Posted on Sep 8, 2016
Why is there such a long wait for reserve component officer and warrant federal recognition/promotion?
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Can anyone tell me why the process takes so long for RC officer/warrant promotions to run through the FedRec cycle? I'm an ARNG officer and I've had my state promotion orders for CPT since the middle of April. I've been tracking my packet on the ARNG-G1 website and it was awaiting addition to a scroll until a month ago and last week the scroll was ready to start the approval DoD cycle. Thoughts?
Edited 9 y ago
Posted 9 y ago
Responses: 419
P13-18 has movement! Awaiting Dir Ch of Staff Pers approval; P13-18; 69 Days in DoD Approval cycle
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Anyone from Scroll P10-17 start the process to adjust your DOR through the Army Board for Correction of Military Records (ABCMR)?
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CPT (Join to see)
Sir, I was just browsing this thread with the same question. Did you have any luck finding someone from our scroll who has tried?
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COL (Join to see)
CPT (Join to see) Nope...radio silence. I submitted and got a letter confirming receipt from ABCMR.
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LO3-18 Published on OCT 4
I'm assuming the scrolls that were pending SEC DEF approval has all been given the green light.
Congratulations to everyone promoting.
I know it been a long wait.
I hope we LT get backdated and back-pay.
I'm assuming the scrolls that were pending SEC DEF approval has all been given the green light.
Congratulations to everyone promoting.
I know it been a long wait.
I hope we LT get backdated and back-pay.
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MAJ (Join to see)
Congrats. Yes, you will receive back pay for 2LT to 1LT. P10-18 is still at DMPM. I have no idea why we are taking so long. We've been there since July. I hope our scroll didn't fall behind a desk. Who do we call if we think that might be the case?
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The Federal government has always had it's hands in the Military Promotion system. Enough said
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CPT(P) (Join to see)
1LT (Join to see) - Somewhere along the lines your leadership failed you when it comes to "Expectation vs. Reality: the Reserve Component promotion process". It has been horrendous (to say the least). Those "state orders" are, for all intents and purposes, just an imaginary piece of paper that helps the state feel included in the process. What has been continuously discussed amongst my peer group that is/has been dealing with this process for the past several years; expect the worst (in some cases 270+ days in the "process") and just be surprised when you receive that golden ticket to your promotion (which in almost all cases has you underpaid, performing the duties of the next higher grade, for almost a year). Keep your head up though! You're young (I am assuming because of rank) and there is currently promotion reform underway! Work hard, be headstrong, and never let the military's notorious moral killers affect your performance.
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1LT(P) (Join to see)
Hopefully by the end of the calendar year. Was hoping by the end of the fiscal year, but impossible to say. Several other scrolls have pasted this one up. Could be worse though. At least this one will get back pay.
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CPT Griff Tatum
L04-17 didnt hit that phase until about 290 days so I would feel pretty good if I were yall.
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1LT (Join to see)
CPT(P) (Join to see) - I said 15 August from the time I got stat promoted. I hope that's wrong but the last trend from the SECDEF was about 45-60 days.
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CPT(P) (Join to see)
Do you know how long we have been there according to DPRO? I don't have access to that and don't want to bother my S1.
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1LT (Join to see)
CPT(P) (Join to see) - I don't, I want to say that 07-18 updated on the website about a week ago but if it was there before that I am not sure.
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1LT (Join to see)
With July 4th being this week, I would have been shocked if anything happened. 07-18 moved to SECDEF on 6/26, so I'm afraid we still have a few weeks to go...
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General question for this post: How long does it take for AKO or "most Army systems" like ERB/ORB, SIB transactions, etc. to reflect the new rank? Even though everything is in iPerms, Im trying to stay one step ahead so I sent my FEDREC to our staff so they may be able to action something I cannot. I dont expect them to dig in my iPerms and do it for me without requesting. Would getting my CAC updated help the process?
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CW5 (Join to see)
My understanding is that most of it flows out of SIDPERS updates.
That 'should' happen by either your State G1 or S1. Mine updated SIDPERS on Thurs. As of now, AKO hasn't picked it up, but my email entry in the GAL has changed. SIDPERS also drives DFAS pay. NGB is down so I cant check ORB. CAC wont affect it, and you probably wont be able to update it until DEERS updates (or if they accept paper orders). If SIDPERS is updated, I'd give it 3-5 business days for everything, except probably pay....
