When it comes to starting a new career in the Federal Government, how does Veterans Preference work?

Very sad. At least I am not alone in this. Same culture at the VA in Puerto Rico. Is not what you know but who you know. Brothers, couples, son and daughters, etc.. It is a shame. The only job applicable for service disable is housekeeping and laundry workers.

And I thought I was the only one seeing this. It's rampant thought out the system and even more in places like the VA in Manila Philippines. I have so many stories about that place but no one to tell because they are ALL non-US citizens working there. and will NEVER hire a US Citizen there. But no VA will hire a Vet. Veterans will want to correct things and that is not want VA Leadership wants. The systems are so antiquated, the people that want to do good, can't and the people who don't care, can continue because none of the process nor systems talk to each other.. So, they just laterally sleep on the job without fear...

MSG Mike Booher - You are correct about the VA. I actually got into the VA after several attempts. At first it was great, the Supervisor loved my work ethics and was amazed at how fast I picked up the jargon, regulations, and laws. But once I started questioning processes and why things were done and showed them how they could be much better, things went down hill fast. Lost favor with them and became isolated pretty much. No longer the "Golden Child". So your statement is absolutely correct. I was passed over several times in that office for promotion by folks who had no experience being a supervisor and their work ethics were horrible. Yet they got promoted before me. I kept pushing my numbers and doing my job. They tried to railroad me out but couldn't. Gave me extra work, did it with a smile, and gave it back completed early. Finally, I applied for a position in Washington DC and by the grace of God, I was selected for the position. I moved and never looked back. The new position was a two grade promotion. I retired after 2 1/2 years in my new position. I do feel that I made a difference for thousands of Veterans and their families that I was able to counsel during my time working there. So that made everything worth putting up with the poor management. If only, they would have listened, the process could have been so much better. Sorry for the rant but this was about the Vet Preference. It sucks. The Agencies do not adhere to the policy of hiring Veterans. They hire who they want. If you know somebody, you get in. If you don't, good luck. The rules for Vet Preference are not enforced just like rules for buying weapons or anything else the Government is in charge of. No accountability.

SPC Jose Negron - Unfortunately it isn't just the federal government that hires relatives over qualified people. I am a certified highly qualified mathematics teacher (grades 7 - 12) and I got bumped for a relative because I didn't have tenure at that school district at the time. I feel you angish.

Hi Anna , are we related - CARL in the APPLE

Sgt (Join to see) - My father was an only child and his father died young. Unless you can trace back to either Austin or Burton Larson from Iowa, (My grandfather's two brothers), then we probably aren't related. Austin's last known residence was in St Paul MN when he died in 1969, and I have no clue where Burton ended up after WWI. All three served in WWI.
Their father was Lewis Larson and their mother was Anna. Both parents and all four kids including their sister Tilda were all born in Norway per Census records from 1910.

I don't care I want to be friends - OK

And may I add , not very well at all.

Yeah, tell me about it; and if you're in a place already saturated with vets, your chances are very slim. As Justin said, a lot of the times, esp. on AF bases, folks get screwed on the buddy buddy system. My husband almost didn't get the job he has now because the AFPC hired him, and not whomever was doing the hiring in the squadron he was to go to. The folks in his work center wanted a 'friend' of theirs to get the GS-7 position that was open, but he had the MBA and the experience to beat our 'their choice'. She ended up joining about two years later, but I'm sure she was a little salty for awhile at first!

SSgt Tamita Kea - Good comment , made me happy when you said 'SALTY'. So now I say Salty when their standing , Salty when the fall - Ha-Ha. It's an inside JOKE , for Marines , by , by.

I have experienced and witnessed this firsthand. 30 years of applying for Federal jobs with only one interview. Despite using all of the key words by revising my resume to include every KSA in the announcement, meeting or exceeding the selection criteria on education, skills or experience and having 15 point preference, nothing. After speaking to a Federal EEO rep I was informed of the following:
1. Hiring managers will receive the top 3 candidates but can return these without action and seek the next 3 candidates at any time.
2. Veteran's preference points don't apply to O-4 and above. So, don't bother.
3. Claiming Veteran's preference labels you within the selection process as a potential 'protected' employee. Since most managers are 'unprotected' they prefer to remain safe by not hiring those who will get laid-off after they do, as a result of protected status.
4. The friends and family process is alive and well in the federal government
5. Complaining gets you nowhere
6. If you are lucky enough to find a way in, there is a good chance you will never get promoted while others pass you by. Thereby getting discouraged enough to leaving your job and giving the manager an opportunity to say that veterans tend not to stay long because of 'fit.'
7. Usually, the ideal candidate for a government job (local, state and federal) is a minority woman with a handicap and children on welfare or government assistance. Being a service connected special disabled veteran, non-minority (Caucasian) with a college degree (GI Bill) and a family depending often has a less than optimal chance of finding a government job.

So, I took my skills elsewhere, where I was wanted, made more money and put up with less or equal amount of BS. We get the government special interests are willing to pay for and it tends not to be the government that meets our needs.

