Posted on Jan 5, 2019
Why are we having such a hang up on this wall deal?
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We have had walls built in other countries in our world. Some have been taken down, such as in Berlin. Jerusalem has a wall and we support them. So why are we having such a hard time with the walls on our borders? I thought we wanted a safe country!
Posted in these groups: 
Public Safety
Public Safety
Posted 7 y ago
Responses: 6
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So we should copy the Communists on how to control a population? You do understand that the Berlin Wall was meant to keep people in, and it was a monumental failure, right? The wall in Jerusalem is several thousand years old, and is mostly useless. The majority of illegal aliens in this country come from Europe and Asia. A southern wall would not fix that.
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MSG Stan Hutchison
Also, half the illegals here are from overstaying their legally issued visa. A wall will do nothing for that.
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OK, let us look at some of the alleged reasons for a wall;
Stop drugs and criminals
No, it will not. There is far too much money involved to do that. Wall or no wall, the drugs will still come in.
Stop terrorist.
No convincing evidence of terrorist coming in over the southern border. 9-11 terrorist were here legally, as were the others since.
No, a wall is a 5th century solution for a 21st century problem.
Do I want stronger immigration policies? Absolutely. But I want solutions that work and are humane. That is who we are.
Stop drugs and criminals
No, it will not. There is far too much money involved to do that. Wall or no wall, the drugs will still come in.
Stop terrorist.
No convincing evidence of terrorist coming in over the southern border. 9-11 terrorist were here legally, as were the others since.
No, a wall is a 5th century solution for a 21st century problem.
Do I want stronger immigration policies? Absolutely. But I want solutions that work and are humane. That is who we are.
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PFC James (LURCH) Janota To answer the Why is easy- Politics. It has nothing to do with security.
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LTC (Join to see)
What’s the purpose of politics? Are politicians serving the citizens that they represent or the big money players that put them in office? PFC James (LURCH) Janota
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One congressman highlighted an excellent point. The Wall is a Metaphor (for national security).
Unfortunately, we've gotten so wrapped up in the metaphor that we've developed tunnel vision. We can't see everything else involved with it. A "Wall" is not logistically or economically feasible or realistic in any reasonable way. It just isn't.
Previously, the wall was "Political theater." No one actually expected the wall to be built. No one actually WANTED the wall to be built. It was just a CONCEPT that could be leveraged as political capital to accomplish other things (like getting another bill onto the President's desk). Somehow we've lost track of that.
Unfortunately, we've gotten so wrapped up in the metaphor that we've developed tunnel vision. We can't see everything else involved with it. A "Wall" is not logistically or economically feasible or realistic in any reasonable way. It just isn't.
Previously, the wall was "Political theater." No one actually expected the wall to be built. No one actually WANTED the wall to be built. It was just a CONCEPT that could be leveraged as political capital to accomplish other things (like getting another bill onto the President's desk). Somehow we've lost track of that.
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Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS
PFC James (LURCH) Janota - We can't. Not really. People need metaphors or mental models to make comparable concepts.
The easiest way for people to learn (eliminate ignorance) something new is to take something they already know about and compare it to something they don't. People understand a wall. A wall is a very simple concept. We understand it at an intuitive level.
Unfortunately, National Security SEEMS like it should be a simple concept but in actuality is a very complex concept. This is why the metaphor/mental model does not work past the initial stages (it's great as an example, but not past that).
If I said "We're going to create a layered defense which will create an effective wall" that would mean something. However, if I say "We're going to build a wall" that means something completely different. We go from figurative & feasible to literal and unreasonable with just a couple of word changes.... even if we are operating inside the same metaphor.
The easiest way for people to learn (eliminate ignorance) something new is to take something they already know about and compare it to something they don't. People understand a wall. A wall is a very simple concept. We understand it at an intuitive level.
Unfortunately, National Security SEEMS like it should be a simple concept but in actuality is a very complex concept. This is why the metaphor/mental model does not work past the initial stages (it's great as an example, but not past that).
If I said "We're going to create a layered defense which will create an effective wall" that would mean something. However, if I say "We're going to build a wall" that means something completely different. We go from figurative & feasible to literal and unreasonable with just a couple of word changes.... even if we are operating inside the same metaphor.
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PFC James (LURCH) Janota
All I know is I go to the VFW and see the damage our fellow Veterans endured and it just sickens me to see people using words (often flip-flopped) and nothing else. This country deserves better that the reliance of metaphors when we have got so much going on that require action. As I look around, I see tons that need to be done that we shouldn't have an unemployment line. My wife and I fulfill a need and started our own business. There's no reason why everyone else can't do the same. No metaphors needed.
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Multiple reasons. Politically? One politician really wants it (because it will appease his base), and other politicians don't want it (because it appeases their base). Logistically? Building the wall will require government confiscation of private property, and some of the wall locations would necessitate abandoning territory to Mexico. Financially? It will cost billions of dollars to construct, and the American taxpayer will have to foot the bill (for something most Americans don't want). Effectiveness? I have seen hardly any evidence that constructing a wall would be effective. We have a wall now in multiple locations, and people either climb over it or tunnel under it. Plus, the wall would only cover a small portion of our borders, so the coastlines and our northern border would still be open.
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