Posted on Apr 3, 2023
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I'm commissioning active duty infantry soon and was setting up my AGSU. I was planning on using regimental collar insignia from my national guard unit that I have deployed with. I'm being told that I can't wear it because my affiliation is with a national guard unit and I'm commissioning active duty. Is this correct?
If that's the case do I remove my SSI-MOHC as well?
If that's the case do I remove my SSI-MOHC as well?
Commission
Army Regulations
Heraldry
Soldier
Posted 1 y ago
Responses: 6
You will automatically be affiliated with your first unit after six months of service. When you go to IBOLC you will wear the 2-11TH IN and the Follow Me patch. After that you will wear your Regiment right away really. I still wear my 505TH PIR as my affiliation but I don't wear 505th rifles. In all honestly I have never really see anyone have their affiliation on their ORB. So I wouldn't worry about.
Here is some professional advice. I was in the Guard. I only wear my active duty unit insignia. As soon as I go to a new unit I wear their Regiment, if I can find their RCI. As a commander I would take offense that you wouldn't wear your regiment. I have never seen anyone wear the RCI in a Regiment other then their current one. The BC Senior Rates all PLs. If he were to see that he would most likely take offense to it. Now, you can wear your SSI-MOHC. I have worn my Guard one but I have found that wearing my active duty patch placed me in better light. You should take pride in the unit you are in and represent them when you are there.
Its in AR 670-121–10. Branch insignia-other
a. Regimental collar insignia.
(1) Regimental collar insignia is the Soldier’s branch insignia on which the numerical designation of the regiment is affixed. Regimental collar insignia is worn in lieu of the branch insignia by officers and enlisted Soldiers affiliated with infantry, armor, field artillery, air defense artillery, cavalry, special forces, or aviation regiments. Soldiers affiliated with these regiments will also wear the regimental collar insignia when not assigned to the regiment, except as provided in paragraph 21 – 9A Soldier affiliated with a regiment but having a branch other than the currently assigned branch will wear the assigned branch insignia without a numeral. Soldiers will not wear numerals designating battalions on regimental collar insignia. Regimental collar insignia is provided at no cost to enlisted Soldiers. Commanders will permit enlisted Soldiers who are affiliated with the regiment to retain regimental collar insignia when reassigned from the affiliated regiment.
In AR 870-21 it states,
3–2. Combat arms affiliation policy
a. Soldiers assigned a military occupational specialty (MOS) or to a branch normally associated with the combat arms may affiliate with a numbered regiment (see para 3–1a). The choice of regiment is left up to the individual, based on current or previous regiments of assignment. Regimental affiliation may be changed at any time. However, the regimental selection must be in accordance with paragraph 3–1b.
4 AR 870–21 • 13 April 2017
(1) During their initial assignment, all combat arms Soldiers will affiliate with the regiment of their first unit of assignment. Soldiers whose initial Army assignment is not to a regimental unit may defer affiliation until they are so assigned.
(2) Soldiers may elect to affiliate with any numbered regiment they served honorably in as set forth in paragraph 3–1b regardless of their primary MOS (PMOS).
b. Soldiers will not affiliate with a regiment they have not served in.
c. Any Soldier separated from the Army for reasons of conduct or other than honorable service will have his or her name stricken from the rolls of the regiment and will no longer be considered to be affiliated.
d. No Civilian personnel may affiliate with a combat arms regiment except as provided in paragraph 2–1e.
e. Soldiers attached to or temporarily assigned to a USARS unit may not affiliate with that unit’s regiment.
f. Specific procedures for affiliation are set forth in chapter 5. These procedures permit affiliation and change of affiliation to be administered at the local level and approved by the custodian of the regiment.
Here is some professional advice. I was in the Guard. I only wear my active duty unit insignia. As soon as I go to a new unit I wear their Regiment, if I can find their RCI. As a commander I would take offense that you wouldn't wear your regiment. I have never seen anyone wear the RCI in a Regiment other then their current one. The BC Senior Rates all PLs. If he were to see that he would most likely take offense to it. Now, you can wear your SSI-MOHC. I have worn my Guard one but I have found that wearing my active duty patch placed me in better light. You should take pride in the unit you are in and represent them when you are there.
