Posted on Apr 27, 2016
What would you do if your CSM was ignoring uniform and grooming standards? (CSM Flournoy)
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So this CSM from the the 8th MP BDE seems to be out of regulations. From the comments she has been corrected but she claims she is being harassed. I don't even understand how she got to be a CSM at a BDE. What COL out there is letting this happen? In one of the photos she is wearing stilettos in uniform. WTF? What kind of example is this. The worst is from a Facebook user that said:
"This one!!!! Holy **** she was in charge of us in Afghanistan!! I could go on and on about this toxic leader!! Trying to maintain professionalism but this one.....when a CSM so jacked up like this, she was laughing her ass off during our rehearsal of my brothers ceremony after he was killed in Afghanistan, she f***ing yelled at me because I "took too long saying my goodbye " as I'm f***ing crying kneeling in front of it. This post will probably get me in trouble, and ruin the rest of my army career as well as my day and my army experience."
What would you do if you were there? What if you were on command?
What should the Army do about this?
(Thanks to Army MP WTF Moments and it's followers for the photos.)
**************UPDATE************************
The 8th Theater Sustainment Command CSM will be travelling to the 8th MP BDE to have some one on one time with this CSM. It is amazing as leaders will do when they are being called out. He should have done that a long time ago.
"This one!!!! Holy **** she was in charge of us in Afghanistan!! I could go on and on about this toxic leader!! Trying to maintain professionalism but this one.....when a CSM so jacked up like this, she was laughing her ass off during our rehearsal of my brothers ceremony after he was killed in Afghanistan, she f***ing yelled at me because I "took too long saying my goodbye " as I'm f***ing crying kneeling in front of it. This post will probably get me in trouble, and ruin the rest of my army career as well as my day and my army experience."
What would you do if you were there? What if you were on command?
What should the Army do about this?
(Thanks to Army MP WTF Moments and it's followers for the photos.)
**************UPDATE************************
The 8th Theater Sustainment Command CSM will be travelling to the 8th MP BDE to have some one on one time with this CSM. It is amazing as leaders will do when they are being called out. He should have done that a long time ago.
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CSM
Grooming Standards
CSM Grooming Standards
Edited >1 y ago
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Responses: 918
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Her bun is a bit low past the bottom edge of the collar. A bit. Not enough to discredit this CSM who obviously has held enough potential demonstrated enough competence to the same people that ---GASP---- promoted many of you commenting.
The BN CDR that ranger rolls the living shit out of his PC......the Jumpmaster not on jump status that can't let it go and has to be the 2nd eyelet bloused cool guy, The S3 that thinks he's an operator every field problem or the Chaplain that outgrew his ACUs 30 lbs ago..........
Why aren't pics of them viral?
Exxxxxactly. Everybody gets into a whirlwind of ridiculousness over this CSM..but why?
It's bc she is a female. She doesn't fit the preconceived image of what people think a CSM "should look like"......and I think the level of scrutiny doesn't fit the non crime.
The BN CDR that ranger rolls the living shit out of his PC......the Jumpmaster not on jump status that can't let it go and has to be the 2nd eyelet bloused cool guy, The S3 that thinks he's an operator every field problem or the Chaplain that outgrew his ACUs 30 lbs ago..........
Why aren't pics of them viral?
Exxxxxactly. Everybody gets into a whirlwind of ridiculousness over this CSM..but why?
It's bc she is a female. She doesn't fit the preconceived image of what people think a CSM "should look like"......and I think the level of scrutiny doesn't fit the non crime.
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SFC Clark Adams
CPT (Join to see) - is her orange or red hair color IAW 670-1? No. The issue is her LONG history of actions that defy compliance coupled with her "attitude" in many assignments and positions and WHY it has been tolerated?
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SFC (Join to see)
CPT (Join to see) - Sir, exactly what is out of tolerance of the reg for the wear of the beret?
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CPT (Join to see)
Her hair orange/red hair color is absolutely natural SFC Clark! The regulation clearly outlines the definition of unnatural. Her "attitude" may possibly be the response to soldiers and NCOs..... Who have a paradigmatic view of the regulation, but do not actually read or analyze it. It's been tolerated because in most instances, she probably hasn't actually been wrong, soldiers just thought she was....... That is the ENTIRE issue with this.
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CPT (Join to see)
SFC (Join to see) - The beret is worn so that the binding is straight accross the forehead, and 1 inch above the eyebrows.
.......the regulation is 300+ pages. I have enough confidence is Army, that the special operations CSM in the photo is still the most qualified for the position, is extremely confident and a great leader, albeit 1 uniform flaw in a rather lengthy manual.
How many folks do you think running around correcting him about it?
.......the regulation is 300+ pages. I have enough confidence is Army, that the special operations CSM in the photo is still the most qualified for the position, is extremely confident and a great leader, albeit 1 uniform flaw in a rather lengthy manual.
