Posted on Feb 23, 2019
Would there be a reason my OIC can recommend civilians for an award but not military?
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Recently the results of our yearly TRICARE Inpatient Satisfaction Survey (TRISS) came out. The ward I work on had the highest overall patient satisfaction for the entire Regional Healthcare Command- Atlantic, which is a pretty big thing. The commanding general paid is a visit. I asked her about the possibility of recommending all the SMs on the floor for a JSAM since it’s a joint facility. She said she couldn’t do that for some reason that didn’t make sense. Would there be some reason as to why SMs couldn’t be recommended for an award but civilians could.
Posted in these groups: 
Awards
Joint Service
Awards Joint Service
Posted 5 y ago
Responses: 8
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Unless I misunderstood your question, recommending every SM for an award, barring some high speed operators for a significant operation during combat, isn't realistic. Then, everyone wouldn't likely be recommended for the same award.
A supervising NCO, and maybe the top 2 jr enlisted, "maybe."
Not a thorough research, but it appears it may not be authorized.
DOD MANUAL 1348.33, VOLUME 4 MANUAL OF MILITARY DECORATIONS AND AWARDS: DOD JOINT DECORATIONS AND AWARDS
(1) The JSAM is awarded in the name of the Secretary of Defense to members of the U.S. Armed Forces below the grade of O-6 who, while assigned to a JDA after August 3, 1983,
distinguished themselves by outstanding performance of duty, meritorious achievement, or
service.
(2) Service members assigned or attached to a JTF as individuals (not as members of a Service unit) may be eligible for the JSAM. Members of military-specific units (i.e., Army, Navy, Marine Corps, and Air Force) assigned or attached to a JDA or JTF are not eligible for the
JSAM but retain eligibility for PMDs and unit awards from their respective Military Service.
A few impact AAMs may be an option, depending on the factors.
A supervising NCO, and maybe the top 2 jr enlisted, "maybe."
Not a thorough research, but it appears it may not be authorized.
DOD MANUAL 1348.33, VOLUME 4 MANUAL OF MILITARY DECORATIONS AND AWARDS: DOD JOINT DECORATIONS AND AWARDS
(1) The JSAM is awarded in the name of the Secretary of Defense to members of the U.S. Armed Forces below the grade of O-6 who, while assigned to a JDA after August 3, 1983,
distinguished themselves by outstanding performance of duty, meritorious achievement, or
service.
(2) Service members assigned or attached to a JTF as individuals (not as members of a Service unit) may be eligible for the JSAM. Members of military-specific units (i.e., Army, Navy, Marine Corps, and Air Force) assigned or attached to a JDA or JTF are not eligible for the
JSAM but retain eligibility for PMDs and unit awards from their respective Military Service.
A few impact AAMs may be an option, depending on the factors.
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SPC (Join to see)
From reading all the comment it makes a little more sense. Not gonna lie it does suck a little that we out perform our entire hospital and the Atlantic region and we don’t get much to show for it. I know providing excellent care is part of our jobs but something would have been nice for a floor moral boost. Especially when our civilian counterparts are getting acknowledged for their efforts.
It is what it is though I know we’ll keep the high standard we have and try to do even better next time around.
It is what it is though I know we’ll keep the high standard we have and try to do even better next time around.
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1SG (Join to see)
SPC (Join to see)
I wouldn't give up on trying to get couple/few AAMs, and some certificates.
By the way, what award did the civilians get, and are they providing the same level of care, and have the same responsibilities?
If they got a cash award, that may have been easier to do.
USAMRMC has a slide show explaining their awards policy.
With regard to the JSAM, those are for JDA/JTF. In fact, for JTF, it's not available to members of units assigned to the JDA/JTF, rather, individuals assigned or attached as an individual. Simply put, the JSAM was the wrong one to ask for.
