Would an E9 comply if ordered to attention by an O1?

I respect the O's, but I don't know any E7s that would let an O1 do that, let alone an E9.

In my experience, they wouldn't destroy the LT in public, but there's usually a follow up meeting with the BN or BDE Commander. A very, very, close and intimate meeting that can be described as "life changing." Rarely would the SGM openly rebuke an officer, only when necessity and common sense required.

I remember this actually happening in an MI unit I was assigned too in the 90s though I think it was O1 and 1SG. The 1SG was soon after it happened, the Bn staff SGM so it could have been after he made E9. Needless to say this O1 not only had a very rapid meeting with out Bn CDR but she also soon relieved of her duties (was S1 LT) and reassigned (or given the boot who knows).

Yeah technically, but this is not an all or nothing scenerio....very much a grey area. One the audacity of the LT would dictate where it goes, and more importantly the patience of the E9.
Remember the E9 has made his career and doesnt need promted, but that LT has stiff road to Maj and beyond. The politics of him getting there with behaivor like that could mean a very rough, difficult road with no future

Yes he would have to respond! Many (not all) E9's resent officers period. I had enlisted time (SGT) and Commissioned time. Taught HS JROTC. And many E9's in system had problems still working with Officers. Wish I knew why. Hope I just worked with egotistical Non Com's.

The way it was explained to me.
O1- never heard of god.
O2- has heard rumors that there is a god.
O3 - confirmed sightings of god.
O4 - brief encounters with god.
O5 - regular encounters with god.
O6 & above - communes with god.
E8 & above - god!
A good Senior NCO usually has the ability to take that "problem" out of the "public" location. Any intelligent 0-1 knows that the Senior NCO spends a lot more time (has the ear of) with the O-1's boss's boss's boss!

Had the a almost same experience as an E-3. On quarterdeck watch on Enterprise the Stennis was pier side. We carried 12 gauges for watch. The Stennis carried 9 mil. Our captains orders were not to salute anybody on watch just come to attention. Well... had a O-1 from the Stennis come across the brow. Popped to attention and said good morning sir. Which he replied shipmate where is my salute? I said Sir i do not salute when carrying this weapon per my co's orders...Sat there for a good 5 minutes demanding his salute. Never gave him one. Well the gunnery division warrant 4, 32 years in the navy btw...came by and heard what was going on an dragged that O-1 through the quarterdeck to the hangar bay and went up one side and down the other on this kid. I couldn't help it was laughing my ass off... The CO came aboard saw me smirking and heard the warrant screaming in the hangar bay... I told him what happened and the CO joined the warrant and about 5 minutes later that O-1 hauled ass across the brow no salute nothing. I just popped to attention and said sir....

E9 has earned their position with a LOT of time put in. A lt is what 3-5 years? Come on
Seniority rules. That's so disrespectful. Wouldn't have flown on my ship I'll tell ya that.

So back when I was a PVT, we had a new O1 arrive 30 minutes late to the BN. No one paid her any mind, as she was just a butter bar and all the BN/CO officers had arrived for the day.
So she flips out on the junior troops hanging around the staff duty desk. "Who's in charge here? Why didn't anyone call the bldg to attention when I walked in? I'm an officer!"
The outgoing staff duty runner, E4, acknowledged that he had just got off duty at work call, so she dropped him and started to berate him loudly for not calling her "ma'am" or standing at attention.
We all did a quick vanishing act, listening around the corners, and someone ran for the guy's NCO.
So SGT comes down to ask her, "What's going on here?"
She orders SGT to attention and goes off on him. He tells his troop to get out of there, troop doesn't need asking twice.
The commotion draws BN CSM'a attention. "What's going on here?"
This little short female LT faces off to our CSM (whose personal motto was "Strike Fear") and informs him that HIS BN is ate-up and lacking discipline and oh btw HE should stand at attention and call her "ma'am", because "technically, I outrank you!"
I've never seen CSM turn so red in my life... then he took a deliberate deep breathe and his face went back to normal, and he said, calmly, "Technically, you are correct, ma'am. But why don't we take this conversation to the BC's office just down the hall?"
BC was retiring. Gentle teddy bear of a man, anyone could walk in and ask, "So how 'bout them Yankees?" And be invited in eagerly, "Come in, come in, how's everything going?" Never saw him get mad before.

We. Could. Hear. Him. From. The. End. Of. The. Bldg!
Which is how I know that LT was BORN the year CSM enlisted!! LMAO!

Stationed in Alaska from '94-'97 as part of 4/9, 6th ID. I was working in the "S" shop for a while. One day, our CSM was trying to explain something, I honestly don't know what as up to this point it was a quiet conversation. The butterbar started screaming at the CSM that he had better get to the position of attention if he was going to speak to an officer. At this point, the entire building stopped breathing, and waited to see what our CSM was going to do. He snapped to attention, begged pardon from the butterbar, and just stood there looking at the wall behind this kid. When the O1 was done with his tirade, he had this smirk on his face and went about his business. Meanwhile, our CSM marched up to the Battalion Commanders office, and shut the door. 2 minutes later, we hear "He F***ing did what!?!?!? Get Lt. Cantrememberhisname in my office NOW!"