That 'should' happen by either your State G1 or S1. Mine updated SIDPERS on Thurs. As of now, AKO hasn't picked it up, but my email entry in the GAL has changed. SIDPERS also drives DFAS pay. NGB is down so I cant check ORB. CAC wont affect it, and you probably wont be able to update it until DEERS updates (or if they accept paper orders). If SIDPERS is updated, I'd give it 3-5 business days for everything, except probably pay....
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MAJ(P) (Join to see)
The state side of things, at least in Kansas, happened fairly quickly in my case. I was eligible for promotion in February of 2016 and the state cut my promotion orders (pending FEDREC) in April of that year. The actual FEDREC process is what takes a long time. For me, it was 3 weeks shybof a year. For another guy I know, it was over a year. That's when you'll have to embrace the suck.
As for what you can do now, just keep tactfully hounding your S1 rep for the status on getting your packet pushed through the system and ask if there's anything they need you to action. Sometimes people will care more about your career if you show them you have an interest in it yourself.
As for what you can do now, just keep tactfully hounding your S1 rep for the status on getting your packet pushed through the system and ask if there's anything they need you to action. Sometimes people will care more about your career if you show them you have an interest in it yourself.
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CPT Griff Tatum
Yeah I totally agree with you. I received my FEDREC a week ago, I was just curious when all Army systems would reflect it and if there were anything I could do to affect it. I didn’t and don’t expect battalion to care more about it than I. I had my readiness NCO upload it for a pay concern in SIBX and he’s talked to the S1 who says they have updated everything they can on their end
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I got my state order 16JUN2017 for 1LT, but it says I'm only on day 121. I'm on scroll L02-18. At this point I'm just going to skip 1LT and turn in my packet for CAPT or branch transfer to Space Force. I hear BAH on the moon is going to be awesome!
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1LT(P) (Join to see)
Not sure what took so long to get you on a scroll 2LT (Join to see) I got a state order at the end of JAN2018 and I am on scroll L02-18.
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MAJ (Join to see)
My state order was published 15 NOV 2017 and was backdated to 22 FEB 2017 and I am on L02-18 as well......
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LTC (Join to see)
My understanding is that they only due 2LT->1LT and WO1->WO2 scrolls quarterly. Since it gets backdated to when you are eligible for promotion, I guess they wanted to keep the number of scrolls down. It all depends when your packet got to DMPM.
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So going off of what collective data this post has to offer, there are about 22 scrolls total. 7 of them are at SECDEF:((SCROLL: DAYS AT SECDEF/TOTAL DAYS)) D16-17: 6/262, L04-17: 6/292, P04-18: 34/153, P05-18: 34/153, S08-17: 34/264, U01-18: 34/172, U02-18: 34/172.
(Roughly)
Going off of the already approved scrolls for the past month, most of them spent 27 days total at SECDEF. Then some about the same amount 41, 48....ehhhh.....68, and 68 days for all the others.
Ideally, the model states a total of 23 (business) days it takes to go through the few offices at SECDEF. We all know that we usually wait double or triple the time- 46-69 days for actual approval once at this stage.
In conclusion, I find that if you analyze the patterns and do some math, it's a much easier way to see the light at the end of the tunnel rather than aimlessly hoping. And 8 days away from hitting the 300 day mark, Im hoping pretty hard, haha.
(Roughly)
Going off of the already approved scrolls for the past month, most of them spent 27 days total at SECDEF. Then some about the same amount 41, 48....ehhhh.....68, and 68 days for all the others.
Ideally, the model states a total of 23 (business) days it takes to go through the few offices at SECDEF. We all know that we usually wait double or triple the time- 46-69 days for actual approval once at this stage.
In conclusion, I find that if you analyze the patterns and do some math, it's a much easier way to see the light at the end of the tunnel rather than aimlessly hoping. And 8 days away from hitting the 300 day mark, Im hoping pretty hard, haha.
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1LT (Join to see)
You're acting like this whole process makes sense and isn't really just a crap shoot
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CPT Griff Tatum
That’s a plus of course you’re right. I just want to pin the rank so I won’t get overlooked for an XO slot. Timing is everything and unless my BN is looking at my actual FEDREC status (which doesn’t mean anything until it’s approved) then I sit lower on the OML when I’ve been eligible for a move and completed my PL time. I try to not let the Army be in charge of my career as much as humanly possible.
