Posted on Apr 8, 2015
Veterans: Have you joined the American Legion or VFW? Why or why not?
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As I wrote this, responses to that question were arriving every minute from the "Vietnam Veterans Only" group on Facebook. It seems my question hit a nerve. Take a look at a random sampling of the responses in the image...
Can you imagine my surprise?
I was fortunate that, when I completed my tour of duty in Vietnam, I was assigned to a post in Hawaii where there was little hostility between the military and civilian communities. Thus, I was spared the abuses that many Vietnam Veterans experienced on their return to CONUS (the Continental United States). I am appalled to learn that my comrades could not find sanctuary even among other veterans. It seems “The Greatest Generation” wasn't as great as I once believed.
On Veterans Day and Memorial Day over the years, as we passed Veterans soliciting donations in exchange for a “Buddy Poppy”, my wife would ask me, “Why don't you join?” I merely shrugged and replied, “Those organizations are for 'real' soldiers. They don't want any REMFs hanging around.”
REMFs are Rear Echelon Mother F*****s, the ones who served “in the rear with the gear”. To be more precise, they were the commanders who sent troops in harm’s way, often disastrously, without exposing themselves to danger. So no, I wasn't one of those and, in truth, there weren't many “rear areas” in Vietnam. Base camps, such as the one to which I was assigned, were located all over the countryside and every perimeter was a front line. Also, in addition to administrative duties, I was a platoon leader for the base camp security force inasmuch as I was a trained infantry officer. Thus, my real reason for not joining, I suppose, was that I never felt the need.
Things changed as news broke about the scandals within the Veterans Administration. As we learned of Veterans dying while languishing on secret waiting lists and other systemic failures, I decided that I had to do something. We were taught as Soldiers to take care of one another on the battlefield. How could we do any less in these circumstances?
I joined both the American Legion and the Veterans of Foreign Wars and attended a couple meetings for both. The VFW post in my community seemed better organized, and I began focusing my attentions there; however, I intend on devoting more time to the American Legion once I'm settled into the VFW.
We visit patients at the Veterans Hospital in Long Beach and the Navy Hospital near Camp Pendleton to cater events for them, sponsor student competitions and award prizes for scholarship, sanction Boy Scout units, and provide honor guards for Veterans' burials as well as community events. One of our most valuable services is helping Veterans apply for VA benefits and shepherding them through the red tape jungle. Like all other VFW posts, we contribute to our national organization and the homes they maintain for widows and orphans of Veterans who have fought in foreign wars.
I'm sure the activities vary from one post to another, but there hasn't been any drinking or smoking at mine (yet).
To be honest, there are a few WWII and Korean Veterans still hanging on, but Vietnam Veterans seem to predominate, at least among those who attend meetings. I'm especially happy to see younger veterans fresh from the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq joining. Hopefully, we can help them network for education and job opportunities as they transition to civilian life. I certainly won't be displaying the behavior Vietnam Veterans experienced when they attempted to join, and I won't permit it to go unchallenged if others try.
Can you imagine my surprise?
I was fortunate that, when I completed my tour of duty in Vietnam, I was assigned to a post in Hawaii where there was little hostility between the military and civilian communities. Thus, I was spared the abuses that many Vietnam Veterans experienced on their return to CONUS (the Continental United States). I am appalled to learn that my comrades could not find sanctuary even among other veterans. It seems “The Greatest Generation” wasn't as great as I once believed.
On Veterans Day and Memorial Day over the years, as we passed Veterans soliciting donations in exchange for a “Buddy Poppy”, my wife would ask me, “Why don't you join?” I merely shrugged and replied, “Those organizations are for 'real' soldiers. They don't want any REMFs hanging around.”
REMFs are Rear Echelon Mother F*****s, the ones who served “in the rear with the gear”. To be more precise, they were the commanders who sent troops in harm’s way, often disastrously, without exposing themselves to danger. So no, I wasn't one of those and, in truth, there weren't many “rear areas” in Vietnam. Base camps, such as the one to which I was assigned, were located all over the countryside and every perimeter was a front line. Also, in addition to administrative duties, I was a platoon leader for the base camp security force inasmuch as I was a trained infantry officer. Thus, my real reason for not joining, I suppose, was that I never felt the need.
Things changed as news broke about the scandals within the Veterans Administration. As we learned of Veterans dying while languishing on secret waiting lists and other systemic failures, I decided that I had to do something. We were taught as Soldiers to take care of one another on the battlefield. How could we do any less in these circumstances?
