Posted on Apr 23, 2024
The Illusion of Conventional War: Europe Is Learning the Wrong Lessons from the Conflict in...
1.3K
4
8
1
1
0
"Observation 5: Prewar exercises should be platforms of losing and learning instead of always winning". I can recall alot of the lessons I learned in training when lost and how we innovated the next time... very good point made in this article on that!
The Illusion of Conventional War: Europe Is Learning the Wrong Lessons from the Conflict in...
Posted from mwi.westpoint.edu
Warfare
Posted 8 mo ago
Responses: 2
0
0
0
And since antiquity...
"...business has defeated everything in it's path..."
[Kings of Power]
"...business has defeated everything in it's path..."
[Kings of Power]
(0)
(0)
0
0
0
There's one point made that I would take with a grain of salt, and that's having to do with armored vehicles being among the worst investments a country can make.
It's a bit of deja vu with the last MC Commandant getting rid of all of the Corps' armored units and also putting an axe on a number of its artillery. Reason was that the Corps will rely on the Army for armored support. I don't like that because the Marine Corps has by and large always been self sufficient over the last few decades. Anyway I'm digressing.
I see why the author said armored vehicles aren't a good investment. My thing is: can he guarantee every unit at squad level (although fireteam would be better) have an immediate and effective means of killing any adversary's armor upon discovery? Anything less than an absolute yes means having to rely, at least right now, on other sources such as close air support, or friendly artillery with the exact coordinates of the enemy armor. Just my thoughts as a roustabout with limited perspective.
It's a bit of deja vu with the last MC Commandant getting rid of all of the Corps' armored units and also putting an axe on a number of its artillery. Reason was that the Corps will rely on the Army for armored support. I don't like that because the Marine Corps has by and large always been self sufficient over the last few decades. Anyway I'm digressing.
I see why the author said armored vehicles aren't a good investment. My thing is: can he guarantee every unit at squad level (although fireteam would be better) have an immediate and effective means of killing any adversary's armor upon discovery? Anything less than an absolute yes means having to rely, at least right now, on other sources such as close air support, or friendly artillery with the exact coordinates of the enemy armor. Just my thoughts as a roustabout with limited perspective.
(0)
(0)
CPT Lawrence Cable
SGT Aaron Atwood - Jamming, cyber and electronic warfare are already a way of life, so the possibilities of being isolated is real. Not sure how armor would help that situation. Tanks are hard to hide and ours has a jet engine and the thermal signature from hell.
The offense will be interesting. To me, it seems the Russians move everything forward, then attack along a sector under their surveillance, artillery, drone and anti-aircraft umbrella, move to the extent of that cover, stop and reconsolidate, then advance again. Looking at the results of the Ukrainian offensives, slow and under your artillery coverage may be the only way not completely suicidal today.
The offense will be interesting. To me, it seems the Russians move everything forward, then attack along a sector under their surveillance, artillery, drone and anti-aircraft umbrella, move to the extent of that cover, stop and reconsolidate, then advance again. Looking at the results of the Ukrainian offensives, slow and under your artillery coverage may be the only way not completely suicidal today.
(0)
(0)
LTC Eric Udouj
I thought it was one of the best reads have seen in a long while. And it is one of the first have seen that says the Europeans may not be learning the right lessons from the war. In the US - much of it reads the same - how many of those points are we learning - and how many has a bias as to what we want confirmed allowed for the wrong lesson to be learned. As to the WWI battlefield -- western front - its a great perception to draw for it. However, recall what happened when the Battle of Riga occurred.... which then lead to the offensive on the Isonzo Front.... each saw the collapse of the defenses. You can not win a war on the defense - nor can you afford a 3d battle of Kursk.
(1)
(0)
CPT Lawrence Cable
LTC Eric Udouj - I agree that you don't win wars on the Defensive. I will point out that the collapse of the Russian Army after Riga had as much to do with the collapse of the Provisional Government and the rise of the Bolsheviks as the defeat by the Germans.
I'm an old Cold War Warrior. From what I have seen, the old Soviets were very good at developing the battlefield in depth and the Russians have managed to integrate modern technology and weapons into that depth. We still seem to be trying to project a technological superiority with weapons systems that are over 4 decades old, the M1 and the Bradley were being fielded when I was in OSUT. We need a better answer.
A start would be to pull that damn Jet Engine out of the M1 and put a turbo diesel in its place. We have know that the jet engine was a piece of shit since Desert Storm.
I'm an old Cold War Warrior. From what I have seen, the old Soviets were very good at developing the battlefield in depth and the Russians have managed to integrate modern technology and weapons into that depth. We still seem to be trying to project a technological superiority with weapons systems that are over 4 decades old, the M1 and the Bradley were being fielded when I was in OSUT. We need a better answer.
A start would be to pull that damn Jet Engine out of the M1 and put a turbo diesel in its place. We have know that the jet engine was a piece of shit since Desert Storm.
(0)
(0)
CPT Lawrence Cable
Russia SWARMS Ukraine Town with Upgraded Turtle Tanks
Difficult situation in Krasnohorivka. Major attack by 5th Motorized Brigade of the DPR supported by turtle tanks. Urgent need of reinforcements for Ukraine. ...
LTC Eric Udouj - An interesting bit of Social Media. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDfkwlMaK7g
(1)
(0)
Read This Next
Continue with Facebook 
Continue with Google