Its in AR 670-121–10. Branch insignia-other
a. Regimental collar insignia.
(1) Regimental collar insignia is the Soldier’s branch insignia on which the numerical designation of the regiment is affixed. Regimental collar insignia is worn in lieu of the branch insignia by officers and enlisted Soldiers affiliated with infantry, armor, field artillery, air defense artillery, cavalry, special forces, or aviation regiments. Soldiers affiliated with these regiments will also wear the regimental collar insignia when not assigned to the regiment, except as provided in paragraph 21 – 9A Soldier affiliated with a regiment but having a branch other than the currently assigned branch will wear the assigned branch insignia without a numeral. Soldiers will not wear numerals designating battalions on regimental collar insignia. Regimental collar insignia is provided at no cost to enlisted Soldiers. Commanders will permit enlisted Soldiers who are affiliated with the regiment to retain regimental collar insignia when reassigned from the affiliated regiment.
In AR 870-21 it states,
3–2. Combat arms affiliation policy
a. Soldiers assigned a military occupational specialty (MOS) or to a branch normally associated with the combat arms may affiliate with a numbered regiment (see para 3–1a). The choice of regiment is left up to the individual, based on current or previous regiments of assignment. Regimental affiliation may be changed at any time. However, the regimental selection must be in accordance with paragraph 3–1b.
4 AR 870–21 • 13 April 2017
(1) During their initial assignment, all combat arms Soldiers will affiliate with the regiment of their first unit of assignment. Soldiers whose initial Army assignment is not to a regimental unit may defer affiliation until they are so assigned.
(2) Soldiers may elect to affiliate with any numbered regiment they served honorably in as set forth in paragraph 3–1b regardless of their primary MOS (PMOS).
b. Soldiers will not affiliate with a regiment they have not served in.
c. Any Soldier separated from the Army for reasons of conduct or other than honorable service will have his or her name stricken from the rolls of the regiment and will no longer be considered to be affiliated.
d. No Civilian personnel may affiliate with a combat arms regiment except as provided in paragraph 2–1e.
e. Soldiers attached to or temporarily assigned to a USARS unit may not affiliate with that unit’s regiment.
f. Specific procedures for affiliation are set forth in chapter 5. These procedures permit affiliation and change of affiliation to be administered at the local level and approved by the custodian of the regiment.
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COL Randall C.
Slight correct - you are automatically affiliated with your first unit. You can affiliate with any subsequent unit after being with them for six months (if eligible).
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2LT Ray Q Regimental insignia speaks as to what unit you are assigned to. Isn’t that a simple answer?
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CPT (Join to see)
yea, but while in BOLC for my QM branch we were told NOT TO WEAR the regimental insignia because we didn't "earn it" yet. So................ as a prior NCO with a valid MOS until completion of said QM school I wore my previous one. No one said anything, but as I read 670-1 at the time, it said a soldier may way a regimental insignia they are affiliated with. So I to that to mean I could wear my old one based on my AIT graduation certificated using vocabulary saying I am "affiliated" with said MOS.
Apples and oranges here. My situation was while in TRADOC, the OP's is while he's with an actual unit and making waves and possibly sticking out among his peers.
Apples and oranges here. My situation was while in TRADOC, the OP's is while he's with an actual unit and making waves and possibly sticking out among his peers.
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Are you talking about the regimental numbers on your branch insignia? Yeah you can't wear those if you're no longer in the unit.
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COL Randall C.
Not completely accurate. Local 'unofficial' influence may make it a wiser course to affiliate with your assigned unit (which Soldiers on their second unit can do after being assigned to that unit for six months), but the regs are clear that it is the individuals choice.
However, like most things in life and the military - there is a difference between COULD and SHOULD. While he COULD wear the regimental affiliation of a former unit, he'll have to take the lay of the land to determine if he SHOULD do that.
However, like most things in life and the military - there is a difference between COULD and SHOULD. While he COULD wear the regimental affiliation of a former unit, he'll have to take the lay of the land to determine if he SHOULD do that.
