Guard Honor Guard.
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SSG(P) Engineer
SSG(P) (Join to see)
3 y
I completely agree
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SFC Intelligence Analyst
SFC (Join to see)
3 y
No the disgraces are some of the people commenting on here like you honestly.
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MAJ William Guglielmi
MAJ William Guglielmi
3 y
You are completely wrong. No one is obligated to submit to abuse.
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CPL Jason Northedge
CPL Jason Northedge
3 y
Using your logic he should have gotten the electric chair for pulling into a lit area while being pulled over? Ok. Big payday? He got paid for being pulled over because the moron police couldn't see his tags. Lol.
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CPO Leonard Orth
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This 2nd lt would lose his shit if a subordinate in uniform responded to him, like he responded to those cops.
That being said, the cops were unprofessional as the 2nd lt escalated his unprofessional, childish reaction to the police.
I hope the 2nd lt is disciplined appropriately for his misconduct.
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SFC Intelligence Analyst
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If he was being contradictory and belligerent like those cops...

Why would the LT be disciplined? He did nothing wrong.
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CPO Leonard Orth
CPO Leonard Orth
3 y
SFC (Join to see) you're entitled to your opinion.
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PO2 William McKibbon
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NO! The man should have got out of his vehicle instead of arguing with the cop!
Why not comply right away? WHY? saying WHAT DID I DO WRONG is not listening to ORDERS is it??? He should be fired from all duties for not following directions. Is this the way he would act on the front lines. "what sir?, Do you really want me to set these cannons off now? Maybe we could wait and see if the enemy STOPS coming at us." WHY all the BS. Race bate bad news. Just keep on hating one another instead of pointing out Democrat mass failures!
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CPL E4 Mafia
CPL E4 Mafia
3 y
All I can say is wtf. Are you serious? If you are gonna spout nonsense, at least have the common courtesy of spelling correctly. And even following directions can get you shot. So maybe step out of your bubble and stop licking boots. Your comments are nothing but hate and ignorance.
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CPL Jason Northedge
CPL Jason Northedge
3 y
CPL E4 Mafia amen brother! That was total non-sense! It must have been the lasers from Italy that made him write that hate spewing garbage.
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PO2 William McKibbon
PO2 William McKibbon
3 y
CPO Leonard Orth - When Joe Biden told our overseas troops that ALL og the GENRALS said: White Supremacy is the NUMBER 1 issue within the USA is so far off. Maybe Democrat take over by making up laws as they go or BLM destruction. Adam Shiff is a crook public enemy #1.
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PO2 William McKibbon
PO2 William McKibbon
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CPL E4 Mafia - When Joe Biden told our overseas troops that ALL og the GENRALS said: White Supremacy is the NUMBER 1 issue within the USA!
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PO1 Utilitiesman
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My family & I evacuated the MS Gulf Coast after Hurricane Katrina & went to stay with my parents. When we got back, it was late & there was a curfew in effect (I didn't know about the curfew). We got pulled over about 2 miles from our house. The main road we lived off of was 2 lanes, no shoulders. When I saw the bubblegums, I turned on my hazards & drove to an old business parking lot about 1/4mi away. As soon as we pulled in, I turned on the dome lights so the cops could see inside the vehicle, turned off my car, took the keys & hooked the keyring on my left hand fingers & held it outside the window. Put my right hand up on the interior roof of the car, and waited. I didn't try to get out or do anything, & I didn't play the AD svc member card.

When the officer told me to put my right hand on the top of the steering wheel. . . I put my hand on the steering wheel. When they asked for my license & registration, I told them what I was going to do (put my keys on the dash, and reach for my wallet in my front left pocket; he did ask me to open the door, which I did). I told him my wife was going to open the glove box & get the registration.

In the end, I never had a gun drawn on me, never got tazed or pepper sprayed, and the over-worked & over-stressed cops let me continue on with nothing more than, "Hey, curfew's from 2100 - 0500, just so you've been made aware. Have a good evening."