When the O1 entered his office, we all heard "Get into the position of attention! Sargent Major, please close the door." Thunk went the door. However, for the next 2ish plus hours, we heard yelling, and what I would have sworn was a first rate smoking session. As far as I know, that O1 never ever tried to do something like that again...

Even if the CSM is wrong, there's a tactful and professional way to handle that, then, there's this way. Just like there's a difference between saying "hey CSM, just wanted to let you know your boot's unbloused" and saying "hey, guy, fix yourself."

Under the uniform code of military justice, the short answer is yes. However, those of us who know how things are really done and where respect is really earned.

I think the word "attention" can be used in a fashion to where it feels like you're in control of a situation. No matter what your grade is or how many days you have left in the service, disrespect is disrespect. What goes for a private should go for an SGM/CSM

One of the best moments in my enlistment...
2nd LT walks by a MSgt and CWO3 talking. Neither salute
Lt: So neither of you have the intention of saluting an officer today?
MSgt: Sir, you can have our salute when you climb up our rockers to get it.
Lt walks away speechless.

I'd have come to attention right in his face and he'd have squirmed like the worm he is. I spent my last 10 years training officers and it's not hard to put them in their place without being insubordinate.

No way in hell a butter bae would dare call a CSM to attention. They wouldn't have the balls.

Yes by the book only respect for the rank

Yes

I've never seen an O1 so brave lol

01 can call an E9 to attention, not advisable but hey if he has the testicular fortitude to do so better stand by for heavy rolls afterwards

During the time I was in I saw several E9s and there were only a very few that could and would tell him or her what to do and I'm sorry to say it an OK was not one of them.

So 2LT tells BN CSM that her bar outranks his stripes and that he can't order an officer to do anything. This happens in the CSM's office. BN XO, ENG, prior INF, hears this. He calls thr 2LT into his office, and through a closed door, we hear him destroy her soul. "How can I give you a command if you don't respect your NCOs?" "He has been in this unit longer than you have been in the Army!" Et cetera, et cetera... when she was dismissed, she ran out crying.

Would he or she HAVE to comply? Technically, yes, or they would be in violation of military regulations. I would imagine there would be an interesting conversation shortly thereafter, however.

Well, you know the drill... If the situation is unethical, no! If the LT is legit, yes.

Technically, they should as it is a lawful order. The reaction of the E9 depends on the circumstances. In ceremony and day to day military courtesy it is appropriate for the E9 to set the example. If it originated from the O1's ego, there would certainly be a conversation that followed. A good E9 worth his salt would attempt to advise and mentor that young officer but if that officer was not receptive to the seasoned guidance being offered then it would be necessary to involve the CO.

It should never come to that.

Question should be: "Should an E9 comply if ordered to attention by an O1?" Yes, in public. no question. Maybe not in private (no audience). It boils down to a courtesy correction. I guess it really boils down to: are you truly a professional, or an ass-hat.

Yes

I saw a MGySgt tell a boot Lt. "Climb up my stripes and get it!!" in reference to a salute when i was a young boot... That man was like a god after i saw that happen hahaha

1) "That" is something that would never happen in the Corps. 2) SgtsMaj don't usually have the opportunity to interact with officers below Major unless it is in passing. 3) Rank is one thing; power is another. An 0-1 (or an O-2 or 0-3 for that matter) doesn't "out power" the SgtMaj.

In all technicalities yes he must comply. But the following shit storm will be funny to watch.

it is in the oath we take . I feel it would hold a little more credibility to the position of O-1 on up if the person coming into the officer ranks has at least an E5 befor they are commissioned. I feel there would be less of a breakdown of leadership. too many officers get a power trip because of a butter bar then end up getting people killed for stupid shit.

He would have to respond but I feel sorry for the LT

A outstanding Chief would comply for the sake of subordinates. However, I do believe that a private conversation will happen very soon afterwards.

I have seen both sides of this. Hash marks don' t always equate wisdom or competency. All junior officers are not idiots. You respect the rank and not the man or woman wearing it. There is a chain of command for a reason. I once saw a First Sargent attempt this with a Second Luitenant and was eaten alive by him. Second Louie was exactly right when he said you may not respect me but you will respect this pointing to his gold bar. There are plenty of examples on the other side. The best senior NCO's avoid this kind of dust up by establishing their worth not through bluster but rather competence.

He would sat that Lt straight

It's a lawful order and should be obeyed. You don't have to like it and can report if you feel it is retaliation for a disagreement.

As a professional NCO he should. He knows there will be another meeting in the Commanders office that will have corrective actions.