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CPT Griff Tatum
1LT (Join to see) yeah it actually somewhat does make sense when you dig deep. Not saying it’s flawless though.
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CPT Griff Tatum
1LT(P) Q J. I would agree with that, however, I do think they take the day count into consideration where very few go too far over that 300 day mark. It's almost like there has to be a holiday for that to happen, in combination with it just sitting a long time, or youre right, they approve UVP first for your said reasons. But I do think once that day count gets so high they approve it because it looks bad (worse) on them for a scroll to sit for more than 300 days. But that's airing on the fact that they care, even just a little bit.
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Where is 04-18?? It moved through the process at the same days as 02-18 and 03-18......
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CPT Griff Tatum
LTC (Join to see) full days including Memorial Day and weekends? Or 45 real business days? Because if you take away weekends and holidays it’s really only around 35
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MAJ (Join to see)
Yea, count business days not weekend days. The days in the DPRO tracker are accurate as they skip weekends, etc., so far as I can tell.
4-18 is the next senior scroll along with 5-18, as of yesterday, at least according to the most recent chart and the ones that have posted.
4-18 is the next senior scroll along with 5-18, as of yesterday, at least according to the most recent chart and the ones that have posted.
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Has anything published this week??? hello P04-18 how long are you going to be on vacation at the SECDEF office??
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MAJ (Join to see)
You'd think with the number of scrolls piled up at SECDEF they would be eager to get some of them approved and published, but it's pretty obvious how little the people in this process seem to give a damn. I think the rush to get through NGB and Army staff offices only happened because of the little bit of extra attention that NGAUS and recent congressional hearings put on this topic. However, so far, SECDEF and his staff haven't been the ones taking the heat on this, it's been the SECARMY taking the heat. Now what seems to have happened is that SECARMY and NGB processes sped up significantly just so everyone could wait forever at SECDEF level instead. It's a maddening process that needs a complete overhaul from top to bottom.
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Awaiting Off of Sec of Defense approval; L04-17; 288 Days in DoD Approval cycle
7 Jun 18
7 Jun 18
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1LT (Join to see)
No I am on P07-18. The nice thing for you is 2LT to 1LT is back dated/paid. It took me 8 months for 2LT to 1LT. I am currently at 120 days on the counter for this one with another 3 months in the state.
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CPT Griff Tatum
1LT (Join to see) I don’t think you can see all of them. Not that I’m aware of. But who knows. Hopefully yours moves faster than ours did.
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White House Opposes 'FedRec' Legislation
Legislation to hasten federal recognition of National Guard officer promotions does not have the blessing of the White House. The administration of President Trump cites "inequitable treatment" of Guard and active-component and Reserve officers as one reason it opposes the National Guard Promotion Accountability Act.
Legislation to hasten federal recognition of National Guard officer promotions does not have the blessing of the White House. The administration of President Trump cites "inequitable treatment" of Guard and active-component and Reserve officers as one reason it opposes the National Guard Promotion Accountability Act.
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MAJ (Join to see)
I could certainly understand if we were simply waiting on a promotion to move into a higher graded position and then we began to fulfill the duties and responsibilities inherent in that role, but that is not the case. We are "promoted" into a higher graded position and then we await validation of said promotion while fulfilling the duties and responsibilities inherent in the assumed role. This is not what occurs in the active component nor in the USAR. Thus the treatment is inequitable on our account, and not geared towards our COMPOs 1 and 3 counterparts.
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MAJ Kahren Aydinyan
Mine hasn't been uploaded to perms yet. Maybe in the next couple days. Don't care, going to wear the rank regardless. :)
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MSG Michael McEleney
Meant to Say what is the ROA's response to this problem? Isn't that why you pay dues and membership fees?
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CPT Griff Tatum
NAGUS apparently is the spear head for getting this issue, not resolved (I think it will take a ton of time) but moving faster. I think it's just someone light a fire under their behind. Im no SME on the subject though.
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CPT (Join to see)
MAJ (Join to see) - I think today is your day...sending out good vibes for orders within the next 24 hours. :)
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National Guard Association of the United States - NGAUS
Yesterday Congress introduced The National Guard Promotion Accountability Act, bills S. 2801 and HR. 5713, to address nearly 7,000 Guardsmen waiting for federal recognition of their promotions. For...