Stressful situations take two to make them less-stressful.
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CPT Richard Fematt
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I'm going to have to disagree the LT was totally out of line in his actions and behavior! As a prior Military Police Officer in the USMC i found the LT's conduct to be condescending and arrogant.. i suggest you watch Officer Tatum's video where he breaks it down as a former police officer! Tatum gives insight that would otherwise be ignored! I dont think that officer should have been fired and I hope he sues the department for wrongful termination! Lastly it was discovered that the LT had a gun hidden in his right leg, so this could have easily turned into a disaster! Traffic stops have become inherently dangerous for law enforcement so I can understand why the stop was escalated to a high risk traffic stop! I wish the LT well but if he takes that same attitude to work he will not earn the respect if his subordinates
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LTC Douglas Kelsey
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Edited 3 y ago
One action the LT should have taken before putting on his uniform was to shave off his soul patch and goatee. Big time violation of AR 670-1. And no, that's not due to a shaving profile.
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SFC Intelligence Analyst
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It definitely could be a shaving profile - and that didn't look like a soul patch and goatee but sure, that's the takeaway. Smh.
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SFC Clark Adams
SFC Clark Adams
3 y
As Black Soldier with 25 years of service as a Medic ,I demand you explain your statement of " soul patch"! I have never heard this and take your statement as a slur " sir" !!!
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LTC Douglas Kelsey
LTC Douglas Kelsey
3 y
SFC Clark Adams - You “demand” Sergeant? I don’t do too well with demands, but I will give you the Wikipedia definition verbatim. “Soul patch From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
A soul patch (also known as a mouche, a flavour saver, a jazz dot, a slipped hitler, a shizmash or a Nollsey)[1] is a single small patch of facial hair just below the lower lip and above the chin.
It came to prominence in the 1950s and 1960s, when it was a style of facial hair common among African-American men, most notably jazzmen. It became popular with beatniks, artists, and those who frequented the jazz scene and moved in literary and artistic circles. Jazz flute players who disliked the feel of the flute mouthpiece on a freshly shaven lower lip often sported the look. On the other hand, jazz trumpeters preferred the goatee for the comfort it provided when using a trumpet mouthpiece.[2] “. Notables with this facial hair are/were Dizzy Gillespie, Howie Mandel and Joey Greco. Although I’m not in the notable category, I have sported one as well. It’s unfortunate that you took it as a slur, as there was no intention to offend anyone. Thank you for this opportunity to educate you, and I hope that the LT’s chain of command educates him on AR 670-1 as that is an area where he needs some corrective action.
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SFC Clark Adams
SFC Clark Adams
3 y
LTC Douglas Kelsey yes I did demand an explanation of your use of what I take to be a racially provocative terminology. If I were and AD NCO I would call you in in both an EEO & DoD Level IG complaints possibly a letter to my Senator should your name appear on a promotion list. Since my life has spanned from the 1950s to present I am here to inform you the your phraseology is not something I have encountered in my life as a Black American citizen or Soldier. I say you need to reflect on your post and response to me, your " privilege is on full display. All said with the respect due your rank.
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CW4 Information Protection Technician
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You can agree with the firing of the Latino officer but the LT's actions for non-compliance, flagrant disrespect for the officer's commands and pushing his hands away when trying to open his door were uncalled for and I do not agree with the SMA of the Army chiming in on social media and going on CNN providing commentary on the issue. I am 30 years military, former MP and former federal agent and grew up in the hood where there were no white people. I have provided sworn statements on officer's misconduct but I tell LEOs; it is open season on cops and with body cams and phone cams, you have to be extra alert and on your Ps and Qs. It is not worth it losing your career or going to prison over a non-compliant subject. My cousin (who is half Puerto Rican and half Bahamian (and did not look white) was murdered and burned by people who were not cops or white in the South Bronx. I wish people would protest over the senseless murders of non-whites in our inner cities daily. And if we want cop encounters to go down; then do not break the law and you will live in peace in this country; no matter what your skin color.
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CW4 Information Protection Technician
CW4 (Join to see)
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SFC (Join to see) - It is open season on cops. Trust me. I was a LEO for five years. Also, a 2LT scared of the police? Give me a break. He had a weapon in his car and he did not even announce it. You follow commands, plain and simple like you do in the military. Ride the lightning implied his taser and he decreased his level of force because he holstered his weapon to go to his pepper spray. Yea, if the cop violated policy, that was the rationale for his firing but because of the climate we are in now; he got thrown under the bus. if you have not seen a soldier thrown under the bus for something that could have been handled in house; then you have not experienced the military and LEO world like I have. I seen worse in the South Bronx for lack of compliance and never saw cops lose their jobs for it. Start a cause? I was fixing tenement buildings in the South Bronx due to drug dealers selling crack. I came back on active duty after 9/11. Since you do not know my background, I suggest you keep those recommendations to yourself. If this SM was white, it would not even had made the news.
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CPL Jason Northedge
CPL Jason Northedge
3 y
Which order did he not comply with? The electric chair one? So he should have been electrocuted because those moron cops couldn't see a tag that was there and for pulling into a lit area for safety? Your cop encounter comment makes absolutely no sense. He didn't break the law and still ended up hand cuffed on the ground.
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LCpl Sidney Green
LCpl Sidney Green
3 y
CW4 (Join to see) - Are you referring to the climate that police created? They have no one to blame but themselves. If they weren't violating people's civil rights left and right, maybe the public would have more faith in them and their decisions. The police as well as the entire criminal justice system is in desperate need of a complete overhaul, and you should be at the forefront of that change. Remember, once they're done with us, they will come for you.
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CW4 Information Protection Technician
CW4 (Join to see)
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LCpl Sidney Green - I am not removing any of the onus from the police but should the individual shoulder any of blame. Name one of the suspects that were shot by the police unarmed or via excessive force that did not have a record? You do not have a concern about that and think that is a root of the problem? I grew up in the South Bronx and the violence that I saw from people killing one another; I wish the police were more aggressive because many innocent bystanders were killed or their lives up ended by street crime. I lost friends and acquaintances. Those deaths in the streets grossly outnumber what happens with a bad encounter with the police. And what civil rights? I have never seen a blatant violation of the 4th amendment in many of the cases where the media pushed a false narrative of the cop unjustly shooting a minority. If you care about police reform, then you should also care about people reform and tell people to get their acts together as well. Police reform is another means by politicians to play with your tax dollars and re-direct it to more social programs. That is the simple crux of it. Look at the faces here and not only one demographic is shot and killed by cops. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2015/jun/01/the-counted-police-killings-us-database
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MAJ Mark Bolton
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Bottom line, you MUST listen to commands given by law enforcement!! I don’t think he did (at least from what I saw in the video posted on the news). As a military retiree, I personally wouldn’t “use that card” to expect any different treatment than any other law abiding citizen. When you don’t listen yo commands given by law enforcement, you create doubt and suspicion. My 2 cents!!
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