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Can we just win our battles and wars? Can we simply define victory without PC, BS, and political micromanagement?
What are your thoughts?
NOTE: Lets try not to make this about any particular political figure. The question covers enough time to be nonpartisan.
What are your thoughts?
NOTE: Lets try not to make this about any particular political figure. The question covers enough time to be nonpartisan.
Posted 10 y ago
Responses: 23
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I imagine the British had this same thread on "His Majesty's Point of Rally" during the Rebellion; America's first PR war.
The best movie example of fighting a dedicated, non-traditional enemy comes from the movie "Gardens of Stone" (1987): (I'm still looking for the video clip).......
...........................
And I don't really give a rat's ass
about Vietnam.
:37:23
Really, I don't give a wombat's shit
about who's running Vietnam.
:37:28
To be very honest, I don't care
who's running the U.S.A.
:37:32
Don't you care about anything?
:37:34
Oh, yeah. I care about the
United States Army. That's my family.
:37:39
The only one I got. And I don't
like it when it's in trouble.
:37:43
Trouble? Sarge!
:37:46
We beat England when we were
the guerrillas, and we beat Hitler.
:37:51
We beat everybody in between.
:37:53
We're not gonna lose
to a bunch of little Asian farmers.
:37:57
Yeah? You take a look at that farmer.
:38:00
He can march 100 miles on no food,
through a jungle...
:38:04
...slaughter his own people,
even babies. That's a soldier.
:38:08
Firepower.
He can't soak up our firepower.
:38:12
I saw a photo, one of our choppers
coming back with arrows in it!
:38:16
How do you beat a helicopter
with bows and arrows?
:38:20
How you gonna beat an enemy
that fights with arrows?
The best movie example of fighting a dedicated, non-traditional enemy comes from the movie "Gardens of Stone" (1987): (I'm still looking for the video clip).......
...........................
And I don't really give a rat's ass
about Vietnam.
:37:23
Really, I don't give a wombat's shit
about who's running Vietnam.
:37:28
To be very honest, I don't care
who's running the U.S.A.
:37:32
Don't you care about anything?
:37:34
Oh, yeah. I care about the
United States Army. That's my family.
:37:39
The only one I got. And I don't
like it when it's in trouble.
:37:43
Trouble? Sarge!
:37:46
We beat England when we were
the guerrillas, and we beat Hitler.
:37:51
We beat everybody in between.
:37:53
We're not gonna lose
to a bunch of little Asian farmers.
:37:57
Yeah? You take a look at that farmer.
:38:00
He can march 100 miles on no food,
through a jungle...
:38:04
...slaughter his own people,
even babies. That's a soldier.
:38:08
Firepower.
He can't soak up our firepower.
:38:12
I saw a photo, one of our choppers
coming back with arrows in it!
:38:16
How do you beat a helicopter
with bows and arrows?
:38:20
How you gonna beat an enemy
that fights with arrows?
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In WWII, one could practically decide "have we won?" by asking "Are there American PXs in Berlin and Tokyo?" The conditions for success were very easily discerned.
In Viet-Nam, there was no "Is there an American PX in Hanoi?" outcome because, as COL Summers points out in On Strategy, we took counsel of our fears. Our mission was to "resist aggression" (how do you know that you have succeeded at that, decisively?)
We were locked in a situation where the worst thing that could happen to the North on any day was that they didn't win. The BEST thing that could happen to us on any day was that we didn't lose.
The other side did have a clear marker for winning, e.g. "Is there a North Vietnamese flag flying over the former US embassy in what is now called Ho Chi Minh City?". We only had a loose definition for losing.
In Viet-Nam, there was no "Is there an American PX in Hanoi?" outcome because, as COL Summers points out in On Strategy, we took counsel of our fears. Our mission was to "resist aggression" (how do you know that you have succeeded at that, decisively?)
We were locked in a situation where the worst thing that could happen to the North on any day was that they didn't win. The BEST thing that could happen to us on any day was that we didn't lose.
The other side did have a clear marker for winning, e.g. "Is there a North Vietnamese flag flying over the former US embassy in what is now called Ho Chi Minh City?". We only had a loose definition for losing.
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