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The waiver did not last long. Interesting how the decision was presented:
"The official said the suspension had “more to do with ensuring that we set the recruits...up for success” rather than “perception of a lowered standard” to join."
The person who wrote the article seemed dubious about that comment . . .
"The official said the suspension had “more to do with ensuring that we set the recruits...up for success” rather than “perception of a lowered standard” to join."
The person who wrote the article seemed dubious about that comment . . .
Army drops high school education waivers after a week
Posted from armytimes.com
Recruiting
Waivers
Education
High School Diploma
Edited 2 y ago
Posted 2 y ago
Responses: 2
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So we are going to increase recruiting of the dumbest available candidates (those with an AFQT well below the bottom third) but don't want to recruit above average candidates (those with an AFQT above 50) if they didn't finish high school.
That MIGHT be a good decision -- or it might not -- but it seems to be driven by two assumptions:
1) The AFQT is seriously flawed
and
2) The willingness to show up for high school is more important than whatever someone might or might not learn in high school.
I have little doubt that #1 is true.
I have mixed feelings about #2.
That MIGHT be a good decision -- or it might not -- but it seems to be driven by two assumptions:
1) The AFQT is seriously flawed
and
2) The willingness to show up for high school is more important than whatever someone might or might not learn in high school.
I have little doubt that #1 is true.
I have mixed feelings about #2.
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SGT Mary G.
MSG Thomas Currie Agree.
In retrospect, if I had been in a position to be able to do so, I would have quit HS at 16, taken the GED and started community college early. But it kept us out or our parent's way, and in a relatively safe place during the day . . . many decades ago. These days, high schoolers simultaneously take college courses, do group work, and have a wider variety of classes. Maybe HS is more worthwhile than it used to be.
In retrospect, if I had been in a position to be able to do so, I would have quit HS at 16, taken the GED and started community college early. But it kept us out or our parent's way, and in a relatively safe place during the day . . . many decades ago. These days, high schoolers simultaneously take college courses, do group work, and have a wider variety of classes. Maybe HS is more worthwhile than it used to be.
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MSG Thomas Currie
SGT Mary G. - The value of High School varies greatly from one school to another and from one student to another for a lot of reasons.
Most of urban public schools today are mediocre or worse. Pretty much every time the federal government has attempted to 'fix' public schools, the unintended consequences have outweighed the expected results. We identified a problem with "inner city schools" being inferior to suburban schools... so we dragged all schools down to make them equal. We identified a problem with some students failing, so we adopted the "No Child Left Behind" law, which really should have been titled the "No Child Gets Ahead" law because the main effect was to hold all students down to the lowest common denominator. Activists decided it was unfair to "isolate" students with special needs so those needs could be met -- so now we "mainstream" everyone so special needs students disrupt the entire classroom and the entire class proceeds at the pace of the slowest student. "Experts" told us discipline stifles creativity, so we no longer expect students to sit quietly in class.
I finished high school about the time you were born, so my entire education was in a different world. When I first entered school, kindergarten and formal daycare were unheard of. We started school in the 1st grade (hence the name) and it was a full six-hour day of school -- if you wanted to run around and play, you got a chance to do that for about 20-30 minutes after lunch. The class size was 60 students -- with one teacher and one assistant. From second grade on, we were split into two classes, so the class size was 30 students with 1 teacher (plus occasionally a visit from another teacher for subjects like art or music). By the end of the first week, the teacher knew the names of every student in the class and was perfectly capable of discussing any student's performance.
This was a 'neighborhood' school, so most of us walked to school. Most of the teachers also lived in the neighborhood. It wasn't unusual to run into a teacher when going to the store or any other activity in the evening or weekends. During any of these random chance encounters the teacher would recognize the student and usually recognize the parents -- with no notice and no notes, any of the teachers could readily discuss each student's performance with the parents.
Fast-forward two generations to my grand-daughter attending a very different local school where the maximum class size was 18 with a teacher and 1 or 2 assistants (and the teachers complaining about the excessively large class size), half-way through the school year we attended a scheduled parent-teacher conference. The teacher had to ask my grand-daughter her name (despite the time being scheduled and posted), then even though she had her notebook open, the teacher still mixed up which student she was talking to us about and had no clue how our grand-daughter was doing in her class.