How many folks do you think running around correcting him about it?
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Why post something like this, why not ask to speak to her and explain your concern or if fear of reprisal ask a Leader to speak to her. Does putting her picture up solve the problem? This did not happen over night, it is happening because she was able to get away with not being incompliance with regulations throughout her career. If you walk by a person in the wrong and not correct them than you just created a new standard.
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LTC (Join to see)
people have been trying to talk to her for at least 11 years. She blows them off or goes into a tirade. Complaining to her superiors didn't help because, for whatever reason, they always had her back and YOU were the problem, not her....
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This was her same standard in 2011 when she was the BN CSM. Her motto is do as i say not as I do. Thats just great CSM
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Should not post stuff like this is social media. Makes the military look bad.
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Huh, back in the olden days toxic leaders like this got fragged in the latrine...
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I'm sure she si just using the hair to hide her gang related tattoo's...lets see this rumor light fire...lol
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Ok, great, so yet again public opinion gets to rule on NCO business. But, now let's look at this constructively. How many anonymous 670 dash heroes weighed in to smash this CSM, an arguably rightfully so; but how many NCOs are doing the business of weighing in on their uniform correctons on their own lawns, pavement, motorpools, and offices with their own Soldiers? Uniform corrections are two parts useful; one discipline: both the humility to receive it and the courage to give it, two reinforcing attention to detail: to cultivate situational awareness and precision/ excellence in all acts. Does lambasting this senior NCO do your unit any good, or the Army at large? This public slaying diminishes our own ranks and self respect, even if ever so slightly. Sergeants, are some of you are guilty in admonshing this CSM because it's easy to do, in your Facebook feed? Now dig deep, and let's all learn a lesson here. Are we really working the edges on this in our own units? Let's use rally point for something other than a bitch fest; take this into work with you (if you already don't) and fight to make the Army better. This, this shit is embarrassing for so many other reasons then a shitty hair cut and a toxic command climate; don't be so blameless. Upon objective examination and command scrutiny many of you would fall pray to this sort of nastiness. It's shameful. Now get back to work and clean up your own messes.
Wake up, Ruck up, Do work.
Wake up, Ruck up, Do work.
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SPC Lynise Webb
I bet there are a whole bunch of pretty memes floating around now, just waiting to be hung up in command hallways with a caption something along the lines of "Don't be that guy". So yeah, it might do the unit some good. I bet it gets brought up in at least a few formations.
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SSG Ray Strenkowski
CSM (Join to see) - While that was very inspiring, The comments I'm reading here and other places seem to point to the fact that Soldiers and NCO's (and possibly officers) have attempted to correct this NCO in the past. Obviously without any measure of success.
I agree with you wholeheartedly that this is embarrassing. Embarrassing to the Army, to her CoC, to her Soldiers and even us veterans who lived to the standard and did not avoid it.
I'm having trouble accepting that this should not have been put on social media. Especially If this NCO has been setting such a poor standard for a long time. In this case it seems to be the only way to hold her to the standard she is supposed to be living up to.
Additionally, many of us are Veterans or Retired and it's our prerogative to post whatever we like as long as we are respectful.
I agree with you wholeheartedly that this is embarrassing. Embarrassing to the Army, to her CoC, to her Soldiers and even us veterans who lived to the standard and did not avoid it.
I'm having trouble accepting that this should not have been put on social media. Especially If this NCO has been setting such a poor standard for a long time. In this case it seems to be the only way to hold her to the standard she is supposed to be living up to.
Additionally, many of us are Veterans or Retired and it's our prerogative to post whatever we like as long as we are respectful.
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Cpl Gabriel F.
Very political correct. Your political and corporate manners have you running in the club very nicely. What you conveniently left out is this slug brought this down on her own unwashed non regulation head. Disrespecting the fallen, her ill gotten rank, the rank and file that must put up with anything she comes up with and disrespecting all those that have gone before.
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The Army Reserves around my are was bad for that. I can recall most of the females thinking it was a beauty contest. I took several was chewing for correcting hair color, bright assed red is not natural except on a baboons butt., and nails being at least 3 inches long. The culprits continue, yet I was the bad guy.
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There is no way I could ignore such a blatant disregard for standards as this CSM Flournoy is demonstrating. If you see someone out of uniform and you do nothing to correct it you are just as guilty of the infraction as the offending soldier is. I would ask her to move someplace semi-private and I would tell her that what I am seeing is wrong. I would inform her that as a former drill sergeant she knows the regs and had better correct these issues and give her sufficient time to act and make corrections. An hour ought to do it! If she didn't comply I would be talking to my chain of command and ask that they take care of it. If that didn't work I would go higher until I found someone with enough guts to do what is right. I hope the 8th Theatre Sustainment CSM has a clippers with him. That monkey hanging onto the back of her cover has got to go!
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