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COL Vincent Stoneking
COL Randall C. -
Exactly this. I researched this very issue back in the day, when it mattered to me. There is the regs and then there are expectations. Similar to my favorite that "Officers don't wear weapons qual badges." Nope, not what the regs say AT ALL, anywhere. It's just a thing that (some) people decided.
You can have any regimental affiliation you have earned, if you have done the paperwork. It is 100% the Soldier's choice if they are entitled to two or more. It might piss off some people, but that's the same as the SSI-FWS. 100% the Soldier's choice.
For the record, I wore my weapons qual badges on A's & B's, and didn't GAF what people thought.
Also, for the record, in the about-to-be-commissioned-onto-active-duty OP's place, I would go with big Army expectations. In my case, I was a career reservist and, at worse, I would face a little shit from time to time, but I knew it was unlikely to impact my career arc.
Exactly this. I researched this very issue back in the day, when it mattered to me. There is the regs and then there are expectations. Similar to my favorite that "Officers don't wear weapons qual badges." Nope, not what the regs say AT ALL, anywhere. It's just a thing that (some) people decided.
You can have any regimental affiliation you have earned, if you have done the paperwork. It is 100% the Soldier's choice if they are entitled to two or more. It might piss off some people, but that's the same as the SSI-FWS. 100% the Soldier's choice.
For the record, I wore my weapons qual badges on A's & B's, and didn't GAF what people thought.
Also, for the record, in the about-to-be-commissioned-onto-active-duty OP's place, I would go with big Army expectations. In my case, I was a career reservist and, at worse, I would face a little shit from time to time, but I knew it was unlikely to impact my career arc.
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COL Vincent Stoneking
COL Vincent Stoneking - LOL! I see it's now MOHC since the last time I looked!
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LTC (Join to see)
Looks like I was wrong here.
AR 670-1 21-10 a.(1) makes it fairly clear that you can wear numbers that match your regimental affiliation when outside the unit.
AR 670-1 21-10 a.(1) makes it fairly clear that you can wear numbers that match your regimental affiliation when outside the unit.
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Having had it the other way around, being active duty going to reserves/Guard, I believe you'll find its the Commander's call on this.
On AD, I was assigned to 3/27 IN but the Army gave me the regimental affiliation for the 9th IN. I did a 4187 to change, at our BC's request.
When I went Army Reserve no one in my chain cared about it.
When I went Oregon Army Guard, it was TAG policy to have Oregon unit affiliation.
That became moot once I got commissioned as a MP officer.
Don't change you SSI-MOHC though. That's yours until you go to combat again.
On AD, I was assigned to 3/27 IN but the Army gave me the regimental affiliation for the 9th IN. I did a 4187 to change, at our BC's request.
When I went Army Reserve no one in my chain cared about it.
When I went Oregon Army Guard, it was TAG policy to have Oregon unit affiliation.
That became moot once I got commissioned as a MP officer.
Don't change you SSI-MOHC though. That's yours until you go to combat again.
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SGM Mikel Dawson
Interesting, I was with CoE/1/2/416/104 when it was in Pasco, Wa. Had a great time with the Timberwolves.
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Can't speak definitively about that (it's one of those mysterious inner secrets of the Combat Arms cult that the dusty historians discuss), but I've never heard of a reserve unit not being allowed if you're on active duty, as long as you've met the criteria to wear the reserve affiliation. I had it easy my entire career - I was told what my Regimental Affiliation was (the Intel schoolhouse) and that was that.
Taking a quick look on the reg regarding Regimental Affiliations*, there doesn't seem to be any prohibition crossing components of the Army.
The choice of which regiment you want to affiliate with is up to you (again, as long as you meet the criteria for affiliation). I've gone though the reg twice with a detailed look and nothing in there prohibits "cross COMPO" affiliation.
3–1. Concept
a. For the purposes of this regulation, combat arms branches are defined as Air Defense Artillery, Armor, Aviation, Cavalry, Field Artillery, Infantry, and Special Forces. Regiments serve as the basis for branch traditions and heritage. Within the combat arms branches, units consist of numbered regiments with subordinately numbered battalions or squadrons and lettered companies, troops, batteries, or numbered Special Forces groups.
b. Soldiers may affiliate with a numbered regiment after 6 months of continuously honorable service with that regiment, or less than 6 months if classified as a casualty during combat operations with that regiment.