I joined both the American Legion and the Veterans of Foreign Wars and attended a couple meetings for both. The VFW post in my community seemed better organized, and I began focusing my attentions there; however, I intend on devoting more time to the American Legion once I'm settled into the VFW.
We visit patients at the Veterans Hospital in Long Beach and the Navy Hospital near Camp Pendleton to cater events for them, sponsor student competitions and award prizes for scholarship, sanction Boy Scout units, and provide honor guards for Veterans' burials as well as community events. One of our most valuable services is helping Veterans apply for VA benefits and shepherding them through the red tape jungle. Like all other VFW posts, we contribute to our national organization and the homes they maintain for widows and orphans of Veterans who have fought in foreign wars.
I'm sure the activities vary from one post to another, but there hasn't been any drinking or smoking at mine (yet).
To be honest, there are a few WWII and Korean Veterans still hanging on, but Vietnam Veterans seem to predominate, at least among those who attend meetings. I'm especially happy to see younger veterans fresh from the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq joining. Hopefully, we can help them network for education and job opportunities as they transition to civilian life. I certainly won't be displaying the behavior Vietnam Veterans experienced when they attempted to join, and I won't permit it to go unchallenged if others try.
Posted in these groups: 
The American Legion
Camaraderie
Veterans of Foreign Wars (VFW)
Command Post
Millennials
The American Legion Camaraderie Veterans of Foreign Wars (VFW) Command Post Millennials
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 202
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I am an Iraq vet and belong to the American Legion. Most likely one of the youngest (33) in my post and definitely the youngest officer (1st Vice Commander). While I can join the VFW, I just haven't done so. Basically, I want to be part of something I join and I spend a lot of my time at the Legion. It amazes me how much we do just at our Post level - and so much more at state and National levels. Many veterans think of these places as an afterthought and an old mans club - simply true! I love coming to my post and speaking with WWII and Korean veterans, of which are dwindling each year. It's touching to see the faces of our older veterans when they speak Of their time in service. More importantly, it's rewarding to help out others - a veteran, family members of vets, our children and our community. For those who are not members, you need to join! Collectively, we have a voice in Washington with the Legion and other veteran service organizations. If any one has any questions about the Legion, feel free to ask away!
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CPT Jack Durish
I love meeting and listening to the older members. Right now I'm conducting a series of interviews with one old Marine who participated in one of the atomic tests in Nevada during the 1950s. I'll be posting his story on my blog and our VFW post website in the near future.
BTW, I turn off auto correct on the computer. That's my wife's function...
BTW, I turn off auto correct on the computer. That's my wife's function...
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At first I joined only the VFW. Not because I thought it was better, I am the only veteran in my family so organizations like the DAV, American Legion and the VFW were new to me. The VFW "came" to me and sought me out. At first I didn't want to join more than one. I felt joining an organization I did not have the time to participate in was "wrong". I later learned that the work all the VSO organizations do at a legislative level is based on numbers. The more members the better. I am a member of the VFW, DAV and the American Legion.
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I'm a member of my local VFW Chapter.
I joined because my Uncle is a Vietname Veteran and is the Quartermaster for the Post. Upon joining I realized there aren't many younger Veterans and the ones that are there, it's hard to get their opinion valued.
I was voted in as the Junior Vice Commander (going on my third year now) to try and get more younger Veterans to join and head-up fundraising activities.
My biggest complaint is the amount of bureaucracy at the meetings. Second to that is that there aren't many members that show up to events other than the post Officers. The others just show up to the Post to drink and watch sports, but do not contribute to events. In addition, everyone wants to raise money, but it is difficult to get anything pushed through with enough buy in and support.
An example of this is that my brother wanted to do a 5K walk/run/hike but the level of detail desired from the post just to move forward with planning was ridiculous and many wouldn't offer buy in unless the entire thing was planned with no commitment. Many weren't even willing to help him (even though he was willing to do 90% of the planning).
We do a good job executing Color Guards for Veterans Day, Memorial Day, and Funerals. However, one of the other major issues is a lot of events get planned during the day when younger Veterans are working. Their thought process is that it'll get more older Veterans to show up, but consequently you lose out on a lot of support.
Funding and membership for the individual posts seems to be a huge issue since there are less and less Veterans joining as well. Until these organizations start doing more to reach out to younger Veterans I don't see them lasting much longer, despite the good that they do for Veterans through lobbying.
