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Aside from the university in California that hates America, on Facebook there seems to be an uproar about done guy taking a pic in uniform with his baby cradled in an American flag. While I can appreciate the thought, it makes me cringe. I saw many service members defending it. I will copy/paste my comment and I'd like to hear your thoughts RP.
I assure you with 13 years and counting of military service, I love this country, and I love the flag that represents it. As another individual mentioned, there is a code of customs and courtesies associated with the flag to dictate how it is handled with dignity and respect. Having the privilege to have performed military honors at funerals, I can assure you everything about handling the flag is very specific. They way it's folded, how it should appear after folding, how it it rotated to be passed to the grieving etc. Everything about how the flag is handled with dignity and respect is specific. Those practices should always be preserved to maintain that sacred presence and reverence for the flag and what it stands for. It shouldn't be used as decor or a wrap for a photo. It also shouldn't be made into clothing (bikinis, boxers, jackets, etc.). Images of the flag upon clothing are deemed appropriate, but when the flag becomes the clothing itself, or a wrap, we are not observing those customs which are intended to show respect for the flag and love of country. I can greatly appreciate the sentiment and good hearted intention behind the photo, but it over looks the practice of actually holding the flag by a high and honorable standard. I don't think it's anything worth getting worked up about as some people seem to be. At least it attempts to be a very positive image, but it does make me cringe in the same way it makes me cringe to see flag bikinis, or stroller awnings, and so on. I hope you can appreciate my reasonable approach without it feeling like an attack. Most people don't even know that flag clothing is counter to code, and wear it with the mindset that it displays pride. Again, I can appreciate the sentiment, but I appreciate the code and adherence by it so much more, because it takes greater care and effort to observe it. Have a fantastic God-blessed American day!
I assure you with 13 years and counting of military service, I love this country, and I love the flag that represents it. As another individual mentioned, there is a code of customs and courtesies associated with the flag to dictate how it is handled with dignity and respect. Having the privilege to have performed military honors at funerals, I can assure you everything about handling the flag is very specific. They way it's folded, how it should appear after folding, how it it rotated to be passed to the grieving etc. Everything about how the flag is handled with dignity and respect is specific. Those practices should always be preserved to maintain that sacred presence and reverence for the flag and what it stands for. It shouldn't be used as decor or a wrap for a photo. It also shouldn't be made into clothing (bikinis, boxers, jackets, etc.). Images of the flag upon clothing are deemed appropriate, but when the flag becomes the clothing itself, or a wrap, we are not observing those customs which are intended to show respect for the flag and love of country. I can greatly appreciate the sentiment and good hearted intention behind the photo, but it over looks the practice of actually holding the flag by a high and honorable standard. I don't think it's anything worth getting worked up about as some people seem to be. At least it attempts to be a very positive image, but it does make me cringe in the same way it makes me cringe to see flag bikinis, or stroller awnings, and so on. I hope you can appreciate my reasonable approach without it feeling like an attack. Most people don't even know that flag clothing is counter to code, and wear it with the mindset that it displays pride. Again, I can appreciate the sentiment, but I appreciate the code and adherence by it so much more, because it takes greater care and effort to observe it. Have a fantastic God-blessed American day!
Customs and Courtesies
Pride
Patriotism
Flags and Vexillology
Posted 9 y ago
Responses: 93
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I can see what what the service men is saying. How ever if George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, and the other signers of our country, were alive today, they would look at that a a baby that is born into freedom and in the USA. Which is a great sign of passion for our country.
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I concur with everything you stated WO1, however I also view this picture as a love between a Sailor, his country and his or her child. There is no greater love than passing on your love and passion on to your children. In this case I see the Sailor wrapping his or her child, whom he or she loves very much, in a representation (the US Flag) that they would give everything for to defend it and his or her child. My thoughts.
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These are patriots, the images show how Marines, Sailors, Soldiers, and Airmen protect the country.
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I have no problem with the photo. In fact, I believe that it represents patriotism as well as the current and future of it in this country.
I have a bigger problem with a state university banning it in the student government offices (I know, it was later vetoed).
If anything, the symbolism in this photo honors the flag and the things it symbolizes.
I have a bigger problem with a state university banning it in the student government offices (I know, it was later vetoed).
If anything, the symbolism in this photo honors the flag and the things it symbolizes.
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Other people have said it, but I'll say it too. To me this picture is not offensive.
My Shipmate is using the flag as a symbol of the blanket of freedom it provides to US citizens and is also signifying that he will lay down his life if necessary to defend the freedom of our country and his baby. He is also signifying that children are the future of America.
And if you disagree with me, that's your choice and right. But it's also my right to tell you to kiss my Red, White and (Navy) Blue ass.
My Shipmate is using the flag as a symbol of the blanket of freedom it provides to US citizens and is also signifying that he will lay down his life if necessary to defend the freedom of our country and his baby. He is also signifying that children are the future of America.
And if you disagree with me, that's your choice and right. But it's also my right to tell you to kiss my Red, White and (Navy) Blue ass.
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CW3 (Join to see)
Very professional. It's meaning and intent is obvious, and not in question. It's standing with code and customs is.
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I see this as a father showing his trust in America to keep his child safe and to blanket his child in liberty and freedom.
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Let's not forget that we have a group of people who stand on the flag as they protest at the funerals of our fallen service members. And the Supreme Court said that was freedom of speech.
