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CPT Jack Durish
11
11
0
Trained professionals have a poor record of predicting human behavior. I can't imagine gun shop sales persons of having any better luck. Certainly, they can't be held responsible, although I understand how they might feel that way
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SGT Ben Keen
SGT Ben Keen
>1 y
The way I see the program is that it is less about predicting and more of going on what is actually happening in front of them. Sure, no one, even trained professionals will get it right 100% of the time but if someone comes in acting "funny" or is showing the outward signs of having suicidal thoughts, than I am all for the gun shop owner from stopping the sale. And as many have already said, even with this program in place, if someone is that set on doing it, they will find the means to do so. But hopefully, this program will help reduce the numbers a little.
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CPT Jack Durish
CPT Jack Durish
>1 y
SGT Ben Keen - What about rights? People who sell firearms are licensed to do so in accordance with the law. If a person passes a background check and has the cash or credit in hand to make the purchase, what right does the gun dealer have to deny them their rights? I know we used to have signs in all types of shops that "Management reserves the right to refuse service to anyone" but that was used to keep minorities out. Thus, a gun dealer could say that someone looked suicidal to them when, in truth, they looked black, Muslim, or some other identity.
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PO3 Jay Rose
PO3 Jay Rose
2 mo
It’s used all the time in contemporary law enforcement as any “private business,” whether owned by a sole proprietor or even through publicly owned stock, is allowed to to trespass anyone for any reason, provided they don’t say it’s for one of those civil rights violations that you specifically mentioned. They could say that they were “causing a scene,” “being rude,” looked like they were trying to steal something, or even provide no reason at all (in most cases). This is only because you as a person could trespass anyone from your home or other property, and corporations are viewed as people under the law (as odd a concept as it may be).

Now, violating someone’s second amendment rights without any justification is another story, so provided that a proprietor steps into the back, calls the police to trespass the party, and doesn’t give a reason at all, that shouldn’t be in violation of anything as it’s a simple trespass warning, which is everybody’s right. The law is very specific and ignorance of it is never an excuse to violate it, you’d think that gun shop owners would be a bit more knowledgeable as to not put their businesses in jeopardy, but we all have our faults. If we were all perfect we wouldn’t have to worry about this plethora of laws and associated loopholes.

To me, it sounds like it’s about avoiding guilt, may it be to save lives or their own butts. Perhaps it’s a some of each. It just has to be carefully worded or not worded for that matter, otherwise, as you pointed out, it opens up any number of potential liabilities to the shop owner. I guess when you think about it, the very same laws can be applied far differently in each passing era; some fair, some unfair, and others too gray to even decide.
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PO3 Steven Sherrill
6
6
0
SPC Britanny *Winnie* Balthaser Anytime a person chooses to end their life it is tragic. The means to perform the act are all around us. Everything from Car exhaust, strangulation, cutting, jumping, drowning, electrocution, firearams, to who knows what else can be used. It all depends upon the individual, and whether the attempt is an earnest desire to end their suffering or a cry out for help. That being said, I am glad that gun shop owners are making an effort to curb suicide. Without training, or hiring a professional psychologist to interview buyers, they will have limited success. Any success is worth it, but in the long run, I highly doubt it will be effective in reducing the suicide rate. In order to do that, we need an overhaul of the Mental Health system in America. That has to start with people. People have to stop looking at mental health problems as a weakness or a joke. How many lives could be saved if instead of laughing when a friend makes a comment about harming themselves it was taken as a serious problem? How many could be saved if injuries to the soul of a person were treated with the same vigor as injuries to the physical body? It is not easy. Physical injuries present a lot more prominently than injuries to the soul. So I close by saying kudos to the gun shop owners for making an effort. It is a start. Every worthwhile endeavor starts with a single action. Let's hope this single action snowballs!

COL Mikel J. Burroughs
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SMSgt Lawrence McCarter
SMSgt Lawrence McCarter
>1 y
PO3 Sherrill, You have expressed some very valid points. With all the closed mental treatment facilities across the nation that says a lot about the failure to address these issues. We treat medical problems in other parts of the body but one of the most complicated organs the brain gets largely ignored. Never mind trying to hide family members with these problems, there is no shame it, treat it with proper professional help like You would any other ailment.
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SFC George Smith
6
6
0
this is all well and good... But if someone want to commit suicide they will find a way... and if they want a gun they will find one... prime example is the amount of weapons on the streets the criminals are getting... Like LA and Chicago...
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LTC Self Employed
LTC (Join to see)
>1 y
And Canada since they had stolen weapons from the US and just like here the majority of the gun crimes are with guns stolen from homes so you restrict them from the responsible populace and the bad guys find any way but Democrats just don't get it like in California they are Banning high capacity magazines over 10 shots starting in January 2017 so if someone has the magazine from their Grandpa's Browning automatic rifle from World War One or you happen to have spare mags from Desert Storm or operation Iraqi Freedom or operation enduring freedom you are now a felon thank you Governor Jerry Brown
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