Perhaps you should learn English grammar and punctuation. That might help. The poor spelling and grammar of your response cause me to wonder if indeed you are or were a commissioned officer.

if there is a union that represents you go to them ,another option is to go to your post's EEO, you'll have to bring proof to back your statements.

If you are still active duty you don't get the veterans preference. You have to be retired first and have the documentation.

With internal job postings a lot of agencies do not recognize veterans preference because you are already in. Sometimes you can get around that by posting "externally" and claiming veterans preference. It was allowed at the agency I worked for, but I got tired of the politics and left the govt.

There is no veterans' preference for internal job announcements. http://www.federaljobs.net/veterans.htm

Resumes/applications need to be EXTREMELY detailed. You won't get a foot in the door with a bare bones basic resume. My resume for federal service was over 3 pages long. My resume for everything else was only a page long. You gain your points from the resume. The points determine if you get an interview. If you've actually gotten a few interviews, then your resume is good, but if you haven't even gotten an interview then you need to beef that resume up. Numbers, statistics, etc.

I did that - taking the job description and pretty much making it my resume, with the guideline provided by the Federal Government Resume workshop on Camp Pendleton, before I left, including hours worked, separate titles, per position, and annual salary - with numbers and statistics. Not 3 pages long, but long enough (1.5 in my case, and no I won't share it). What am I supposed to think after I was told by a few GS employees (in my general area), that it's ran on a "who you know" basis?

BG Tador your either a moron,clueless or spreading propaganda... Your response a sick and twisted bureaucratic joke. I was a reservists on active duty and watched the career bureaucrat civil service rig the system for family, friends and others within the civil service system when it comes to hiring.........Veterans preference points. disability points, etc. doesn't get you diddly squat.........When it comes to the key words or buzz words those can be kept secret most of the time.........only disclosed to the insiders (family, friends and others within the civil service system) applying for the job.......... The bureaucrats can write the hiring announcement so that family, friends and others within the civil service system fall under the umbrella of the eligibility. But wont a veteran who's qualified get hired over this non-veteran? No.The bureaucrats can tailor the announcement to exclude veterans by putting down unnecessary experience required that only family, friends and others within the civil service system has or even just select them as a direct hire. So then then the inbred bureaucrat doesn't want to look like they or get caught direct hiring friends family etc., what should one sick and twisted bureaucrat do? To Cover Your Ass as a hiring official you have to make a "show" of looking for the best qualified so you must legally post the announcement. That's why you will see some jobs only open for a couple of days. Also, lets dog and pony the hiring sequence by even interviewing some applicants, just to throw them a bone. (Now I would consider this illegal and intentional fraud in the hiring process by dragging people into interviews wasting their time when you know you are not going to hire them). A great majority of positions are don ein this sick and twisted rigged way by bureaucrats and as veterans we wonder why many non-veteran, barely literate GS-13's at such-and-such base is hired and they are literally incompetent. doing. Again, nepotism. The law is not on the outsiders side. Shit, Well then just complain to: -the hiring official- ha,ha,ha,ha! yeah right. -the hiring location CPAC/HR department- they will just ignore your email requests. -the announcement POC- they will refer you to the hiring location CPAC. This circle of bureaucratic nonsense and subterfuge would frustrate any qualified veteran. Veterans have no allies in this circle, while you have been led to believe you as a veterans get prefernce. Sure, there are a ton of Government websites all spouting the same veterans preference benefits but it is all smoke and mirrors to appease the unsuspected and uninformed of a rigged game. How do I know this stuff? I witnessed it first hand many times while an Reserve Officer on active duty working with senior Civil service at a 4 star Command. The same thing occurs at the VA. Then people wonder why 22 veterans a day commit suicide or are homeless............ Oh yes and lets not forget the VA bureaucrats who intentionally murdered over 300, 000 veterans by denying them health care. These sick and twisted unamerican government bureaucrats are no different then PolPot, Hitler and Stalin as mass murderers. The likes of Hilter mass murder the VA simply substituted ovens with secret waiting lists and pulling gold fillings with performance bonuses.

LTC Alan Murphy - Although much of what you say is relevant and on point, you are confusing your frustration with a corrupt government employment system with the comments made on this post. You may respectfully disagree with an individual while making your point or you can use slander and miss out on an opportunity to share your experience. Doesn't matter whether you are responding to PV2 Schmitt or GEN Discharge, we try to treat everyone here as equals.

COL (Join to see) - I appreciate your views and respect your position as a fellow reservist. If your a career active duty component member I could give two shits and four farts about your opinion. But I have no interest in being politically correct or sugar coating anything to appease the feelings of others who may be career active duty military bureaucrats or bureaucrat civil service members spreading ignorance or intentional propaganda when it comes to a rigged corrupt government system.

LTC Alan Murphy - Although I have some reservations about the Praetorian Guard, it is not about political correctness or worrying about the feelings of others. It is about mutual respect for one another. This forum is indifferent (or should be) to component, service, branch, rank or gender. But without mutual respect, this place becomes Facebook Junior and not a forum for military members and veterans alike to share ideas, opinions and advice. There may come a time when you may actually need some advice. But after pissing everyone off, you won't get what you need.