Posted on Feb 22, 2014
Do "Good Looking" Female Soldiers Have It A Lot Easier In The Army Than Men And "Unfavorable Looking" Females?
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In my opinion... YES! YES YES and YES THEY DO! It really depends on their superiors and how professional they are towards that female soldier but from my experience in almost every unit I have been in a good looking female usually is always being recognized for the same work everyone else is doing and when she is recognized it is by a male superior.
I am not exactly hitting on the issue of female soldiers who flirt their way to the top or are always in that parade pretty stance when they talk to higher ups but this definitely ties into it.
I have seen it enough to where it makes me want to report it at times because I like to think of the military as being above looks and being more professional but I see that when it comes to some of our superiors, that is just not the case. Most superiors are more relaxed because the soldier is easier one the eyes and I think it is a big problem we have in the Army and it probably has been for a long time.
Women cannot help that they look good to men nor should they have to worry about it but, we all know that there are a good amount of female soldiers out there that use this to their advantage and we also know that there are a lot of leaders out there that don't check the flirting ways and their human desires at the door when it comes to the military mission.
I used to be on my highschool's debate team way back when so feel free to tell me EXACTLY how you feel good or bad sentiments, I am quite resilient and I am not afraid to express my opinion on any subject.
Please chime in on how you feel and what you think about this and if you think my post is good for discussion and contributes to the community then please vote it up thanks! - SPC Gamble.
I am not exactly hitting on the issue of female soldiers who flirt their way to the top or are always in that parade pretty stance when they talk to higher ups but this definitely ties into it.
I have seen it enough to where it makes me want to report it at times because I like to think of the military as being above looks and being more professional but I see that when it comes to some of our superiors, that is just not the case. Most superiors are more relaxed because the soldier is easier one the eyes and I think it is a big problem we have in the Army and it probably has been for a long time.
Women cannot help that they look good to men nor should they have to worry about it but, we all know that there are a good amount of female soldiers out there that use this to their advantage and we also know that there are a lot of leaders out there that don't check the flirting ways and their human desires at the door when it comes to the military mission.
I used to be on my highschool's debate team way back when so feel free to tell me EXACTLY how you feel good or bad sentiments, I am quite resilient and I am not afraid to express my opinion on any subject.
Please chime in on how you feel and what you think about this and if you think my post is good for discussion and contributes to the community then please vote it up thanks! - SPC Gamble.
Integrity
Toxic Leadership
Standards
Edited 10 y ago
Posted 10 y ago
Responses: 76
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SPC Gamble,<div><br></div><div>I am going to kind of tear your argument apart right from the top. You have been in less than 3 years according to you and you have been in one unit other than training (please correct me if I am wrong).</div><div><br></div><div>I question your slight toward females because in another one of your posts you complain about not being sent to the board, because your "new" female NCO "feels threatened" by you since you are older. What is your real issue? Following some of your posts it seems as though you are threatened by females. </div><div><br></div><div>Having been in more than 10 years now, I can see your points in small instances, but as Soldiers, notice I didn't say NCOs or professionals, but as Soldiers it is our responsibility to correct these type of actions. We have EO offices and representatives for a reason. If these type of actions are going on and you aspire to be an NCO than I charge you with taking action when you see injustices.</div><div><br></div><div>I fail to recognize your point though in today's Army. Is one to assume based on your logic that good looking male Soldiers are treated differently by heterosexual superiors than they are by homosexual leaders? Times have changed. I have had Soldier members who have worked for me that were male and female, were "easier on the eyes" and "unfavorable looking" to quote you, who enjoyed opposite or same sex relationships, but at the end of the day one thing was the same. THEY WERE SOLDIERS and I treated them as such. The leaders around me did the same because as a Soldier it was my duty to uphold the standard.</div><div><br></div><div>I encourage you do get out of the train of thought you are venturing into. You are spending a lot of time expending energy on things that don't necessarily hold true across the board and if you can not change your train of thought, you will foster a grudge that will follow you through the Army and that kind of view can keep you in a position/rank far longer than you wish to be there. </div><div><br></div><div>On a flip side though. Your enthusiasm and drive to succeed is what the Army is going to need going forward. You need to find yourself a mentor who you can turn to for professional advice to get you there.</div><div><br></div><div>SFC Adam J Rosenlund</div>
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SGT (Join to see)
<span style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;">SFC Rosenlund,</span><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;">Mmm hold on, I think I have a few loose teeth! I haven't been smacked around that good in quite some time...</div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;">Now I have to defend my stance as a soldier here because I see you have gotten the wrong view of me, how I feel about women, my train of thought, and my ability to see the overall picture of how Army relationships are suppose to work.</div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;">First off, I do have a mentor that took me under HER wing while we were deployed due to the situations that arose between my NCO and I when I moved to the new section. She is a straight shooter she exemplifies what a real soldier/NCO is and she is known for checking female soldiers who flirt their way around and calling out leaders who let their soldiers get away with doing such things or become too "buddy, buddy" with those soldiers. This SFC is now the interim 1SG until change of command happens after our leave is up in mid-March.