I joined because my Uncle is a Vietname Veteran and is the Quartermaster for the Post. Upon joining I realized there aren't many younger Veterans and the ones that are there, it's hard to get their opinion valued.
I was voted in as the Junior Vice Commander (going on my third year now) to try and get more younger Veterans to join and head-up fundraising activities.
My biggest complaint is the amount of bureaucracy at the meetings. Second to that is that there aren't many members that show up to events other than the post Officers. The others just show up to the Post to drink and watch sports, but do not contribute to events. In addition, everyone wants to raise money, but it is difficult to get anything pushed through with enough buy in and support.
An example of this is that my brother wanted to do a 5K walk/run/hike but the level of detail desired from the post just to move forward with planning was ridiculous and many wouldn't offer buy in unless the entire thing was planned with no commitment. Many weren't even willing to help him (even though he was willing to do 90% of the planning).
We do a good job executing Color Guards for Veterans Day, Memorial Day, and Funerals. However, one of the other major issues is a lot of events get planned during the day when younger Veterans are working. Their thought process is that it'll get more older Veterans to show up, but consequently you lose out on a lot of support.
Funding and membership for the individual posts seems to be a huge issue since there are less and less Veterans joining as well. Until these organizations start doing more to reach out to younger Veterans I don't see them lasting much longer, despite the good that they do for Veterans through lobbying.
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CPT Jack Durish
...and thus it is with all organizations (commercial as well as volunteer) 10% do 90%. Except, of course, the government wherein no one does much of anything worthwhile. Organizations only work when leaders do everything themselves or figure out how to inspire the rest to pitch in
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MAJ (Join to see)
Agreed. However, in an organization like the VFW, that attitude should not be prevalent.
Additionally, you can only do so much, especially if there aren't people joining to help change the culture.
Additionally, you can only do so much, especially if there aren't people joining to help change the culture.
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I'm with the American Legion, VFW, DAV, and the FRA; Fleet Reserve Association. I joined to get the benefits of having representatives being able to speak on my behalf for veteran concerns.
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SSG Buddy Kemper
I was in VFW years ago, but haven't paid dues or been out to the post in a long time. Am going to join DAV and the Legion soon.
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Sgt Jay Jones
SSG Buddy Kemper, I belong to the Disabled American Veterans (DAV). I joined them help me file my disability claim with the VA. I also belong to the Veterans of Foreign Wars (VFW - Lifetime Member), the American Legion, Marine Corps League, and a local organization called the Mansfield (TX) Area Marines (MAM). I joined these organizations because of what they do for veterans as well a means of giving back to veterans and the communities who support us.
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I'm a life member of the VFW and American Legion. I joined them both because I value what the organizations bring to the community and Veterans as a whole. My current problem is that there's not an active post nearby. The VFW closed and the Legion does very little.
My experiences have been mostly positive, but there are certainly some negative ones as well. I had a Viet Nam Veteran once denigrate my time in Iraq, much like WWII Veterans probably did to him. With a 40+ year gap between generations of Veterans, I think there's also a level of disconnect between the groups. It's hard for us to relate to one another. There's also a certain level of resistance to change and accepting younger leadership. How many Veterans in their 50's and 60's want to listen to a 28 year old Iraq Veteran in a leadership position? How many posts are willing to change to appeal to the new generation?
The only organization I participate in regularly is AMVETS. They're the most inclusive, which means we have a larger post. Unlike the Legion or VFW, Veterans who did not serve during a time of war are eligible to join. Even then I struggle to remain involved, simply due to work, school, children, drill weekends, etc.
My experiences have been mostly positive, but there are certainly some negative ones as well. I had a Viet Nam Veteran once denigrate my time in Iraq, much like WWII Veterans probably did to him. With a 40+ year gap between generations of Veterans, I think there's also a level of disconnect between the groups. It's hard for us to relate to one another. There's also a certain level of resistance to change and accepting younger leadership. How many Veterans in their 50's and 60's want to listen to a 28 year old Iraq Veteran in a leadership position? How many posts are willing to change to appeal to the new generation?
The only organization I participate in regularly is AMVETS. They're the most inclusive, which means we have a larger post. Unlike the Legion or VFW, Veterans who did not serve during a time of war are eligible to join. Even then I struggle to remain involved, simply due to work, school, children, drill weekends, etc.