Most of urban public schools today are mediocre or worse. Pretty much every time the federal government has attempted to 'fix' public schools, the unintended consequences have outweighed the expected results. We identified a problem with "inner city schools" being inferior to suburban schools... so we dragged all schools down to make them equal. We identified a problem with some students failing, so we adopted the "No Child Left Behind" law, which really should have been titled the "No Child Gets Ahead" law because the main effect was to hold all students down to the lowest common denominator. Activists decided it was unfair to "isolate" students with special needs so those needs could be met -- so now we "mainstream" everyone so special needs students disrupt the entire classroom and the entire class proceeds at the pace of the slowest student. "Experts" told us discipline stifles creativity, so we no longer expect students to sit quietly in class.
I finished high school about the time you were born, so my entire education was in a different world. When I first entered school, kindergarten and formal daycare were unheard of. We started school in the 1st grade (hence the name) and it was a full six-hour day of school -- if you wanted to run around and play, you got a chance to do that for about 20-30 minutes after lunch. The class size was 60 students -- with one teacher and one assistant. From second grade on, we were split into two classes, so the class size was 30 students with 1 teacher (plus occasionally a visit from another teacher for subjects like art or music). By the end of the first week, the teacher knew the names of every student in the class and was perfectly capable of discussing any student's performance.
This was a 'neighborhood' school, so most of us walked to school. Most of the teachers also lived in the neighborhood. It wasn't unusual to run into a teacher when going to the store or any other activity in the evening or weekends. During any of these random chance encounters the teacher would recognize the student and usually recognize the parents -- with no notice and no notes, any of the teachers could readily discuss each student's performance with the parents.
Fast-forward two generations to my grand-daughter attending a very different local school where the maximum class size was 18 with a teacher and 1 or 2 assistants (and the teachers complaining about the excessively large class size), half-way through the school year we attended a scheduled parent-teacher conference. The teacher had to ask my grand-daughter her name (despite the time being scheduled and posted), then even though she had her notebook open, the teacher still mixed up which student she was talking to us about and had no clue how our grand-daughter was doing in her class.
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SGT Mary G.
MSG Thomas Currie - Clearly high school differs from place to place, and in time. Big differences in many ways.
My Dad and all his siblings attended a rural one room school house in the mid 1920s onward, that was the church on Sundays. the Grange hall as needed . . . what we consider a "Community Center" these days. It's now on the Historic Register.
I walked a mile to school and a mile home - uphills and downhills both ways, in all weather, K - 3rd grade. Sounds like the start of that old joke . . . but true for many of us. lol
The folks were afraid the school system was not up to par with the "big city" (Seattle) when we moved. Myself and one of the boys in the 4th grade class tested highest with the same score in the standardized test. So comparitively either our small town schools were up to par, or the Seattle school district was not, lol.
I'm thinking we are more than likely closer to being contemporaries in age than not. I enlisted shortly before turning 36! Graduated 66.
My Dad and all his siblings attended a rural one room school house in the mid 1920s onward, that was the church on Sundays. the Grange hall as needed . . . what we consider a "Community Center" these days. It's now on the Historic Register.
I walked a mile to school and a mile home - uphills and downhills both ways, in all weather, K - 3rd grade. Sounds like the start of that old joke . . . but true for many of us. lol
The folks were afraid the school system was not up to par with the "big city" (Seattle) when we moved. Myself and one of the boys in the 4th grade class tested highest with the same score in the standardized test. So comparitively either our small town schools were up to par, or the Seattle school district was not, lol.
I'm thinking we are more than likely closer to being contemporaries in age than not. I enlisted shortly before turning 36! Graduated 66.
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MSG Thomas Currie
SGT Mary G. - Yes, a lot closer to contemporaries than I had thought from your dates of service. I graduated HS in 1965, but would have been in the Class of '66 except that I started school one term earlier than my birth date called for. I missed the cutoff to enter the 1st grade by one week. My mother thought that was unreasonable so she argued with the school and they let me attend 1st grade 'on trial' -- I pulled straight A's so I got to stay. (It's not that I was exceptionally smart but my one close friend was one year older than I was. Like most of us back then, she had to do her homework before she could play. I usually sat with her while she did the homework. When I started school the following year everything was stuff I had already seen.)
Back then, NY schools started a fresh class twice each year. I was in the class that started in January, not September. When I was in the 5th grade they decided to abolish that system, so everyone who was in the January classes had to do a full year's work in half a year -- if you passed you ended up in the regular September to June class for the next grade -- If you failed you still ended up in the regular September to June class, but in the grade behind. (I think all but one of us passed).
Back then, NY schools started a fresh class twice each year. I was in the class that started in January, not September. When I was in the 5th grade they decided to abolish that system, so everyone who was in the January classes had to do a full year's work in half a year -- if you passed you ended up in the regular September to June class for the next grade -- If you failed you still ended up in the regular September to June class, but in the grade behind. (I think all but one of us passed).
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