Posted on Apr 26, 2014
2 NCOs misconduct, looking at a prison sentence?
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I am very curious to see your responses here on this story.
If they are found guilty of selling military equipment, what's your recommendation for punishment? Why?
here's a link to the story:
http://www.stripes.com/news/army/fort-carson-sergeants-sought-on-suspicion-of-selling-stolen-military-equipment-1.280172
If they are found guilty of selling military equipment, what's your recommendation for punishment? Why?
here's a link to the story:
http://www.stripes.com/news/army/fort-carson-sergeants-sought-on-suspicion-of-selling-stolen-military-equipment-1.280172
Posted 12 y ago
Responses: 27
CSM,
The value of the items they were allegedly selling along with the dangers associated with them falling into the wrong hands would register multiple felonies on the civilian side. That being said, they are not civilians, they are Non Commissioned Officers in the United States Army. They should be held to a higher standard. Incidents like this not only hurt the Army financially, they also create increased distrust and suspicion from the American public. The incident described is not as simple as "I didn't know" or "I didn't think it was a big deal". How many hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of equipment did they "lose" or "misplace"? Once the entire investigation comes out more can be said. However, personally, I would go for maximum sentences along with reduction to E-1 and a Bad Conduct Discharge. Actions like this can not go with a mere slap on the wrist or unpunished. Their alleged actions degraded the readiness of their unit, diminished the public's view of our professionals, and potentially put very elaborate tactical equipment in the hands of people who have no business with it.
The value of the items they were allegedly selling along with the dangers associated with them falling into the wrong hands would register multiple felonies on the civilian side. That being said, they are not civilians, they are Non Commissioned Officers in the United States Army. They should be held to a higher standard. Incidents like this not only hurt the Army financially, they also create increased distrust and suspicion from the American public. The incident described is not as simple as "I didn't know" or "I didn't think it was a big deal". How many hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of equipment did they "lose" or "misplace"? Once the entire investigation comes out more can be said. However, personally, I would go for maximum sentences along with reduction to E-1 and a Bad Conduct Discharge. Actions like this can not go with a mere slap on the wrist or unpunished. Their alleged actions degraded the readiness of their unit, diminished the public's view of our professionals, and potentially put very elaborate tactical equipment in the hands of people who have no business with it.
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CSM Michael J. Uhlig
SFC Crocker, nicely stated and very well thought out reply.
The loss of confidence from the people we've sworn to protect, by doing these things, is detrimental to all of us, not just those involved.
The loss of confidence from the people we've sworn to protect, by doing these things, is detrimental to all of us, not just those involved.
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1SG Gregory Crocker
Thank You CSM Uhlig. I couldn't agree with you more.
I merely hope that if found guilty they max these guys out. There is no excuse for actions like these.
I merely hope that if found guilty they max these guys out. There is no excuse for actions like these.
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They need to be maxed out on possible punishment. They are both NCOs and not only should know better, but are also setting an example for younger Soldiers. If they are not dealt with harshly, younger Soldiers will see it as yet another failing of the system, and figure when they get rank, they too can get away with it.
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CSM Michael J. Uhlig
they are absolutely setting the example, good or bad....and in this case a very bad example.
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As a supply clerk and armorer I know that these items are extremely expensive and are on the sensitive items list for a reason. In my opinion these actions are unconscionable and how they managed to pull this off is beyond my comprehension. Bury them in the deepest darkest hole that can be dug.
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CSM Michael J. Uhlig
you are right, should be inventoried monthly as a sensitive item....during an early deployment to Iraq, there was a platoon leader trying to get his accountability right by "maximizing losses" during any catastrophic hit that included a loss of the vehicle
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I wanted to vote the max, but they have not been "proven" guilty yet. Seems like they did a very thorough investigation and have enough evidence though. If they are guilty they should get the max. Isn't it anything over $2500 considered grand theft, if so, they should automatically get jail time just like civilian courts. Either way, I hope the courts martial is swift and they send a message that this will not be tolerated.
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Kinda interested how it will play out. I think they should be court martialed but I suspect they will be tried in Federal Court off base.
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This was not an "oops". This was a pair of criminals setting up a criminal enterprise and stealing from their brothers. They violated every bit of trust that was placed in them. They should be tried fairly, then punished justly. The reduction to E1 and BCD or Dishonorable Discharge would be appropriate. They should also do time commensurate to the estimated value of the theft.
The message should be harsh and swift, so there is no doubt about the message. Additionally, there are likely others that will be caught up, wether by involvement or the receipt of stolen property. Oh well. Never in my life would I have thought it was ok to by a silencer in a gas station bathroom, in an MRE package. Just saying.
The message should be harsh and swift, so there is no doubt about the message. Additionally, there are likely others that will be caught up, wether by involvement or the receipt of stolen property. Oh well. Never in my life would I have thought it was ok to by a silencer in a gas station bathroom, in an MRE package. Just saying.
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CSM Michael J. Uhlig
sounds like it, incredible capabilities they were willing to lose for some cash. And in the perspective of our lifetime of earning capability, the amount of cash is petty.
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Without knowing the total value of the items sold the minimum would be an article 15 and separation from service with an other than honorable discharge. With NCO's with that type of character they have no place wearing the uniform. To wear that uniform is an honor and not a right. NCO's like this bring not only shame to themselves but to all NCO's and Soldiers that have made the ultimate sacrifice for there country.
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Suspended Profile
When you enlist, and swear in by oath, you put yourself in an elite category. Willing to place yourself in a position where you may need to give your life for a greater purpose. It doesn't give you the right to defraud the military, the government, or your country. It's similar to police officers. They put on a badge to protect and serve and uphold the law. Not bend it for their benefit and personal satisfaction. I say max punishment!
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