Posted on Sep 6, 2016
Are your kids back in school? Time to apologize to them | Fox News
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Dr. Ablow makes some great points and offers a couple out-of-the-box ideas. And we could get the funds to rapidly implement his changes if we (also) cut the Dept Of Education by 50%. What do you think?
Are your kids back in school? Time to apologize to them | Fox News
Posted from foxnews.com
Education
Government
Children
Posted >1 y ago
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Here's a better idea: Let's stop listening to people who have no training in education. Let's hire twice as many teachers, double their salaries so we can reduce classroom size and help the teachers focus on their jobs and not how they are going to pay back their student loans. Smaller classroom size always leads to better education, or so the studies show. We need to increase the amount of time the teachers can interact with the students, not limit it. We need to stop letting our politicians dictate the How and Why of teaching and let the teachers do their jobs.
And, gentlemen, you can do basic math in your head, without the need of a calculator, BECAUSE of the pointless memorization that you lament about.
And, gentlemen, you can do basic math in your head, without the need of a calculator, BECAUSE of the pointless memorization that you lament about.
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Col Joseph Lenertz
SGT Edward Wilcox - I completely agree we are over-focused on sending nearly every student to a 4-year degree program and we should bring back significant tech school prep to secondary schools. I would be interested to see any studies proving or showing in a statistically relevant way, that private schools are doing worse than public schools. I am not one to believe that for-profit is worse (or better, necessarily) than tax funded. But at least choice drives competition.
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Col Joseph Lenertz
SP5 Christine Conley - Yes, the teachers who care, and their spouses, spend far too much of their own income providing school supplies and making learning fun for the kids. My hat is off to them.
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Capt Michael Greene
Col Joseph Lenertz - Not sure what you mean by choice. The word always worries me. Like "My children can learn all they need to know by reading the Bible?" I've seen "my parents don't send me to school, 'cuz we're all gonna be raptured soon." So I'm a little leery of "choice."
If I had my choice, every student would learn to spell and use 10 new words each week, would be reading Poe, Shakespeare, and Hemingway, and would memorize the times table through 12 as a requirement to graduate 6th grade. By the end of high school, every child would have sewn a vest, baked a souffle, played an instrument, balanced their checkbook, sung in a choir, built a cupboard, played a position in soccer or basketball for two years, programmed a database, and rebuilt a carburetor. Everyone would have chosen a historical leader such as Alexander or Giap or Schweizer, and given a speech showing on the map where they traveled, and given the whole speech in French, German, Russian or Chinese. That's my choice.
If I had my choice, every student would learn to spell and use 10 new words each week, would be reading Poe, Shakespeare, and Hemingway, and would memorize the times table through 12 as a requirement to graduate 6th grade. By the end of high school, every child would have sewn a vest, baked a souffle, played an instrument, balanced their checkbook, sung in a choir, built a cupboard, played a position in soccer or basketball for two years, programmed a database, and rebuilt a carburetor. Everyone would have chosen a historical leader such as Alexander or Giap or Schweizer, and given a speech showing on the map where they traveled, and given the whole speech in French, German, Russian or Chinese. That's my choice.
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This gets into some DEEP philosophical debating points:
First, should the GOVERNMENT be educating the People? Ask yourself that question. Think long and hard about it. And if that concept doesn't scare you, like it scares me, we don't have a whole lot to discuss. By controlling what is taught, we control what is potentially learned. The Government establishing "standards" of learning, where you must know X, and if you are not able to repeat it leads to an inability to progress creates a real conflict of interest. Especially when you consider PRIMARY & SECONDARY EDUCATION as the baseline for UNSKILLED LABOR in this nation.
That concept should be the second thing to scare people. When we graduate High School (Secondary Education) as the bare minimum needed for UNSKILLED Labor. Not Skilled, as in Profession or Trade, but Unskilled like Retail or Service, and even that is with OJT.
Now theoretically, P/S Education is "supposed" to teach us "how to learn" or establish the fundamental skills to where we can advance through additional education (like college) or training (like the trades, professions, or military). Unfortunately, this concept is about as practical as teaching someone how to run efficiently by taking them out on a marathon.
What's worse is we compound the issue by failing to apply resources adequately. You know something the Government is notorious for doing. People cannot "learn" in groups of 20-30. They can't. They can memorize, and hope some of that data sticks long enough for them to integrate it into the learning process when they are in 1-5 man (collaborative) groups. Think back to any time you really learned something. Really had that "ah ha" moment. How many people were around you? I'm willing to bet the number was low.
You can only learn as fast as the slowest student. You're stuck in 1st gear. Or worse, we leave behind the bottom third, bore the top third and cater to the "average." Screw that. This is #$^$^& America. Since when should we cater to AVERAGE? But that's exactly what Government ran education does. There's no skin in the game. "They" (the powers that be) don't care about anything but "acceptable percentages" of pass rates. Not LEARNING rate. Pass rate. This isn't like EOD or Rigger school where you have a crusty SgtMaj going "Sorry, I'm not trusting my or anyone else's life with your skills. You just don't get it."
