Posted on Sep 13, 2016
Would an E9 comply if ordered to attention by an O1?
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As a retired lifer, I will say I have seen a few E9s that needed to be dressed down by O1's, O2's & O3s. Funny story, about 39 years ago while in ADA, we had a smart-ass O9 that was coming around with a LTC (another useless position) for a MAIT inspection. I guess because he was with the LTC, he thought his $hit didn't stink. Well he came to out BOC site talking $hit and making lives miserable, he managed to alienate both the enlisted an our older 1Lt. Well he bite the wrong a$$. The Lt invited the SGM for a private conversation. When the returned the SGM looked a little ruffled but his attitude completely change. He treated us all with the respect we deserved being on the miserable hill in Germany. During the inspections deficiencies were discovered, we were given the change to correct for re-inspection. We came out looking good and better at our jobs because things were explained and we were better trained. It turns out that the Lt was an E-7 with about 11 years in service with a couple of tours in Vietnam before he was commissioned. He was fully aware what was NCO business and what was Officers business and did not cross the line and wasn't about to let the SGM cross the line. That scene stuck in my mind and made me a better NCO.
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The O1 would either get laughed at, or put in his place with a quickness. I don't know a single Master Chief that wouldn't lose his shit on the Ensign. I don't know how other services do things, but we don't play that shit in the Navy...at least not in the 19 years I've been in.
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CPO (Join to see)
Let me follow that up by saying the O1 would be pulled aside and it would be done in private, unless the O1 was really special and forced the E9s hand.
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As a former junior officer, I would have never presumed to "lock up" an E9. If I had a problem, or if there was a disagreement, a simple conversation would suffice. As it was, I had a ton of respect for my senior NCOs and never presumed I knew better than them since they had the wealth of experience and knowledge I did not. The way I saw it, if you weren't a dirtbag, I gave you the respect your rank and your person deserved. They were the ones training me to be a better leader and officer.
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I have personally seen a butter bar get his bell rung for arguing with a CSM, that major reamed him big time.
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I wouldn't count on it. Unless it was in front of young soldiers, and even then I doubt it.
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I had the luxury of getting to know my Battalion MSgt and working with him in country (Iraq) in 2007. As WPNS CO Police Sgt, it was an unspoken rule to familiarize ones self with as many people possible to improve the likelyhood of exemplary job performance. After we returned back to CONUS, he was promoted to MGySgt and even shared a soda with me down the road. One morning well after colors was played, he swung by the office and asked me to join him in the smoke pit. while there, he advised me that it had come to his attention that I would be receiving a personal award for my services in Iraq and wanted to congratulate me on the hard work put into it.
A 2ntLt was approaching and I uttered the traditional warning of "stand by...", to which he replied "no, we're talking, and the butter bar can wait for his salute". Speechless, I stood there with cigarette in hand with jaw dropped. The O-1 approached and opened up with "Marines, I do believe as an Officer I warrant a salute and an appropriate greeting of the day." To which the E-9 before me replied "Sir, this teufel and I are engaged in an important conversation to which you've rudely interrupted just because you've got something shiny on your collar. If you want a salute, you can climb over my chevrons and find one. Good morning, sir."
I know that was far from the right thing to do, but being outranked by both and witnessing the blatant disrespect, I undoubtedly would've received harsher words had I attempted to intercept the choice words.
On the other hand, I had finally seen what happens to an officer that barked at a senior enlisted Marine and I was very silently chuckling inside. It's still no excuse, as I should've said something. But for once, I enjoyed not being the one in a higher-ups crosshairs.
A 2ntLt was approaching and I uttered the traditional warning of "stand by...", to which he replied "no, we're talking, and the butter bar can wait for his salute". Speechless, I stood there with cigarette in hand with jaw dropped. The O-1 approached and opened up with "Marines, I do believe as an Officer I warrant a salute and an appropriate greeting of the day." To which the E-9 before me replied "Sir, this teufel and I are engaged in an important conversation to which you've rudely interrupted just because you've got something shiny on your collar. If you want a salute, you can climb over my chevrons and find one. Good morning, sir."
I know that was far from the right thing to do, but being outranked by both and witnessing the blatant disrespect, I undoubtedly would've received harsher words had I attempted to intercept the choice words.
On the other hand, I had finally seen what happens to an officer that barked at a senior enlisted Marine and I was very silently chuckling inside. It's still no excuse, as I should've said something. But for once, I enjoyed not being the one in a higher-ups crosshairs.
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Actually I'm a retired E-8 Infantry and had a few of these experiences personally. They never turned out well for the little shits that didn't know their butter bar was an opportunity to learn the real way of how the military works and not try to love themselves.
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As a new E-5, I was on CQ duty. About 05:45 1SGT comes in, followed about 5 minutes later by a newly minted O-1 reporting in for his first duty station. I came to attention, greeted him and was promptly chewed out for not saluting him. Top came out of his office, asked the O-1 to please step in his office with him. Top told me I was relieved and could go. He proceeded to chew this O-1 a new asshole. I was in the off base locker room preparing to leave for home when the O-1 knocked on the door, introduced himself as my new Plt Ldr and apologized for eating me out for not saluting indoors.
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