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CW3 (Join to see)
Yes, and it's constitutionally protected, as is this picture. However, if it were a soldier disrespecting the flag as you describe, in uniform, you can bet your bottom dollar there would be some consequences under General conduct unbecoming and the sort brought to that individual. I refuse to employ a double standard of a negative that goes against the code against a positive that does the same for the sake of emotion. I agree, it's a beautiful, heart warming, me us proud picture, but we are a group of professionals, and standards are a part of that. I would rather observe a standard or code fully as to avoid reproach than to be in a position where someone can say to me "well what about.....?"
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CW2 Joseph Evans
1LT L S, I'll go with Boko Haram. ISIS and Taliban have at least a semblance of national pride, even if, as in the case of ISIS, the nation doesn't exist. I tend to align the Christian ISIS with those calling for a Theocratic America (http://www.politicususa.com/2015/02/25/57-republicans-dismantle-constitution-christianity-national-religion.html) and the American Taliban are the Progressives of the far right, only calling for an end to gays, women in the workplace, and science in the classroom.
As for the "Zero Tolerance" regarding the flag code, I'm going to have to disagree with CW3 (Join to see). The intent and the situation make all the difference. I also see room for presentation and aesthetics as well. We are a creative race with great attachment to our symbols, as much as we wish to protect the flag, we have a similar dream that the country we protect will extend that courtesy to our children. In many ways, the use of the symbolism in these pictures should evoke that sense of family, service, and country, values that those who decry these photos say they most believe in. It makes me wonder whether their loyalty is to the spirit of America or to the letter of the Law of Rule.
As for the "Zero Tolerance" regarding the flag code, I'm going to have to disagree with CW3 (Join to see). The intent and the situation make all the difference. I also see room for presentation and aesthetics as well. We are a creative race with great attachment to our symbols, as much as we wish to protect the flag, we have a similar dream that the country we protect will extend that courtesy to our children. In many ways, the use of the symbolism in these pictures should evoke that sense of family, service, and country, values that those who decry these photos say they most believe in. It makes me wonder whether their loyalty is to the spirit of America or to the letter of the Law of Rule.
57% Of Republicans Say Dismantle Constitution And Make Christianity National Religion
A PPP poll found that 57 percent of Republicans want to dismantle the Constitution and establish Christianity as the national religion
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Not the first photo of this type, won't be the last... That said, it artistically portrays everything I believe the United States is and should be. Family, Country, Service, Freedom... and the ability to enjoy all that without judgment.
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CW2 Joseph Evans
Cpl Jeff N.,
Except that the "Flag Code" is unconstitutional... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_v._Johnson
So, are you upholding the Constitution or The Flag Code?
I get it, there are ways the flag should not be used... I just find this symbolic presentation to be more reverent than most.
Except that the "Flag Code" is unconstitutional... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_v._Johnson
So, are you upholding the Constitution or The Flag Code?
I get it, there are ways the flag should not be used... I just find this symbolic presentation to be more reverent than most.
Texas v. Johnson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Texas v. Johnson, 491 U.S. 397 (1989), was a decision by the Supreme Court of the United States that invalidated prohibitions on desecrating the American flag enforced in 48 of the 50 states. Justice William Brennan wrote for a five-justice majority in holding that the defendant Gregory Lee Johnson's act of flag burning was protected speech under the First Amendment to the United States Constitution. Johnson was represented by attorneys David...
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Cpl Jeff N.
CW2 Joseph Evans . This was a decision on flag burning specifically as free speech. There were laws on the books regarding flag burning this case was addressing.
The flag code is not a criminal code and I don't think was even part of the decision/case. The Flag code is a guide for the treatment of the flag only and has been used by people that want to ensure appropriate treatment of the flag. It is a part of the official US Code but carries no penalties etc. I think you are conflating the flag code with laws that were on the books against flag burning specifically.
Of course there is always the argument regarding an action such as burning a flag being free speech or not. It was not a unanimous decision by the way.
The flag code is not a criminal code and I don't think was even part of the decision/case. The Flag code is a guide for the treatment of the flag only and has been used by people that want to ensure appropriate treatment of the flag. It is a part of the official US Code but carries no penalties etc. I think you are conflating the flag code with laws that were on the books against flag burning specifically.
Of course there is always the argument regarding an action such as burning a flag being free speech or not. It was not a unanimous decision by the way.
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CW2 Joseph Evans
I think a lot of this issue comes from letter vs spirit vs intent. Something that always gets confused the second you try putting a thought or philosophy to ink. Some take even a representation of the flag to be the flag itself, and the amount of rage that some people can generate over parodies of the flag is amazing even if expected.
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Cpl Jeff N.
1LT L S . Just a "sea lawyer" as we used to say back in the day. I read a lot, research a fair amount but nowhere near JAG qualified. That law has been complicated by lawyers to the point it is hard to follow. I try to simplify and get things down to their essence but appreciate the observation.
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http://www.vanessahicksphotography.com/contact-me/ Ms Hicks is getting exposure for her picture.. which I am thankfull to view just like the One above.. we fight for Our Children to be Cradled in the Love of Our Country.. and we hope they feel covered by our commitment.. thank Ms. Hicks for doing another great photo showing our country is Covering our loved ones.. Mick
Vanessa Hicks is a portrait, family and wedding photographer serving all of the Northern California, including Monterey, Seaside, Salinas, San Francisco, Santa Cruz, and San Jose. Contact today for more information!
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I truly don't see any disrespect represented in this picture. I see a child being honored for being born in America, the land of the free, home of the brave. Please ease up on the AR'S. He was not using the flag as a diaper, he used it as a symbol of pride. Sometimes it is best to look at the good, not read a set of rules in order to make everything bad and let your conscious be your guide.
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