As for apologizing to the kids. Nope. Push them harder. It's not the Government's job to educate my kid. Mine is 16 now. Senior in High School (first day today). He's doubling up to graduate a year early. Next year I'm going to do what I can to help him get a few extra college credits early, because I don't want him spending (wasting) more time than he has to on BS. But I've made it perfectly clear to him that some of the "rules" are learning how to do stupid things you don't want to. Like getting up and going to work every day (school is his job). In work, they get exactly the kind of employee they pay for. And school doesn't pay you to attend.
First, should the GOVERNMENT be educating the People? Ask yourself that question. Think long and hard about it. And if that concept doesn't scare you, like it scares me, we don't have a whole lot to discuss. By controlling what is taught, we control what is potentially learned. The Government establishing "standards" of learning, where you must know X, and if you are not able to repeat it leads to an inability to progress creates a real conflict of interest. Especially when you consider PRIMARY & SECONDARY EDUCATION as the baseline for UNSKILLED LABOR in this nation.
That concept should be the second thing to scare people. When we graduate High School (Secondary Education) as the bare minimum needed for UNSKILLED Labor. Not Skilled, as in Profession or Trade, but Unskilled like Retail or Service, and even that is with OJT.
Now theoretically, P/S Education is "supposed" to teach us "how to learn" or establish the fundamental skills to where we can advance through additional education (like college) or training (like the trades, professions, or military). Unfortunately, this concept is about as practical as teaching someone how to run efficiently by taking them out on a marathon.
What's worse is we compound the issue by failing to apply resources adequately. You know something the Government is notorious for doing. People cannot "learn" in groups of 20-30. They can't. They can memorize, and hope some of that data sticks long enough for them to integrate it into the learning process when they are in 1-5 man (collaborative) groups. Think back to any time you really learned something. Really had that "ah ha" moment. How many people were around you? I'm willing to bet the number was low.
You can only learn as fast as the slowest student. You're stuck in 1st gear. Or worse, we leave behind the bottom third, bore the top third and cater to the "average." Screw that. This is #$^$^& America. Since when should we cater to AVERAGE? But that's exactly what Government ran education does. There's no skin in the game. "They" (the powers that be) don't care about anything but "acceptable percentages" of pass rates. Not LEARNING rate. Pass rate. This isn't like EOD or Rigger school where you have a crusty SgtMaj going "Sorry, I'm not trusting my or anyone else's life with your skills. You just don't get it."
As for apologizing to the kids. Nope. Push them harder. It's not the Government's job to educate my kid. Mine is 16 now. Senior in High School (first day today). He's doubling up to graduate a year early. Next year I'm going to do what I can to help him get a few extra college credits early, because I don't want him spending (wasting) more time than he has to on BS. But I've made it perfectly clear to him that some of the "rules" are learning how to do stupid things you don't want to. Like getting up and going to work every day (school is his job). In work, they get exactly the kind of employee they pay for. And school doesn't pay you to attend.
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SGT Edward Wilcox
You have no understanding of logical fallacies. I made no "straw man" argument. I used the military as an example of what happens when a governmental function is handed over to the private sector. But, whatever helps you feel superior.
We decide what is a right and what is not a right. Except for those rights specifically stated in the Constitution, we can give and take away at will. Education is considered a right, even if you don't agree. All children, regardless of economic status has a right to an education. Beyond the secondary, it is there for whomever seeks it.
I believe that the educational system can be improved, but it should never be scrapped. Only the government can ensure that all students, nation wide, receive the same basic education. They ensure this by setting a base standard that all schools must meet. Beyond that, it is up to the local schools to determine what they teach.
It has been my experience that those who consider the educational system useless spent most of their years in school trying to get out of class. You get out what you put into it. My son is not an outlier, he is the norm. I got a better education that my peers because I put an effort into getting an education. The same with my son. I firmly believe that the failures of any school start with the parents, and usually ends with them, as well.
In any event, I am not going to put much stock into an article written by someone who does not work in the educational field.
We decide what is a right and what is not a right. Except for those rights specifically stated in the Constitution, we can give and take away at will. Education is considered a right, even if you don't agree. All children, regardless of economic status has a right to an education. Beyond the secondary, it is there for whomever seeks it.
I believe that the educational system can be improved, but it should never be scrapped. Only the government can ensure that all students, nation wide, receive the same basic education. They ensure this by setting a base standard that all schools must meet. Beyond that, it is up to the local schools to determine what they teach.
It has been my experience that those who consider the educational system useless spent most of their years in school trying to get out of class. You get out what you put into it. My son is not an outlier, he is the norm. I got a better education that my peers because I put an effort into getting an education. The same with my son. I firmly believe that the failures of any school start with the parents, and usually ends with them, as well.
In any event, I am not going to put much stock into an article written by someone who does not work in the educational field.
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Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS
SGT Edward Wilcox - Then why should we put much stock in your opinion? You don't appear to work in the educational field.
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Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS
SGT (Join to see) - That's the goal of GOOD education. What we are actually getting is the equivalent of "minimum wage" for "punching a clock."
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Yes, I think memorization of many things is pointless. Most of it stays just long enough to get through the test, then it is gone, unless the student finds something they particularly like about the topic at hand.
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Col Joseph Lenertz
Yes. If you don't know the How and Why of it, you're just spouting back what you've been told, parrot-style.
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SrA Chris "Shadow" McGee
SP5 Christine Conley - I wish all schools would do this. Being able to see a practical use for what you are learning is much more helpful than the chalkboard or a powerpoint presentation
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