Posted on Dec 16, 2021
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American Legion and VFW posts are losing members and not getting new ones. I had this discussion with several leaders in both organizations. Older members are dying and new members are not joiners. The older members are often not welcoming either. I think making them family oriented and getting more involved in their community events might cause them to gain more relevance and awareness. This change should increase and gain more members. Thoughts?
The American Legion
Veterans of Foreign Wars (VFW)
Family
Posted 4 y ago
Responses: 568
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If there was a mission, maybe a Search and Rescue volunteer group or Emergency Service support group. I am not interested in drinking cheap whiskey and reminiscing about combat and playing the one-up games. Even Disabled Vets can perform C2 functions and logistics support. Those of us who are able can hit the hills looking for lost hikers or putting down sand bags with a skill set that is well suited for crisis response. Serve our community when in its greatest hour of need... just my two cents.
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SGT C Reed
I'm former army, but hoped to find something like what you mentioned in the Civil Air Patrol with my (then teen) daughter who loves flying. But various wings are not much better than a lot of these AL groups. All my daughter's group did was put kids in old uniforms and teach them to march and yell at each other (no oversight, it was allowed to be 'Lord of the Flies' feral, and the input of 'new' parent leaders was ignored when we suggested mentoring) The old members sat around talking and often prevented new parent leaders from getting truly involved. There was a lot of lecturing and too much religion too. (totally inappropriate place for it) The new folk with our squadron had a lot of good ideas for advancing and organizing and working with local resources (like for first aid training, etc), but there was no way around the ones in charge to implement desperately needed changes. I mean, we had to fight tooth and nail just to use virtual training during covid and/or try to implement actual STEM training for the youth that could help prepare them for careers, military, or to assist in volunteer ops (which is the mission of CAP!). Every meeting was about uniforms and yelling, no leadership training, no record keeping, no leadership mentoring.
My daughter and I managed to get involved in some activities, often independently, but it was honestly a huge waste of time. My kid didn't even get her promised flying-glider time in because it was so unorganized and the 'older white xtian guy' in charge (who was sweet as anything but not organized or a leader) often overlooked and ignored the input of qualified veterans/parents of color or females. He wanted to treat the squadron like a church social club for boys where girls were an afterthought. Good for church, I guess, but not CAP.
Saying that, there are really good CAP groups out there, especially when someone like you is interested in "Search and Rescue volunteer group or Emergency Service support group" You just have to do your research and be willing to move from one squadron to a better one (trying to fix a 'broken' one is like this whole AL mess, an exercise in frustration and futility). It's not just about training youth. The organized groups provide meaningful assistance and volunteering.
My daughter and I managed to get involved in some activities, often independently, but it was honestly a huge waste of time. My kid didn't even get her promised flying-glider time in because it was so unorganized and the 'older white xtian guy' in charge (who was sweet as anything but not organized or a leader) often overlooked and ignored the input of qualified veterans/parents of color or females. He wanted to treat the squadron like a church social club for boys where girls were an afterthought. Good for church, I guess, but not CAP.
Saying that, there are really good CAP groups out there, especially when someone like you is interested in "Search and Rescue volunteer group or Emergency Service support group" You just have to do your research and be willing to move from one squadron to a better one (trying to fix a 'broken' one is like this whole AL mess, an exercise in frustration and futility). It's not just about training youth. The organized groups provide meaningful assistance and volunteering.
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I am a Combat wounded disabled Viet Nam vet. My experience was quite good with Vet groups after return. I did however see a large part of the older vets were non-combat vets and if they put out "bad vibes" they should be ashamed of themselves. No excuse after the treatment of Nam vets when returning. If Nam vets are treating OIF/OEF vets badly, they need their asses kicked.
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When I ETS'd, I was told I wasn't eligible for either. Not my fault I was able to serve in a quiet time (78-82) and didn't see war. I understand they've changed the requirements now, probably because of the declining membership mentioned in the original post, but it's too late for me. I did go on later to spend 3 years in the Berlin Brigade, which I understand might qualify for VFW membership, but again, why bother? So I guess the original question still stands - what can these organizations do to make me interested in joining? I'm not interested in cheap beer and smoky games of pool, so what appeal do they have to me?
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I would echo both Maj Bob Hoover and MSgt Steve Holt's comments. In addition there was a comment about "Foreign Wars" as being germane. Unless you fought in the Civil, Revelutionary, or Indian wars, all the others were foreign. If you never deployed to a foreign country, your service in the US supported a foreign action. If you are wearing a National Defense Medal, you are qualified.
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I'm Vietnam era Navy, retired AF. When I first looked at the American Legion they seemed more concerned about treatment of the American flag than dealing with veterans with internal gonads. I understand our local VFW is female friendly.
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I'm not interested in drinking abd breathing in second hand smoke. I don't think these organizations are for me.
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SFC Dave Garcia
There are many options and places that aren't just a bar. Look them up in your area. Try out some different places.
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I retired in 1996 after 24 years in the Air Force. Looked into joining the VFW. But because I never set foot in VietNam. Just Thailand. I want worthy of membership. I said screw you guys. Took myself and my wife (also an Air Force Vet) and my money and time and went on to volunteer in other organizations. Now they are begging for members, I wouldn't join if they rolled out a red carpet, and offered free beer. They are dying because of their attitude and hateful ways of dealing with the vets that didn't actually serve in Nam.
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As Veitnam vet we went through the same crap with the WW II crowd. We we the losers, first US War loss. I took crap from guys who said they wouldn't fire their weapons cause they didn't want to clean them...seriously, and they joked about it. I fired thousands out of my 60 and I'm a loser? I stayed away for many years and finally join the Legion. Was better the second time..Too bad we have to treat each other like crap.
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I'm a life member of the VFW and am very disappointed with the way fellow veterans are treated by the post members. Each Post has it's clicks. One I belonged to was If you're Air Force you fit in but you had to be Officer, Aircrew, or senior enlisted. One other post was Only Vietnam Vets were OK. Another was WWII vets and it's changed now to Vietnam only. I don't know about American Legion, but it's probably the same. How to fix this? Sorry but there will always be clicks, groups of folks who are closed to any outside influence. My Father a WWII combat medic joined the VFW late in life and found a closed group who shunned him because he was Army not Army Air Force. I wish I knew a way to welcome any and all veterans to the VFW but sadly there will always be clicks. I am not an active member of any post now because of the closed mindedness.
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I'm think the solution is to combine all veterans organizations into one veterans organization. Membership should be open to everyone who served in the military.
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Maj Gail Lofdahl
No thanks. The VFW can be much more hostile; the American Legion is much more welcoming. Give us female vets SOMEWHERE we can go that won't give us the "bum's rush."
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