Yes. 2 Lt. Probably not going to like the ass ripping he's about to experience

Yes

I had a similar thing happen to me but it was a cadet trying to get me to go to attention and salute her while in airborne school and in the training area no less oh and I had already received my wings while she was still waiting to start training don't know if the story warrants further mentioning as this question is in reference to O-1's calling out E-9's.

Yes, and then rip his ass in private

The little butter bars better ready themselves for an ass beating!

In the late 70's I saw a CPT tell the division CSM to come to attention as the CSM was chewing on his 1SG after having the MP's called to their company Christmas party three times. It didn't end well for the CPT.

The O-1 is still an officer, so the E-9 would be compelled to obey his order. One thing I learned in the Navy is that you respect and salute the uniform, not necessarily the person wearing said uniform. Were junior enlisted to see the E-9 disregarding the O-1's order(s), a bad example would be set. Were this not to happen in front of other military members, a different outcome would most likely occur, but the O-1 is still an officer and the E-9 is still enlisted, so respect should still be rendered to the uniform, if nothing else.

That would be career suicide for the O-1, and would be commented on in his fitness report with great prejudice. However, I have always advised newly commissioned and junior officers that they are in charge and ultimately responsible. More than one officer has had his career ruined by not holding senior enlisted, including the E-9s, accountable, and when something goes wrong on your watch because of a drunk, an abusive individual, a dishonest or thieving individual, or a sexual harasser, make no mistake about it, the CO is going to hang you too. Do not be afraid to pull senior enlisted aside and give them clear expectations when you see something going on that you know isn't right. And do not EVER neglect your responsibility to document an individual's shortcomings in a performance evaluation.

I was a Corpsman (E3). One night working in the Medical Surgical ward, I had a patient began to come, VT. So I yelled to my nurse to call the code and I would rush the crash cart to the Bed Side. Of course LTJG bla Bla got upset and tried to put me in my place also claiming my patient was DNR. I repeatedly told him he was in fact NOT A DNR (do not resuscitate) so I told him to check his nursing notes and meet me at the bedside when he is ready to save his patients life. Needless to say he almost got sent to the record department for not responding correctly. Point being watch each other's backs both enlisted and officer alike. Yes we answer to officers but we have so much to offer as enlisted.

Had a 2d LT lock our 1SG up for something stupid.

2d LT spent the next few hours in the commander's office after he caught wind of it. Came out soaked in sweat.
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

In front of the troops, yes. He has to set the example.

But the instant it's no longer in front of junior enlisteds and VERY junior NCOs, poor butter bar's going to get his shinies all corroded by the language he's gonna hear...and if he goes running to the railroad tracks or bird...well, when he's done blushing over being laughed out of the CO's office, he'll have got the point.

Slap the butter bar right in his face !

Of course, the E-9 would come to attention.

I've seen this happen personally...the CSM was absolutely professional and complied then later in the day the Battalion Commander fully informed the young Lieutenant on the true food chain of the Army.

I have to agree I would like to be a fly on the wall behind the closed door meeting.

Yes, the Senior NCO would comply, IAW rules & regulations, not to mention NCO professional decorum.
But, the young lieutenant's military career would hit a wall!!

Yes he would have to comply to the direct order from a superior officer.

Of course he would. But that butter bar needs to be looking over his shoulder. One of the worst chewings I ever had was by my company First Sergeant when I was the company XO. He did it without raising his voice and with total respect. If young officers don't appreciate the wisdom of senior NCOs, their careers will be woefully short.

technically yes for the E9 is outranked by the young lt - it sucks but that's our military. I disagree with the fact that a 50 year old E9 who has 25 years in the military has to salute and take orders from a 19 or 20 year old 2nd LT who has been in the army 1 year if that. That's our military though. They have no experience, yes one day they will and I feel that the young officers should respect the SR NCOs enough in such a way as to not put them in such a position - it's not right at all.

1 MEF Ball 07. I'm in the Band and we had just finished setting up, so I walked outside for a smoke before a 2 hour jazz combo set. Saw a SGTMAJ helping his wife out the car as a 1LT went by. SGTMAJ sees him and acknowledges him. Officer gets huffy and says " SGTMAJ I didn't catch that salute." The SGTMAJ stops, looks at him and says: "Climb up my chevrons and get it. " I laughed and got yelled at by both. Great night .

We had a weak platoon leader bring our Div CSM into our training area and I yelled out "At East!!" The CSM walked up to me, shook my hand and smiled. The 2LT said to me; "for your information SGT, a 2LT out ranks a CSM." I responded with; "well sir, once you are SF, Master Blaster, CIB and silver star owner, I will show you that same respect." He just looked at me with that "deer in the headlight" look and walked off.

Diamonds are trump 1SG, and there are only 2 soldiers in the Army that wear stars..Generals and Sergeant Majors.