Posted on Jan 23, 2022

Am I most likely going to be barred and forced out of the Army for failing ALC?
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Chances of me getting kicked out of army. I failed alc. Second time land nav first time I had to relearn it second time I was so cought up in worse what would happen if I went for the 5th point so I turned my paper in having 2 hours left and one turned out to be wrong. I know I feel like that decision just ruined my career.
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 6
I take it you are young and every young male I have known makes a few bad decisions. Enlisted in the infantry is not the only career and with the right attitude there very well maybe something better for you. Your career is only done if you allow it to be done. My Dad wanted to work in railroad, that did not happen. He wanted to be a mechanic in the NG, that did not happen either. Fifty years later his son (me) just retired from the Army Nurse Corps with over 20years. My Father ended up a medic in Nam and then went to nursing school graduating in 1972. You are going to fail in life and the real measure is what is plan B and how are you going to achieve it? You need two plans right now, how you will successfully stay Army and what your plan to succeed is if you do not stay Army right now.

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Thank you I am planning on what if I can’t stay or what to do if I can. I have my bachelors degree and been working on my resume I’m just scared because I don’t have experience other than army my plan was always to retire from the army. Now my life can be changing and fast. I don’t even feel bad for myself I feel bad for my wife and son for letting them down

PO1 David Haney
John as Maj Oyler said previously, in this life we are going to make some mistakes, some major some not so major. But we need as Maj Oyler said, we need to have a back up plan. So don't kick yourself, that's when we go into depression and quit. There are other other careers to choose from. After I retired from the Navy after 21 years of service I went to what I felt was another destiny, the Postal Service. And retired again with 20 years of service. But as Maj Oyler mentioned because of my right attitude I've always tried to maintain with great work ethics of being on time for work, not taking un-needed time off work, the Postal Service gave me an extra year toward my retirement to give me a total of 21 years of Postal Service. At 68 years old 2 years ago, my wife and I went to work for one of the biggest Companies in the world, Amazon. If we wanted my wife and I could pursue a managerial career at Amazon. As Maj Oyler's told of his father not achieving 2 of his dreams but finally choosing another path (of many) he, finally achieved a career. The issue in this life is to learn from your mistakes, ask for Divine help and move forward. I Don't believe you've let your wife and son down. Keep moving forward John.
SGT John Fig
There is a path for an SM removed from a NCOES course to get back in...If failing were an automatic bar and separation no such path would be in the reg.
" Soldiers removed from a course require a DA Form 4187 signed by the first General Officer (GO) (or SES equivalent) in the Soldier’s chain of command to be rescheduled. All requests must state when the NCO is available to attend training and forwarded to HRC for approval.
"5. Scheduling Priorities:
d. Priority 4. Soldiers deferred for failure to meet course standards, no-shows, or disciplinary reasons."
You will be removed from a promotion list if on one, you will have a bar to reenlistment placed on you.
After that its up to you to convince your commander and for your commander to convince those above them all the way to the 1st GO in your CofC that you are worthy of retention, retraining and another shot at NCOES.
Is that a bar too high for you? If so, either in motivation, willingness or ability start your mental and physical transition to civilian life.
If you are up to the task ....start campaigning with DEEDS, not words in your request.
There is a path for an SM removed from a NCOES course to get back in...If failing were an automatic bar and separation no such path would be in the reg.
" Soldiers removed from a course require a DA Form 4187 signed by the first General Officer (GO) (or SES equivalent) in the Soldier’s chain of command to be rescheduled. All requests must state when the NCO is available to attend training and forwarded to HRC for approval.
"5. Scheduling Priorities:
d. Priority 4. Soldiers deferred for failure to meet course standards, no-shows, or disciplinary reasons."
You will be removed from a promotion list if on one, you will have a bar to reenlistment placed on you.
After that its up to you to convince your commander and for your commander to convince those above them all the way to the 1st GO in your CofC that you are worthy of retention, retraining and another shot at NCOES.
Is that a bar too high for you? If so, either in motivation, willingness or ability start your mental and physical transition to civilian life.
If you are up to the task ....start campaigning with DEEDS, not words in your request.

Suspended Profile
Thank you I always been the type to do what it takes just after this I want to know worse case scenario to prepare.
SGM Erik Marquez
SGT John Fig - "Commanders will initiate separation for unsatisfactory performance for Soldiers who are eliminated for cause from a Noncommissioned Officer Education System (NCOES) course. Commanders have the discretion to bar Soldiers from reenlistment in lieu of initiation of separation for these Soldiers per AR 601–280 or AR 140–111."
So that above is what MUST happen, now that commander could choose to Bar in leu of initiating separation, then later lift the bar because they feel you are retain and retrainable.
So I guess worst case is, your commander feels you are not suitable for retraining, places a bar to enlistment, suspension of favorable actions and not only initiate separation for unsatisfactory performance but has the 1SG assign an NCO to guide and walk the process though. But to be blunt,,,, for me anyway when I was in the position to make those kind of recommendations to the CDR... You would need to be a real shit bag, and / or constant CofC time waster to earn a hand walked through Chap 13. More commonly it would be a bar, and a serious conversation where you were fully informed your ability to have the bar dropped resides in YOU and your actions. No one will so much as offer to help you recover from this UNLESS YOU ASK, and then no one will fail you in trying to help,,,but help is all it will be, the work and success of that work is all on you.
https://armypubs.army.mil/epubs/DR_pubs/DR_a/ARN30496-AR_635-200-000-WEB-4.pdf
So that above is what MUST happen, now that commander could choose to Bar in leu of initiating separation, then later lift the bar because they feel you are retain and retrainable.
So I guess worst case is, your commander feels you are not suitable for retraining, places a bar to enlistment, suspension of favorable actions and not only initiate separation for unsatisfactory performance but has the 1SG assign an NCO to guide and walk the process though. But to be blunt,,,, for me anyway when I was in the position to make those kind of recommendations to the CDR... You would need to be a real shit bag, and / or constant CofC time waster to earn a hand walked through Chap 13. More commonly it would be a bar, and a serious conversation where you were fully informed your ability to have the bar dropped resides in YOU and your actions. No one will so much as offer to help you recover from this UNLESS YOU ASK, and then no one will fail you in trying to help,,,but help is all it will be, the work and success of that work is all on you.
https://armypubs.army.mil/epubs/DR_pubs/DR_a/ARN30496-AR_635-200-000-WEB-4.pdf
I don't know about barring you from continued service, but I can guarantee that you won't be seeing ALC again anytime soon due to failing the course. Being that you're a SGT, you may be able to recover from this. If you were a SSG and failed an NCOES you'd be done.
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