Although there are plenty of stories of more senior folks who chased CABs and/or submitted themselves for BSM w/V, for future reference it is poor etiquette to put a CDR on the spot, or ask for blanket awards. I do applaud your boldness, though. I may have gave you a scowl at the time, but I would've likely got you a 4-day pass later.
Submit a few AAMs if the achievement meets the requirement.
For future reference,
other than combat deployments, my recollection is 5-10% of a 100-Soldier unit would be recommended for achievement awards (ARTEPs [80s evaluated 72-hour FTX], JRTC, NTC, CIP, Qrtly Significant Event [like yours]), with 1 ARCOM, 3 AAMs.
3 DA Certificates (used to be worth promotion points), and 2-3 DIV/BDE/BN Certificates.
Do your research, and give it a shot. Win again next quarter, get a few more for others who earned it. Being present doesn't mean it's earned.
I wouldn't give up on trying to get couple/few AAMs, and some certificates.
By the way, what award did the civilians get, and are they providing the same level of care, and have the same responsibilities?
If they got a cash award, that may have been easier to do.
USAMRMC has a slide show explaining their awards policy.
With regard to the JSAM, those are for JDA/JTF. In fact, for JTF, it's not available to members of units assigned to the JDA/JTF, rather, individuals assigned or attached as an individual. Simply put, the JSAM was the wrong one to ask for.
Although there are plenty of stories of more senior folks who chased CABs and/or submitted themselves for BSM w/V, for future reference it is poor etiquette to put a CDR on the spot, or ask for blanket awards. I do applaud your boldness, though. I may have gave you a scowl at the time, but I would've likely got you a 4-day pass later.
Submit a few AAMs if the achievement meets the requirement.
For future reference,
other than combat deployments, my recollection is 5-10% of a 100-Soldier unit would be recommended for achievement awards (ARTEPs [80s evaluated 72-hour FTX], JRTC, NTC, CIP, Qrtly Significant Event [like yours]), with 1 ARCOM, 3 AAMs.
3 DA Certificates (used to be worth promotion points), and 2-3 DIV/BDE/BN Certificates.
Do your research, and give it a shot. Win again next quarter, get a few more for others who earned it. Being present doesn't mean it's earned.
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1SG (Join to see) Thanks 1SG, notes take the future. I’m still working on the boldness my NCOIC doesn’t like when I ask questions about any thing. He wants me to just follow orders no with out question no matter what.
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1SG (Join to see)
SPC (Join to see)
Each NCO has their own style, which you adopt to. They don't have to adopt to your preferred style.
Following orders is your duty, unless they are unlawful. Constant questioning, gets weary quick.
When you're in charge, choose your own. I suggest you'll find it to be situation dependent, as mine was.
Whenever I took over a new position, I explained:
If I have time, and want to teach something, I will explain, so you understand my thought process and will know, generally, what I expect in case I am absent. This will also help you develop your process.
There will be times when I won't explain because the situation doesn't permit, or because I don't feel inclined.
If I give you a task without specific instructions, complete it the way you believe is best.
If I give you specific instructions, or steps, follow them precisely, as there is a reason that I may, or may not share. But, it will be obvious in the end.
Again, that was my style. I worked for NCOs who I not only thought were incompetent, I knew it. At times it appeared everyone else, including leadership knew it. But, I understood my position, and my role, and kept my thoughts to myself. I covered them by taking the initiative when I could.
Boldness is fine, when appropriate, and following lawful orders is always appropriate. If it doesn't violate the law, isn't unethical, and isn't a very clear safety violation, make it happen.
I hope you refer to AR 600-8-22, and look to some of the examples of DA Form 638 online if you need additional examples, and submit your supervisor, or the most high speed PFC on your ward for an AAM or COA.
I wish you well.
Each NCO has their own style, which you adopt to. They don't have to adopt to your preferred style.
Following orders is your duty, unless they are unlawful. Constant questioning, gets weary quick.
When you're in charge, choose your own. I suggest you'll find it to be situation dependent, as mine was.
