Posted on May 28, 2015
Why don't all members of the Air Force have to be fully qualified to be a rifleman in case of hostile events?
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I have noticed through the years of being in the Air Force (Security Forces member here) that most people in the Air Force are clueless when it comes to M-4/M-16/M-9. This is outrageous! What are they supposed to do if the enemy comes knocking on our door step and everyone needs to fight. I have taught classes on the M-4 with communication airmen and have seen them completely mess up clearing out the weapon, loading it (magazine upside down or rounds the wrong way), and just completely incapable of achieving a zero on target after four rounds of firing. I am a big fan of how the Army and Marines teach that your are always a rifleman first. It almost seems like some of the Airmen don't expect to carry a weapon (ummmm why did you join the military in the first place)? I wish the Air Force would pick up on this to make us a more combat ready force. But, enough of me what are your thoughts?
Rifleman
3P: Security Forces
Air Force
Edited 9 y ago
Posted 9 y ago
Responses: 914
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Ditto the Navy. Don’t expect any Navy personnel to be qualified on, or with any sidearm. That why the Navy has Marine’s. In the Navy your introduced to a weapon, but you don’t qualify on one. I was introduced to the M1 Grand in boot camp, fired 60 rounds on the Marine Corps A Range, shot among the top 10 out of about 350 that day, and never touched a weapon again until I separated from active duty. I’m an RSO, reloaded my own Ammo, and a recreation shooter. I’ve seen Navy personnel issued a sidearm for certain security purposes w/o knowing if they are qualified. Don’t let any Navy personnel touch a weapon until they are qualified on that weapon, because they did NOT have any training in boot camp for sure, and likely their MOS didn’t require any weapons training either.
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I was an Air Force Air Traffic Controller in Vietnam. The only time I saw my weapon at Cam Rhan Bay was the once a week we were required to go to the Orderly Room to clean it. On my day off I flew as an "additional crew member." As such I flew thousands of miles without a weapon. My commander gave permission for the extra curricular flights, but would not let me check out my weapon. In the Army I served 16 years, including Desert Storm. Chaplains do not carry weapons and risk Court Martial if we're do.
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CH (MAJ) Wesley Sullivan
Additionally.. in the AF I qualified as a Small Arms Expert coming out of Basic Training. I later qualified left and right handed before going to Vietnam.
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Back in the day, they used to. At least that is the story that was passed along from my pops who retired from the AF back in '84. As he told it, he saw his weapons twice a year unless there was a field problem and only had to qualify on them once a year.
I mean I get the mentality from higher ups but really, it is kind of stupid. EVERY person that serves in the military should at the very least be proficient with an M4/M16, M-203, M-60 and AT-4. These are basics. Relying on the fact that you are in the rear with the gear does not cut it if there is suddenly a force that pops up ala Vietnam on the Airbase and starts going through it. Best to be armed and prepared to deal with it rather than wait for Security, or the Army/Marines.
I mean I get the mentality from higher ups but really, it is kind of stupid. EVERY person that serves in the military should at the very least be proficient with an M4/M16, M-203, M-60 and AT-4. These are basics. Relying on the fact that you are in the rear with the gear does not cut it if there is suddenly a force that pops up ala Vietnam on the Airbase and starts going through it. Best to be armed and prepared to deal with it rather than wait for Security, or the Army/Marines.
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I was in the USAF from 1975 to 1981. Active reserve 81-82. Never fired a weapon. We were not riflemen. We were airmen.
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Nov 23, 1963. Kennedy was killed in Dallas. Speculation ran rapid on who did it and why. I was assigned to a Hawk missile battery near Frankfurt, Germany at the time. 7th Army called an alert and our unit (maybe 80 men) were sent up to the Fulda Gap to set up on a hilltop in the middle of the night. Now, most of us considered ourselves as more technicians than soldiers and our BC had even had an Airborne MSGT assigned to get us in line. During formation the next morning, the 1st Sgt advised us that if the Soviets and East Germans decided to attack, we would expend our missiles and then, might hold out for seven days as infantry. A real wake-up call.
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When I went through BMTS in 1980, we all went through M-16 training & target shooting. We were told everyone needed to learn weapon basics for the reason of wartime situations. Everyone needed to defend themselves, others & the base. Since I was going into Security Police, I thought (to myself) it would be prudent to get the marksmanship ribbon. Which I did.
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I spent 23 years in the Air Force as an Intelligence Analyst, and usually only had the opportunity to qualify with the M-16 about every 18 months. There were times when I had to qualify with a 9-MM and a Shotgun due to Temporary Duty Assignments, but the Air Force was never really comfortable with having every Airman on Base armed. The only time I had to carry a weapon outside a training environment was the year I went to Honduras in the early 1990's. Before traveling off the base, we would have to go by the Armory and check out a 9-MM for self-protection. Once we returned to base, the weapons went back to the Armory. I always enjoyed the days in class and on the range, making sure I could properly handle a weapon, if issued one.
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News to me. I enlisted in the Air Force in 1966 and went through rifle training and qualified with the M-16. That Lackland sun was hot enough to melt the shine right off your boots!
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Suspended Profile
When I was Air Force in the 80s, it was a given that Airmen were non-combatant. I was a mechanic (AFSC 45255) My mission was to keep jets flying. My mission wasn't turning magazines, but turning wrenches and busting knuckles so the pilots can drop steal rain on the enemy.
When I was in Basic BMTS 3706, Flight 209 1983, we had a dry fire and wet fire and the M-16 I had was fitted for .22 not .223/5.56 on the day of the range, the instructer just wanted you to hit paper. No zero, no instruction on trigger pull or controlled breathing.
Since joining the Army National Guard, there is a major difference in the mission and mission requirements. I am having more fun in the Army than I did in the AF.
When I was in Basic BMTS 3706, Flight 209 1983, we had a dry fire and wet fire and the M-16 I had was fitted for .22 not .223/5.56 on the day of the range, the instructer just wanted you to hit paper. No zero, no instruction on trigger pull or controlled breathing.
Since joining the Army National Guard, there is a major difference in the mission and mission requirements. I am having more fun in the Army than I did in the AF.
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