3–2. Combat arms affiliation policy
a. Soldiers assigned a military occupational specialty (MOS) or to a branch normally associated with the combat arms may affiliate with a numbered regiment (see para 3–1a). The choice of regiment is left up to the individual, based on current or previous regiments of assignment. Regimental affiliation may be changed at any time. However, the regimental selection must be in accordance with paragraph 3–1b.
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* AR 870-21 - https://history.army.mil/html/forcestruc/docs/r870_21.pdf
Taking a quick look on the reg regarding Regimental Affiliations*, there doesn't seem to be any prohibition crossing components of the Army.
The choice of which regiment you want to affiliate with is up to you (again, as long as you meet the criteria for affiliation). I've gone though the reg twice with a detailed look and nothing in there prohibits "cross COMPO" affiliation.
3–1. Concept
a. For the purposes of this regulation, combat arms branches are defined as Air Defense Artillery, Armor, Aviation, Cavalry, Field Artillery, Infantry, and Special Forces. Regiments serve as the basis for branch traditions and heritage. Within the combat arms branches, units consist of numbered regiments with subordinately numbered battalions or squadrons and lettered companies, troops, batteries, or numbered Special Forces groups.
b. Soldiers may affiliate with a numbered regiment after 6 months of continuously honorable service with that regiment, or less than 6 months if classified as a casualty during combat operations with that regiment.
3–2. Combat arms affiliation policy
a. Soldiers assigned a military occupational specialty (MOS) or to a branch normally associated with the combat arms may affiliate with a numbered regiment (see para 3–1a). The choice of regiment is left up to the individual, based on current or previous regiments of assignment. Regimental affiliation may be changed at any time. However, the regimental selection must be in accordance with paragraph 3–1b.
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* AR 870-21 - https://history.army.mil/html/forcestruc/docs/r870_21.pdf
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SP5 Peter Keane
COL Randall C. - af·fil·i·at·ed
adjective
(of a subsidiary group or a person) officially attached or connected to an organization.
adjective
(of a subsidiary group or a person) officially attached or connected to an organization.
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SP5 Peter Keane
SP5 Peter Keane - He commissions active duty, assigned lets ay to the 14th Inf Regiment. He damn sure is no longer affiliated with the (as example) 69th Inf Reg. and as such would not wear crossed rifles with a 69 on top of them.
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COL Randall C.
SP5 Peter Keane - I understand what you're saying, but I don't agree. Neither current regulations (AR 870-21) nor any policies I found prohibit cross-COMPO wearing of regimental affiliation.
Per reg - "The choice of regiment is left up to the individual, based on current or previous regiments of assignment." - So yes, he COULD affiliate with a previous regiment of assignment.
Again, could you cite anything official (or even unofficial if it has enough weight to it) that supports your comment?
As I said above under LTC Miller's comment, "However, like most things in life and the military - there is a difference between COULD and SHOULD. While he COULD wear the regimental affiliation of a former unit, he'll have to take the lay of the land to determine if he SHOULD do that."
Per reg - "The choice of regiment is left up to the individual, based on current or previous regiments of assignment." - So yes, he COULD affiliate with a previous regiment of assignment.
Again, could you cite anything official (or even unofficial if it has enough weight to it) that supports your comment?
As I said above under LTC Miller's comment, "However, like most things in life and the military - there is a difference between COULD and SHOULD. While he COULD wear the regimental affiliation of a former unit, he'll have to take the lay of the land to determine if he SHOULD do that."
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Your SSI-MOHC is a permanent award.
Your regimental affiliation is your regimental affiliation until you do paperwork for a new regimental affiliation.
You are commissioning IN, which does not come with a de facto regimental affiliation like some branches, so it does not change until you qualify for a new one (six months assigned or a deployment, if memory serves) and submit the 4187.
Your regimental affiliation is your regimental affiliation until you do paperwork for a new regimental affiliation.
You are commissioning IN, which does not come with a de facto regimental affiliation like some branches, so it does not change until you qualify for a new one (six months assigned or a deployment, if memory serves) and submit the 4187.
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