Posted on Dec 15, 2015
What's your opinion when a National Guard soldier or reservist wears an active duty unit patch because they were attached ?
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Combat Patch (SSI-FWTS)
Army National Guard
Combat Patch (SSI-FWTS) Army National Guard
Posted 10 y ago
Responses: 48
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Who cares honestly. I was stuck during different points in the Stan wearing the 33rd from Illinois, 48th from Georgia, and the 69th NY. So if they're authorized to wear an AD unit patch, let em. No different when a RA Soldier is authorized to wear theirs. In the Stan when your BSO changes every four months and they want you to wear their patch, you don't complain, it's just a patch. I'm allowed to wear eight patches from being on an ETT. If I want I rotate them, but keep the Red BRO in my pocket always.
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You only leave to responses, but I don't feel that is adequate. If the individual is augmenting an empty slot in an RA unit, does the tour with the unit, then why not? If for example you are in an NG, briefly attached to High Speed cool patch wearing unit for all of a few days to months and don't have much to do wit them then IMHO no (my unit briefly fell under the 3rd ID and the 101st for a short time at the end of our tour, some soldiers took that to mean they could wear those patches, I did not concur with their assessment of the situation). Now if you are below a BN size element and have to wear the patch of the unit your are supporting then, suck it up because they are authorized it.
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CW3 Kevin Storm
As I read this thread , I realize a few of you are not up to date with where AR 670-1 Paragraph 21-17 d 4:
(4) Soldiers of all Army components (Active, ARNG, and USAR) who deploy during periods of service designated
for wear of the SSI-FWTS are authorized to wear a SSI-FWTS. There are no time-in-theater requirements for
authorization to wear the SSI-FWTS. Soldiers may not earn more than one SSI-FWTS during the same deployment.
(a) A deployed unit (company or higher) will wear its unit SSI as the SSI-FWTS, regardless of the headquarters
element deploying and the unit alignment or OPCON during the period of deployment.
(b) A deployed unit will not wear its assigned SSI as its SSI-FWTS when the SSI belongs to a major command,
such as an ACOM/ASCC/DRU or State Area Command, or a non-deployable unit. In such cases, the unit will wear the
SSI of the lowest echelon Army unit (company or higher) in the deployed chain of command as the SSI-FWTS. When
there is no intermediate unit (company or higher) in the deployed chain of command, these deployed Soldiers will wear
the SSI of the senior command in the theater as its SSI-FWTS.
(c) When echelons below company level (such as teams or squads) deploy, members of these units will wear the
SSI of the lowest echelon deployed Army unit (company or higher) in the deployed chain of command (based on
AR 670–1 • 10 April 2015 33
written orders) as the SSI-FWTS. When there is no intermediate unit (company or higher) in the deployed chain of
command, these deployed Soldiers will wear the SSI of the senior command in the theater as its SSI-FWTS.
(d) Individual Soldiers who are attached (to include OPCON, cross-leveled, assigned, or augmenting deployed units)
will wear the same SSI-FWTS worn by members of the deployed Army unit (company or higher) to which attached by
written orders. A Soldier who is further attached (to one or more units) during one deployment will only wear the SSIFWTS
for the first Army unit (company or higher) to which attached by written orders. Soldiers who deploy with their
unit (company level or higher) will wear the SSI-FWTS as outlined in paragraph 21–17a(7)(a), regardless how many
times they are further attached to other units as individuals or teams. Members of trial defense will wear the SSI of
their respective commands as their SSI-FWTS.
(4) Soldiers of all Army components (Active, ARNG, and USAR) who deploy during periods of service designated
for wear of the SSI-FWTS are authorized to wear a SSI-FWTS. There are no time-in-theater requirements for
authorization to wear the SSI-FWTS. Soldiers may not earn more than one SSI-FWTS during the same deployment.
(a) A deployed unit (company or higher) will wear its unit SSI as the SSI-FWTS, regardless of the headquarters
element deploying and the unit alignment or OPCON during the period of deployment.
(b) A deployed unit will not wear its assigned SSI as its SSI-FWTS when the SSI belongs to a major command,
such as an ACOM/ASCC/DRU or State Area Command, or a non-deployable unit. In such cases, the unit will wear the
SSI of the lowest echelon Army unit (company or higher) in the deployed chain of command as the SSI-FWTS. When
there is no intermediate unit (company or higher) in the deployed chain of command, these deployed Soldiers will wear
the SSI of the senior command in the theater as its SSI-FWTS.
(c) When echelons below company level (such as teams or squads) deploy, members of these units will wear the
SSI of the lowest echelon deployed Army unit (company or higher) in the deployed chain of command (based on
AR 670–1 • 10 April 2015 33
written orders) as the SSI-FWTS. When there is no intermediate unit (company or higher) in the deployed chain of
command, these deployed Soldiers will wear the SSI of the senior command in the theater as its SSI-FWTS.
(d) Individual Soldiers who are attached (to include OPCON, cross-leveled, assigned, or augmenting deployed units)
will wear the same SSI-FWTS worn by members of the deployed Army unit (company or higher) to which attached by
written orders. A Soldier who is further attached (to one or more units) during one deployment will only wear the SSIFWTS
for the first Army unit (company or higher) to which attached by written orders. Soldiers who deploy with their
unit (company level or higher) will wear the SSI-FWTS as outlined in paragraph 21–17a(7)(a), regardless how many
times they are further attached to other units as individuals or teams. Members of trial defense will wear the SSI of
their respective commands as their SSI-FWTS.
