Posted on May 28, 2015
SSgt Security Forces
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Carbine backwards mag
I have noticed through the years of being in the Air Force (Security Forces member here) that most people in the Air Force are clueless when it comes to M-4/M-16/M-9. This is outrageous! What are they supposed to do if the enemy comes knocking on our door step and everyone needs to fight. I have taught classes on the M-4 with communication airmen and have seen them completely mess up clearing out the weapon, loading it (magazine upside down or rounds the wrong way), and just completely incapable of achieving a zero on target after four rounds of firing. I am a big fan of how the Army and Marines teach that your are always a rifleman first. It almost seems like some of the Airmen don't expect to carry a weapon (ummmm why did you join the military in the first place)? I wish the Air Force would pick up on this to make us a more combat ready force. But, enough of me what are your thoughts?
Edited >1 y ago
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SPC Franklin McKown
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When we deployed to Desert Storm, Gen. Tilelli ,Who commanded 1st Cav Div ,issued an order I violated the SHIT out of.(OF course I won't say about THE REST of my platoon my crimes are my own )but I am a Gray wolf scout from the 80s Only women and people that can get caught never wore an inverted Gerber MkII on their Alice gear, or a pokey thing of some type,SOME fools used expensive weighty Buckmasters or NIGHTMARISHLY priced Crawford handmade knives( It made for an UNMERCIFUL ribbing when they lost it} BUT we fought with our knives DESPITE what the army said or trained ,THEN or now,because we hunted THEM and when we found them is was OUR asses face to face.
AND you don't use THOSE kinds of blades to open CANS.
I called that 'OL mafia override, because MINE will come home.
I respected all my cadre and tried not to be difficult, it worked sometimes too.
My platoon leader was a mustang ,THANK GOD.
THE ARMED forces will bury many soon if Korea kicks off THEN they will want ALL of theses things either by doctrine or on the side.
It's like they are going girly on killing because they think contractors will save them.
I suggest prone ,"DIME and barrel" drills DAILY .
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SSgt James Tadlock
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I was in Vietnam during the war era. I qualified expert marksman with the M-1 Carbine during basic training in 1965. I stayed on my grandparents farm a lot as a kid and rifles and shotguns were always around. I bought a .22 cal single shot rifle when I was 14. It was very accurate. I could shoot .22 longs and long rifles but mostly just fired shorts. I never had an accident like hitting a farm animal. I have this rifle to this day along with my granddad's 12 guage shotgun . I arrived in Vietnam shortly after The Tet offensive of 1968. My duty section was 377th Cmbt Spt Grp Mail and Message Distribution Center located in 7th Air Force Hdqtrs Bldg. My duty hours were 2000 hrs - 0800 hrs for the 1 year tour of duty. We had racks filled with M-16 rifles and .38 S&W pistols inside file cabinets along with ammunition. We never carried arms unless on a specific mission where supervision determined the need for them. Such as carrying classified to the burn area and burning while others stood guard. Some times we pulled CQ Duty in the hut area (at night) using a small hut for shelter which was situated along the perimeter fence. We only had a pistol for defense. Thank goodness I never had to fire a shot, but I feel that I could hold my own.
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TSgt Kenneth Hancock
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as a retired air force mechanic, i can tell you it is probably better that most members are not issued weapons. though during the korean the chicken squadron abandoned their mechanics , flew off in their aircraft and the troops were hung from the hanger with safety wire. when i was osan they did issue weapons during exercises. don't know if the 51st still does this
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MSgt Benjamin Grady
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I was in Air Force CCT for 10 years TACP 1.5years and we were trained on individual and crew served as well as explosives.
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SSG Jeffrey Monk
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That's why I bought my sister a shoulder right and the extended 9mm mags for her issued Beretta. Though she doesn't carry an M4 she did qualify expert every three to six months when not deployed while stationed at Herbert Field. It all depends on your job and environment.
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MSG Brad Sand
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Wow, I was not aware of this. Puts some comments I have seen from those in the Air Force in context.
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SFC Tony Bennett
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While I was contracting in Afghanistan, I met several Air Force personnel who were COMPLETELY UNARMED. I even asked what were they supposed to do if bad guys were coming over the fence. Said the SP's were there to handle it. Mind you this is in an active war zone.....
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Capt Al Parker
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Depends on the job, when I was in TAC I had to be qualified on "M1 Carbine", also when I was in SAC in a Prime Beef unit (additional duty) I had to be qualified with weapon
weapons and site protection. Back then all basics had weapons training. Even in the ADC at radar sites I was expected to handle an M1.
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SSgt Jason Lindbeck
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As a retired CATM guy I can promise you that A: all USAF personnel are required to qualify with the m4/m16 before entering a warzone on deployment (barring special circumstances or requirements for non combatancy such as a Chaplain) and B: Security Forces Airmen will be both the best at firing and the very, very worst at firing. This is because for some unfortunate reason security forces has become the catch-all for idiots who failed in other places.
To focus specifically on your question, though, it is possible to skip firing during basic training. It is also possible in certain career fields to make it to Chief without ever touching a gun, provided you never deploy. This means that lack of experience can cause confusion and the appearance of idiocy. The important thing is to move past it without calling undue attention, correct the error, and help build muscle memory.
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SSgt Samuel Johnson
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I started my career in a FACP or Forward Air Control Party in Germany. EVERYONE had a weapon and knew how to operate it. Later I PCSed to a NORAD SOC in Arizona. I initially thought, "no weapons"? Later I realized, our mission was different. We took out enemy forces WAYout there. I sat in Arizona and watched intercepts hundreds of miles off of the California coast. The stress of military aircraft in near proximity to 747's with 200+ passengers on board, trying to make pilots do precisly what you want to avoid collisions, led me to believe this was no place for weapons ready for the grabbing.

So, I see everyone's thoughts but understand the USAF has many different environments to work in. I was a grunt in a USAF uniform and a blue suiter too, in two different environments. Qualification in both scenarios is a good idea, but in reality, a hidden or controlled environment, I'll yield my weapon to the SP's if they need backup though, I was ready, capable and willing.
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