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CPT Jack Durish
MAJ (Join to see) I'm really sad to hear that a Vietnam Vet was disrespectful of your service. Generally, we Vietnam Vets are dedicated to the proposition that no veteran ever again be treated as we were. Sadly there are those individuals... During my time in the service it was a popular maxim that "Somewhere there's someone who didn't get the 'word'. Go find him." Obviously, you found such a one.
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MAJ (Join to see)
CPT Jack Durish
So far the petty individuals have been in the extreme minority. I'm not sure why some people feel the need to behave that way. We do need to police such individuals up though. It's very easy to turn someone off to an organization if that's their first experience. It's that much harder to recruit them again after such an experience as well.
Overall I'm very grateful for what the Viet Nam generation of Veterans has done for us. When I came back from deployment we had Patriot Guard riders escort us over 3 hours from the airport to the armory. Once in town, the streets were lined by everybody from children in school to the local police. There were flags and all sorts of decorations up and down the street. I firmly believe we have our Viet Nam Vets to thank for this. They made sure we got the warm welcome that they didn't.
So far the petty individuals have been in the extreme minority. I'm not sure why some people feel the need to behave that way. We do need to police such individuals up though. It's very easy to turn someone off to an organization if that's their first experience. It's that much harder to recruit them again after such an experience as well.
Overall I'm very grateful for what the Viet Nam generation of Veterans has done for us. When I came back from deployment we had Patriot Guard riders escort us over 3 hours from the airport to the armory. Once in town, the streets were lined by everybody from children in school to the local police. There were flags and all sorts of decorations up and down the street. I firmly believe we have our Viet Nam Vets to thank for this. They made sure we got the warm welcome that they didn't.
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VFW they do a lot of good for us while we are in and after we are out of uniform. They also do a lot for the community as a whole, I am a proud member.
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I finally joined the VFW about 2 years ago, to be honest it was more for selfish reasons initially. I was trying to get more involved with the community and find organizations to become a member of to boost a particular award that I was being nominated for at the time. However, it was one of the best things I could have done, I wish I had jooined sooner (then again, my wife and I are probably one of the youngest ones in there lol! So I guess I have a lot of time). Hopefully soon I can do the lifetime membership!
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CPT Jack Durish
TSgt (Join to see) Sadly, at 72 I feel like a youngster at most VFW meetings. We need some young blood (an opinion that I've been attempting to act on)
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I am a VFW Life Member and an American Legion Member. My Posts are decent with good leadership, but I am usually too busy with my full time job or Veteran Outreach to be involved. Maybe when I retire.
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CPT Jack Durish
LTC Gavin Heater Trust me. Retirement is a wonderful opportunity to do all those things you always wanted to do. Just keep in mind that it only works if you survive until then which is why it helps to make at least a little time for those other things until you reach retirement
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PO3 Nichalas Enser
Good for you, LTC Gavin Heater ! We all can help our communities in many ways, it sounds like you are out there, enough, now.
Though a PUFL/Lifelong of both organizations, myself, have not had time to explore the local posts, enough, to affiliate. Hopefully, soon!
Both organizations do a ton of good work for active duty and veterans - we *need* to impress upon all active folks, those retiring/retired, and those separating/separated, that they and their shipmates/battle buddies will be well-served by joining and being active.
Though a PUFL/Lifelong of both organizations, myself, have not had time to explore the local posts, enough, to affiliate. Hopefully, soon!
Both organizations do a ton of good work for active duty and veterans - we *need* to impress upon all active folks, those retiring/retired, and those separating/separated, that they and their shipmates/battle buddies will be well-served by joining and being active.
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Yes, I was given a 1-year VFW Membership as a retirement gift, and now I'm Adjutant of my Post, #3282 in Port Orange, FL.
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CPT Jack Durish
Adjutant? Yes, I got suckered into that job too. It really isn't that bad until you look for a replacement and discover that no one else wants the job
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I am a member of the American Legion, AF Sergeants Association, NCOA, and a life member of AMVETS. I am not eligible for membership in the VFW as most of my service was during the Cold War, and was in Recruiting during the First Gulf War and Iraq/Afghanistan campaigns so did not deploy. I believe that all of these organization do an outstanding job in serving veterans and military personnel, as well as lobbying for all on issues that affect us all, both veterans and those still serving. I recommend that we all take the time to be involved with at least one of them as it is one for us to "continue to serve" and ensure that we will always have a voice!
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