Posted on Jan 28, 2017
Why does security now trump liberty? Is this complementary to the values of Founders?
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Responses: 105
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Attributed to Ben Franklin. In my humble opinion, the "Patriot Act" and the MOU for the use of force after 9/11 were two of the worst pieces of legislation ever enacted by congress, and signed by a president. Americans lost all around, and both divided the nation against itself.
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Once Freedoms and Liberty are take away it’s almost impossible to get them back just remember Governments want control over People instead of the People being in power. There must always be equality and freedom no compromises!
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Security on military facilities is one thing. Security of the masses is another. As said by our founders. You allow others to protect you at your own peril of loosing your freedoms. Big government can't do allot of good. It takes it's citizens to protect or defend their freedoms.
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PO1 Gregg Mundy
I see there is a difference in opinion, "OK". With respect, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.
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Sp4 Byron Skinner. I can'y say it any better the Adam Smith did in his Glasgow lectures of 1775 when discussing a market economy. " a man is faced with the choice of personal (physical) security and freedom (economic) he will alway chose security". From the context of the lecture it is clear that Adam Smith felt the two will never be compatible and that man will always opt for security over risk. The degree of economic insecurity (risk) that a person is willing to accept is most likely a part that genetics plat in an individuals make up as compared to "Flight or Fight".
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After what happened on 9/11, and what has continued to happen in places like Vegas, this issue will constantly be debated.
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Mr. Jefferson is on point.. and so is
Ben Franklin; “those that trade essential liberty for a little security, deserve neither.” That’s pretty close, and covers it.
Ben Franklin; “those that trade essential liberty for a little security, deserve neither.” That’s pretty close, and covers it.
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First, lets look at the times of our founding and compare to now.
Slavery was an issue at the start of our country. Having slaves was almost a status marker. So, when Thomas Jefferson uttered those words, he was talking about exactly what the words say. Today, it is metaphorical to utter those words. And we went through the rough parts of our history correcting something that should have never happened here - slavery.
Now we are so mired in verbiage and headline news politics that even speaking about something can get you into trouble. This is not what slavery was. But it is what Liberty is. And a lot of people lost what liberty is to the point where Pastors are in jail for refusing to marry people. Just WTF are we doing? Can't bake cakes or not bake a cake without causing legal problems. WTF!
That is Liberty. That is what the Military should be protecting. Your right to say yes or no.
Sadly, it's not. It's protecting oil prices. It's protect foreign industry. It is doing a lot of help for our country but very little help for our liberties.
If your first action into this country is to break the Law, the Military should stop it. And that's every illegal that comes here. They are the worse of the worse that other countries don't want. Do you know that most illegals would never be allowed in this country. And we have legal means for the people we do want in this country.
So, I am now at a loss. Because the military is not fighting for personnel Liberty. It's fighting for many things, but not Personnel Liberty. If it was, it would be in a court rooms aiming at the Judges. You have the right to eat cake. You do NOT have the right to force a person to make it for you.
Slavery was an issue at the start of our country. Having slaves was almost a status marker. So, when Thomas Jefferson uttered those words, he was talking about exactly what the words say. Today, it is metaphorical to utter those words. And we went through the rough parts of our history correcting something that should have never happened here - slavery.
Now we are so mired in verbiage and headline news politics that even speaking about something can get you into trouble. This is not what slavery was. But it is what Liberty is. And a lot of people lost what liberty is to the point where Pastors are in jail for refusing to marry people. Just WTF are we doing? Can't bake cakes or not bake a cake without causing legal problems. WTF!
That is Liberty. That is what the Military should be protecting. Your right to say yes or no.
Sadly, it's not. It's protecting oil prices. It's protect foreign industry. It is doing a lot of help for our country but very little help for our liberties.
If your first action into this country is to break the Law, the Military should stop it. And that's every illegal that comes here. They are the worse of the worse that other countries don't want. Do you know that most illegals would never be allowed in this country. And we have legal means for the people we do want in this country.
So, I am now at a loss. Because the military is not fighting for personnel Liberty. It's fighting for many things, but not Personnel Liberty. If it was, it would be in a court rooms aiming at the Judges. You have the right to eat cake. You do NOT have the right to force a person to make it for you.
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With the risks in having no security, your own death will eliminate your liberty.
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What do you mean by "now"? We the people have traded liberty for security for quite some time. In fact, most times it wasn't traded, it was surrendered willfully.
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