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Because it is authorized, it really does not matter how I feel. But, if it was up to me, any company or larger unit, that deploys, should where the patch they have on their left shoulder. I see a lot where the NG / Reserve will opt for the AD patch over their own. Some of the reasons I have heard are;
1. It looks better
2. Division has a better storied history that ours.
3. Makes me look like I have served with the Division.
Now, I deployed only on AD so I really do not know the true reason for wanting to wear the AD patch. Now over my deployments my small detachments have be assigned to various units. I am authorized the 101st, 82nd, 10th MTN, 25th ID, CENTCOM and FORSCOM. I did periodically switch between patches, mostly just to mess with people. I would start the day with one patch and may switch the patch throughout the day. It was fun getting the double takes from people who would see me more than once a day.
1. It looks better
2. Division has a better storied history that ours.
3. Makes me look like I have served with the Division.
Now, I deployed only on AD so I really do not know the true reason for wanting to wear the AD patch. Now over my deployments my small detachments have be assigned to various units. I am authorized the 101st, 82nd, 10th MTN, 25th ID, CENTCOM and FORSCOM. I did periodically switch between patches, mostly just to mess with people. I would start the day with one patch and may switch the patch throughout the day. It was fun getting the double takes from people who would see me more than once a day.
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I think its fine if its authorized. its funny you never see a guardsman wearing his own unit patch though
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MAJ Ronnie Reams
Here in NC I see many 30th Inf Bde (SEP) folks wear the Old Hickory on both shoulders.
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I am a retired army reservist. I was in Balad in 2004 and was attached to the 31st CSH and later that summer I was in Baqubah and I was attached to the 629th FST. Both assignments had me supporting the 1st Infantry Division. I have been authorized to wear the First ID patch and I do. If anyone thinks that I haven't earned the right to wear the patch you can kiss my ass. Frankly, it's an insult to suggest that my service or that of anyone is somehow worth less or diminished in any way because I was a Reservist when I was tapped to go.
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Every deployment I went on, we had Reservists attached to us. Couldn't have done it without them. Gives me pride to know they were proud to be a part of our team and draw blood with us. Patch up Boys and Girls.
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I think it's fine. When you see some odd NG patch and one you recognize or served with on the right its a good way to start up a conversation.
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This is something that varies wildly. I am not a fan of wearing a patch of a unit that you were attached too. If you have a MACOM, or Major Command, with you then you should wear that. The combat patch game is like pokemon now a days. It is not a collection to show off. So many soldiers, not just in the Guard, just want to be affiliated with a well known unit. If you become a part of that unit then that is fine but if you are with a BCT and you just want the patch for the Div you answer too then no.
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COL Jon Thompson
I volunteered to deploy as an individual augmented working as a Human Terrain Team leader with 3/82 in Baghdad. I wear the 82ABN CSIB proudly even though I was only attached and was never stationed at Bragg.
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CPT (Join to see)
COL Jon Thompson - In a case like that I would agree that you should wear it. But if you went with a whole battalion I don't think it would be the same.
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CPT (Join to see)
SPC Rick Barnes - I am not sure if you and I are on the same page. Now DIV commands can deploy to a region as the command element with no organic subordinate commands. The BCTs under them will be from various other units. In his case the BCTs will not get the DIV command that they fall under as a combat patch. It happened to us. We had the 1st CAV in Baghdad. I was with the 30th ABCT. We also had a BCT from the 82nd there. The new policy is that you get the patch from you organic command. The only time you get a patch from you are attached to is when you are attached as an company.
"Entire formations of soldiers are rarely deployed to the same command structure. For example, a battalion from a separate support brigade may be attached to a Brigade Combat Team during on deployment, which, in turn, would be attached to a different division headquarters. It is a misconception that in that deployment, soldiers in the battalion could earn three patches at once; the patch of their regular headquarters (the separate brigade), the patch of the Brigade Combat Team that they were attached to, and the patch of the Division that the Brigade Combat Team was attached to. In actuality the regulation states that soldiers will wear the shoulder sleeve insignia of former wartime service of the lowest deployed echelon authorized its own distinctive SSI, which applies to divisions, separate brigades, and a handful of battalions. After March 27, 2007 the policy was changed to allow units of company level and higher to wear the SSI of their regular headquarters as a combat patch. This policy change also means that units above company level no longer receive multiple combat patches for single deployments, in turn simplifying what combat patch soldiers are actually entitled to wear."
"Entire formations of soldiers are rarely deployed to the same command structure. For example, a battalion from a separate support brigade may be attached to a Brigade Combat Team during on deployment, which, in turn, would be attached to a different division headquarters. It is a misconception that in that deployment, soldiers in the battalion could earn three patches at once; the patch of their regular headquarters (the separate brigade), the patch of the Brigade Combat Team that they were attached to, and the patch of the Division that the Brigade Combat Team was attached to. In actuality the regulation states that soldiers will wear the shoulder sleeve insignia of former wartime service of the lowest deployed echelon authorized its own distinctive SSI, which applies to divisions, separate brigades, and a handful of battalions. After March 27, 2007 the policy was changed to allow units of company level and higher to wear the SSI of their regular headquarters as a combat patch. This policy change also means that units above company level no longer receive multiple combat patches for single deployments, in turn simplifying what combat patch soldiers are actually entitled to wear."
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Last week I saw a active duty Maj wearing the 45th Infantry patch. I asked him about it and he said he had been attached to them in Iraq and was authorized to wear it. As long as they're authorized to wear it I don't see a problem.
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CPT (Join to see)
The Army had to change the policy on this due to people just collecting combat patches like playing cards. He might have got it under the old rules but I don't think it would have applied under the new rules.
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