</div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;">I gladly follow her advice whether I like what she has to say or not because she is a great NCO overall. She gives me the honest truth and let's me speak my mind. She has called me out on my rants about my sergeant and has also commended me for handling situations the right way.</div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;">The things I post on Rally Point are things that I have talked about with her and I post these things to gauge how others feel on the subject and what they have experienced during their careers in the military. I did not post this to bash women.</div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;">Now sergeant I do ask you what other posts of mine call out women or show in any way shape or form that I may feel threatened by a female presence? If my NCO were a male the situation would still be the same. I have not disrespected my NCO at all, I have not questioned her leadership skills because she is a female. I have not one time said anything derogatory towards the female sex, I have simply asked the question that I asked because as sergeant Pefley stated I am speaking on things that I know and have seen during my time in the military.</div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;">I attended basic training at Fort Jackson, SC. I was sent to Presidio of Monterey, CA for language training at DLI, I did not pass my Russian course so I was given options and I re-classed to all source analyst and from there I attended AIT at Fort Huachuca, AZ. After completion of AIT I was sent to Division 101st HHB at Fort Campbell and worked in the fusion cell for 3 months until my request to deploy was approved and I was able to join the rest of the Division downrange at Bagram AF, Afghanistan. We just got back from deployment 2 weeks ago and my deployment was 9 1/2 months long. That is the extent of my Army career and where my opinions of the situation I stated are coming from.</div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;">I do not believe that I have to go to a lot of units in the Army to see a trend developing from the last 4 places I have been. As an analyst my main job is to research and finding trends in attacks was a big thing we did downrange to predict IDF attacks and such. I am telling you that I simply see a trend from the place I have been and now I am asking the community what is going on in their neck of the woods so I can see if it is an Army wide thing. That is how I as an analyst put the WHOLE PICTURE together, because I cant be at all places at once and I don't have the time to come to a decision about this topic like you have over your successful career in the Army sergeant.</div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;">If I wanted to know soldier's stances on how they feel about "good looking male soldiers" or "unfavorable looking" male/female soldiers in the Army then I would have asked that all around question. I did not want to know about that I wanted to know about a specific topic, the one that I posted. I cannot control that people tear off on tangents because they feel that I am talking about one side of something and they feel that I am not looking at the other side. Thanks everyone but I do see the other side, I just wanted to get your opinions on this one topic. So I ask that people either post about this specific topic or not post at all because for some reason they think they need to teach me that I am judging one side of the fence.</div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;">Sergeant, I spend a lot of time over analyzing things that should have been layed to rest a long time ago but the big wigs get spun up on something and we go right back to the same stuff we just crossed the T's and dotted the I's on.</div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;">Hopefully I have given you enough insight about me to let you know that I completely respect the females as human beings as well as soldiers and superiors alike. Also, I hope you understand that my thought process is a lot less shallow then you may have thought before. I work on my craft day in, day out at work to be able to see the whole picture because I have to give the higher ups the best possible intelligence they need to be able to make important decisions. That is what I do as an All-Source Analyst and the day that I become an NCO I promise you will not have to worry about me treating my male and female soldiers differently.</div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 1 [login to see] 77148px;">If you took the time to read this lengthy reply thank you and I hope you can respect my opinions and myself as a soldier at the end of the day. - SPC Gamble</div>
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SFC (Join to see)
SPC Gamble,
Sorry for the delayed response. I responded a couple of days ago and went to hit post and RP was down for maintenance.
Anyways I wanted to commend you on the thought you put back into your reply toward. You took time thought it out and typed a well written response. The point the other day wasn't to bash you and as I read further through I can take away your meaning and your point.
Someone else took the liberty of saying you should choose words more appropriately or what not and that would have led to a totally different outcome. My original reply was based off the perception your post gave (coupled with the one where you were questioning going to the board) and as they say, perception sets the tone for many outcomes.
Again though, as I said above when commenting on someone else's. I like your drive and enthusiasm. If you channel it correctly your will make a great NCO, most likely sooner than later. Please feel free at anytime to contact me if there is anything I can assist you with or support I can provide.
SFC Rosenlund
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CPT (Join to see)
Disadvantages of being "Good looking"
1. People expect you to be less talented. Especially in academics.
2. If you are a male, you're perceived - by myopic people - as a player.
3. You're surrounded by fake people.
4. You can't stay covert for long periods, as you're easily recognizable.
5. You somehow find yourself in the cross-hair of psychos.
6. When you give people an inch, they try to take a yard.
7. If you are a woman, men will often assume you are very sexually experienced, because they will assume that it is impossible for a woman so beautiful to be so pure, since men are constantly chasing after her.
8. If you are a woman, many people will automatically assume that you think you are a better person than them or that you are unapproachable.