Whenever I took over a new position, I explained:
If I have time, and want to teach something, I will explain, so you understand my thought process and will know, generally, what I expect in case I am absent. This will also help you develop your process.
There will be times when I won't explain because the situation doesn't permit, or because I don't feel inclined.
If I give you a task without specific instructions, complete it the way you believe is best.
If I give you specific instructions, or steps, follow them precisely, as there is a reason that I may, or may not share. But, it will be obvious in the end.
Again, that was my style. I worked for NCOs who I not only thought were incompetent, I knew it. At times it appeared everyone else, including leadership knew it. But, I understood my position, and my role, and kept my thoughts to myself. I covered them by taking the initiative when I could.
Boldness is fine, when appropriate, and following lawful orders is always appropriate. If it doesn't violate the law, isn't unethical, and isn't a very clear safety violation, make it happen.
I hope you refer to AR 600-8-22, and look to some of the examples of DA Form 638 online if you need additional examples, and submit your supervisor, or the most high speed PFC on your ward for an AAM or COA.
I wish you well.
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It’s a really sticky slippery slope when it comes to awards especially on active duty at her level. Civilians stay there at that one location whereas service members are ther usually two to three years. I’m not trying to give excuses just that I can see a perception that you would see it the way you asked your question. Your Supervisors up to a couple levels up as well as your peers are the ones that saw who went above and beyond Twitter work and who did there job. Giving out a blanket award especially at the Commendation Level would potentially “cheapen” the award at that unit. That’s just my Humble opinion based on the limited information provided by your question.
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Anyone can recommend someone for an award. She couldn't or wouldn't? Big difference. What service is your OIC? I have seen quirky circumstances where Navy and Air Force are stingy with awards and draconian oversight of the submissions. In the case of the Navy, the recommendations from sister service personnel had to vetted at Department level. Has the approval authority layered some rules of delegation in that are not readily known?
There could be a host of reasons why civilians could be recommended and not Service members, especially if this is fruit born from an extended long-term effort on their part outside of what the more transient service members had accomplished.
Without knowing what the Commander's award philosophy is, it's hard to tell anything else. They may look at a JSAM as a PCS award since it is Joint and harder to get. JSAMs were awarded like AAMs in my joint assignement in NATO where the approval authority was collocated. JSAMs, JCOMs, and DMSMs were routinely awarded as PCS awards. The officers tended to recommend more junior people for Joint awards for big training events and combined exercises where they contributed significantly. It was not consistent but it was better than nothing. The NATO force structure is predicated on training exercises in other places so a three or four star exercise was a big deal.
There could be a host of reasons why civilians could be recommended and not Service members, especially if this is fruit born from an extended long-term effort on their part outside of what the more transient service members had accomplished.
Without knowing what the Commander's award philosophy is, it's hard to tell anything else. They may look at a JSAM as a PCS award since it is Joint and harder to get. JSAMs were awarded like AAMs in my joint assignement in NATO where the approval authority was collocated. JSAMs, JCOMs, and DMSMs were routinely awarded as PCS awards. The officers tended to recommend more junior people for Joint awards for big training events and combined exercises where they contributed significantly. It was not consistent but it was better than nothing. The NATO force structure is predicated on training exercises in other places so a three or four star exercise was a big deal.
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1SG (Join to see)
I didn't see any multi service medical centers in the list of JDA, but I only made a cursory look, and it's definitely not a JTF. Requirement for the JSAM, based on the reference in my other post list JDA or JTF as a requirement.
I could be mistaken.
I could be mistaken.
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SPC (Join to see)
Our facility is Defense Health Agency (DHA) so it’s jointly staffed. That could also be why she can’t because it’s DHA.
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1SG (Join to see)
SPC (Join to see) - Correct, jointly staffed is not JDA or JTF. To be truthful, even as a 1SG, I believed that Soldiers assigned to a joint command were eligible, until I was writing questions for a board.
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