Posted on May 28, 2015
Why don't all members of the Air Force have to be fully qualified to be a rifleman in case of hostile events?
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I have noticed through the years of being in the Air Force (Security Forces member here) that most people in the Air Force are clueless when it comes to M-4/M-16/M-9. This is outrageous! What are they supposed to do if the enemy comes knocking on our door step and everyone needs to fight. I have taught classes on the M-4 with communication airmen and have seen them completely mess up clearing out the weapon, loading it (magazine upside down or rounds the wrong way), and just completely incapable of achieving a zero on target after four rounds of firing. I am a big fan of how the Army and Marines teach that your are always a rifleman first. It almost seems like some of the Airmen don't expect to carry a weapon (ummmm why did you join the military in the first place)? I wish the Air Force would pick up on this to make us a more combat ready force. But, enough of me what are your thoughts?
Rifleman
3P: Security Forces
Air Force
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 907
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The AF is 75% technician oriented and when it comes to being caught between a rock and a hard-place as it was back during Tet, it doesn't take long for the AF tech to catch on the metal end of the rifle points toward the evil-doers rolling over the parameter wire. Nope! the AF is not to be 100% PJ qual'ed and that AF program is way over-board in SEAL related training. Thanks for your concern and we will do better with the general AF population twd M-16 proficiency .
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I don't know what's up with the new Air Force, but what I'v seen & heard they make me discussed. When I was in we all went thru rifle training & had to go through it every 6 - 12 months. I even have a ribbon for small arms excellence & proud to say I keep up on my hand gun & rifle skills. Even have taught myself to shoot left-handed as well. I honestly don't know where the Air Force is heading, but it doesn't sound or look good. Sgt. E-4 USAF 31st FMS
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MSgt Harold Robinson
SrA Hall, your a smart airman. Stay smart, stay qualified and keep moving forward and set the example. You will be noticed as you appear to be the exception rather than the norm. Good for you. The USAF will survive and if I can and did, anyone can. Difference was that I was prepared and much on my own. You seem to have figured it out. Good for you, good for the USAF.
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Having been deployed twice as an Army asset, even though I was Air Force, I agree that all members should at least be proficient with at least one of the weapons listed. During my 1st deployment I spent a few days at COP Keating and knowing how to use your own weapon as well as others if needed was vitally important. The following year the COP was overrun. During my 2nd deployment our FOB was hit daily, like clock work. I was glad I knew how to handle and take care of both my weapons. It'seems an important thing that all military members should at least have a basic knowledge of.
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That's an age old problem. It wasn't that much of a problem during the 24 years I served because we weren't deploying to combat theaters all the time. I served 24 years, 11 years enlisted in Telecommunications. I qualified on the M-16 in basic and then qualified again when deploying to Okinawa. I never touched a weapon after that until I qualified again in OTS. I got in a lot of range time and experience cleaning weapons as an SP and carried a 16 for two years working missile security.
If I were still in, even in Telecommunications I would want as much range time as I could get especially if deploying to a combat theater.
What's my personal weapon now? It's this GAU. And yes I can easily strip it and clean it.
If I were still in, even in Telecommunications I would want as much range time as I could get especially if deploying to a combat theater.
What's my personal weapon now? It's this GAU. And yes I can easily strip it and clean it.
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I was in the Air Force from 1966 to 1970. When I went in, I did think we would get more training in weapons and hand-to-hand combat. We had one day at the range after classroom on the M-16. Though I did obtain the Expert Marksman ribbon, that may have been dumb luck. We had no hand-to-hand combat training. When I was in we had the shortened basic due to Vietnam but I think that was a mistake. I agree with you completely that the Air Force should do a lot more to make every Airman capable of properly using rifles, handguns and hand-to-hand fighting.
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If a Airman can't take care of a weapon and what's required to care of it and use it, that's a sign of a shitty instructor... Maybe YOU The Air Force CATM instructor needs to look in the mirror.
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I am fully capable of accurately firing my assigned weapon, plus I fire my privately owned weapons to maintain/improve my efficiency. However, if things ever get so bad that an O4 supply officer is having to pick up a rifle and fight off the mongol hordes, you are already having a very bad day and the best option is to find the nearest operational vehicle and GTFO. just sayin.....
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SrA Clifford Burnett
This type of attitude just makes the point more clear, in regards to insuring proficiency in ALL arms for Base and Personal defense.
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Sorry, but the Air Force just has a totally different mentality sometimes. When I was in Task Force Hawk in Albania in 1999, we had the combat operation on one side of the airfield. Full battle rattle, ammo issued, no saluting, the whole deal.
On the other side of the airfield, was the "humanitarian" mission with the Air Force. Those folks were literally running around in sneakers, shorts and t-shirts and were not worried for their safety because "we are the humanitarian mission, nobody wants to hurt us."
What?! The security forces for the Air Force were there in their armored Humvees, and were actually pointing their weapons at us as we arrived on the airfield.
Sometimes, you just can't relate!
On the other side of the airfield, was the "humanitarian" mission with the Air Force. Those folks were literally running around in sneakers, shorts and t-shirts and were not worried for their safety because "we are the humanitarian mission, nobody wants to hurt us."
What?! The security forces for the Air Force were there in their armored Humvees, and were actually pointing their weapons at us as we arrived on the airfield.
Sometimes, you just can't relate!
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It's not only the Air Force, I have seen this in the Army also. There is a video going around social media of an NCO in the reserves that has issues at a range. Her excuse is the she is a reservist. That is what normally follows with lack of soldiering skills is an excuse why they are not up to par.
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Has it changed? When did it change? I had to qualify with the M-1 Carbine in Basic, last flight to use the M-1; everyone after that used the M-16. I had to qualify every year after Basic with the M-16, fired Expert every time. During the Vietnam War, I had a defensive position assigned at Udorn Royal Thai Air Force Base next to my shop. They kept our weapons and ammo in a conex parked next to our building. We would have had to line up to get our gear issued if we had been attacked. But it was planned that we WOULD defend ourselves.
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TSgt Jim McGill
I have no idea. As a Security Forces Member it was very scary watching administration personnel try to qualify every 2-3 years or when they were getting ready to deploy. Also this is the same branch that makes the carry toy M-16s in Basic and very much now has the "not my job" mentality. I transferred from the Army to the Air Force and the culture change was shocking. Security is very much left to Security Forces and lord forbid if we are not there to save the day because everyone else is screwed
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