9. Your self-esteem may soar to unhealthy levels.
10. People think that you have it better than them in life, simply because you are good looking.
11. People jump to conclusions about your interactions with those of the opposite sex.
1. People expect you to be less talented. Especially in academics.
2. If you are a male, you're perceived - by myopic people - as a player.
3. You're surrounded by fake people.
4. You can't stay covert for long periods, as you're easily recognizable.
5. You somehow find yourself in the cross-hair of psychos.
6. When you give people an inch, they try to take a yard.
7. If you are a woman, men will often assume you are very sexually experienced, because they will assume that it is impossible for a woman so beautiful to be so pure, since men are constantly chasing after her.
8. If you are a woman, many people will automatically assume that you think you are a better person than them or that you are unapproachable.
9. Your self-esteem may soar to unhealthy levels.
10. People think that you have it better than them in life, simply because you are good looking.
11. People jump to conclusions about your interactions with those of the opposite sex.
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Sgt Carlos Barrera
mmmm, I disagree in a point; 5 males went to a Meritorious Corporal board, all didn't make it. The single female close to promotion got it. All the males have been in more than 3 years, she just 12 months, so tell me how that works?? all males exceeded their points on promotion.
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This is not an "Army thing" or military thing. Studies have shown that attractive people (both men and women) get better jobs, more attention from thier bosses and better opportunities. This type of thing is societal and happens everywhere from the boardrooms to the mail room. SHOULD it happen, no. But in reality it does. Here is an interesting article (granted it is a few years old but still pretty accurate as far as I've observed) <A href="http://www.nydailynews.com/news/money/attractive-people-paid-better-work-attention-bosses-report-article-1.466980">http://www.nydailynews.com/news/money/attractive-people-paid-better-work-attention-bosses-report-article-1.466980</A>
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SSG Mike Angelo
Maj Sabra,
Thank you for the article. I agree that this particular issue of attractiveness does exist and it is societal regardless of industry and organization. The military design is no exception.
There is much truth toward our society and the norms of interpersonal relationships that are "easy on the eyes" so to speak.
In the military, physical appearance is a big piece, such as DA photo et al. Personal chemistry, sight, smell and sound are societal indices on how the relationship will be developed. Some folks have that positive energy that we desire. It is a human need. In reality too, I agree, these events happen.
I observe in this thread, various levels of personal leadership in the group. Most of us would like to say that we are not influenced by beauty in our professional lives, however we are all creatures of habit and need for this type of chemistry or feeling.
Service members can rise above their feelings with self-discipline and self-control, hence personal leadership. This is a maturation process.
Good luck out there.
Thank you for the article. I agree that this particular issue of attractiveness does exist and it is societal regardless of industry and organization. The military design is no exception.
There is much truth toward our society and the norms of interpersonal relationships that are "easy on the eyes" so to speak.
In the military, physical appearance is a big piece, such as DA photo et al. Personal chemistry, sight, smell and sound are societal indices on how the relationship will be developed. Some folks have that positive energy that we desire. It is a human need. In reality too, I agree, these events happen.
I observe in this thread, various levels of personal leadership in the group. Most of us would like to say that we are not influenced by beauty in our professional lives, however we are all creatures of habit and need for this type of chemistry or feeling.
Service members can rise above their feelings with self-discipline and self-control, hence personal leadership. This is a maturation process.
Good luck out there.
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CPT (Join to see)
I agree completely. As a society we gravitate to those with charisma. It is just the way we are.
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CPT (Join to see)
Disadvantages of being "Good looking"
1. People expect you to be less talented. Especially in academics.
2. If you are a male, you're perceived - by myopic people - as a player.
3. You're surrounded by fake people.
4. You can't stay covert for long periods, as you're easily recognizable.
5. You somehow find yourself in the cross-hair of psychos.
6. When you give people an inch, they try to take a yard.
7. If you are a woman, men will often assume you are very sexually experienced, because they will assume that it is impossible for a woman so beautiful to be so pure, since men are constantly chasing after her.
8. If you are a woman, many people will automatically assume that you think you are a better person than them or that you are unapproachable.
9. Your self-esteem may soar to unhealthy levels.
10. People think that you have it better than them in life, simply because you are good looking
11. People jump to conclusions about your interactions with people of the opposite sex.
1. People expect you to be less talented. Especially in academics.
2. If you are a male, you're perceived - by myopic people - as a player.
3. You're surrounded by fake people.
4. You can't stay covert for long periods, as you're easily recognizable.
5. You somehow find yourself in the cross-hair of psychos.
6. When you give people an inch, they try to take a yard.
7. If you are a woman, men will often assume you are very sexually experienced, because they will assume that it is impossible for a woman so beautiful to be so pure, since men are constantly chasing after her.
8. If you are a woman, many people will automatically assume that you think you are a better person than them or that you are unapproachable.
9. Your self-esteem may soar to unhealthy levels.
10. People think that you have it better than them in life, simply because you are good looking
11. People jump to conclusions about your interactions with people of the opposite sex.
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SCPO (Join to see)
All these good looking people in this post are making me sad. Sometimes I have to take the bag off since it is better looking than me hahahahaha
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