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CW5 (Join to see)
Here's the problem, tho. Leaving aside the 'automatic' scrolls (1LT and CW2), by my count, 13 of the 22 scrolls I track are at OSD. Five more have been newly scrolled in the past 6 weeks. If the directive is to the Service Secretaries, they are going to say they have already solved the problem (and I do believe SIGNIFICANT progress has been made). Although the 'planned' process is about 30 days at OSD, and they seem to be somewhat holding to that.
Although I support them, this is a VERY long-time gripe I have with NGAUS. They sometimes do these things that I believe are more directed at membership drives than reality. Things in the 90s that they boasted about every year, but never passed. 'Full' (rather than prorated) flight pay for Reservists, retirement pay at retirement rather than age 60. The 'early retirement pay' hole between 9-11 and Jan 2008 STILL hasn't been fixed.
I do believe that effective date of promotion at State orders date is just common sense. It used to be that FedRec was 'backdated' with an effective date of State orders. But it is a LONG way from a press release to implementation.
As I have said, WOs packets are allowed to go to the FRB 4 months before TIG requirements are met. That 'solution' has been around for almost 4 years.
And the whole 'Exemplary Conduct Screening' requirement, that mostly caused this delay was caused by the previous administration's SecDef.
Although I support them, this is a VERY long-time gripe I have with NGAUS. They sometimes do these things that I believe are more directed at membership drives than reality. Things in the 90s that they boasted about every year, but never passed. 'Full' (rather than prorated) flight pay for Reservists, retirement pay at retirement rather than age 60. The 'early retirement pay' hole between 9-11 and Jan 2008 STILL hasn't been fixed.
I do believe that effective date of promotion at State orders date is just common sense. It used to be that FedRec was 'backdated' with an effective date of State orders. But it is a LONG way from a press release to implementation.
As I have said, WOs packets are allowed to go to the FRB 4 months before TIG requirements are met. That 'solution' has been around for almost 4 years.
And the whole 'Exemplary Conduct Screening' requirement, that mostly caused this delay was caused by the previous administration's SecDef.
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CW5 (Join to see)
CW5 (Join to see) - They may solve one problem and create another in the process. Case in point. If an officer has seniority of +/- 1 year over another officer and is being promoted under the current process, 245-300+ days. The other officer gets promoted under the "fixed" system. The senior officer will most likely lose their TIG seniority to the other officer.
I would imagine that the army would recognize this and change the policy regarding submission of promotion packets to account for the new promotion timeline. When you are competing for a senior position, especially when there is a very limited number of them, TIG becomes even more important.
As for the exemplary screening, political leaders do not like getting poked in the eye. A GO or other senior officer that is visible to the public does something stupid, they get poked in the eye and hammered by their opponents because they promoted them. So in typical government fashion, they throw the baby out with the bath water. Now their theory is that if we can identify the "bad apples" early, we can prevent them from becoming "senior bad apples" and poking us in the eye.
I would imagine that the army would recognize this and change the policy regarding submission of promotion packets to account for the new promotion timeline. When you are competing for a senior position, especially when there is a very limited number of them, TIG becomes even more important.
As for the exemplary screening, political leaders do not like getting poked in the eye. A GO or other senior officer that is visible to the public does something stupid, they get poked in the eye and hammered by their opponents because they promoted them. So in typical government fashion, they throw the baby out with the bath water. Now their theory is that if we can identify the "bad apples" early, we can prevent them from becoming "senior bad apples" and poking us in the eye.
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MAJ (Join to see)
CW5 (Join to see) - Chief-that is the principle issue I have with this bill. If the TIG is adjusted to reflect state orders then it will create a seniority issue and further down the road-they are eligible for promotion sooner.
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P15-17, P01, P02, P03, P04, P05-18 all pretty much went through Scrolled, OTJAG, DMPM, SECDEF at the same time. Interesting to see in which order they will get published. Scroll number sequence means nothing apparently. PLACE YOUR BETS!!!
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LTC (Join to see)
Well hopefully we all won't sit at SECDEF for 90 days out of spite. I have AT on 31 May and it would be nice to make an additional $1000 for the effort. (P04-18)
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CPT (Join to see)
LTC (Join to see) - Im hopeful as well (P05-18). Started an ADOS tour, would be nice to get the additional pay. Heres to hoping orders will be published in the next week or two
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MAJ Kahren Aydinyan
The tracker was obviously lagging. There are many offices between JAG and Sec Army.
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