Posted on Jan 8, 2018
Are contracted ROTC cadets in the Army?
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Posted 8 y ago
Responses: 5
Great question. It is highly contradictory.
- ROTC literature says you aren't....it is an elective.
- AR600-20 assigns cadets a place in the chain of command
- your contract is an enlistment for 8 years in the Army Reserve, assigned to the ROTC COntrol Group (2A Da Form 597-3)
- when you commissioned, you are conditionally released from the reserve component for the purpose of accepting a commission.
- during full mobilization, if you have graduated from ROTC Advanced camp you are recalled, commissioned, and sent to BOLC for training in order to put you in a unit. If you are contracted but not a Advanced Camp Graduate, you are sent to OCS or serve in an enlisted capacity (AR145-1).
- you are issued a military ID card and draw pay.
- you don't accrue time in service.
- if you are injured, you aren't eligible for VA services nor long term treatment.
- ROTC literature says you aren't....it is an elective.
- AR600-20 assigns cadets a place in the chain of command
- your contract is an enlistment for 8 years in the Army Reserve, assigned to the ROTC COntrol Group (2A Da Form 597-3)
- when you commissioned, you are conditionally released from the reserve component for the purpose of accepting a commission.
- during full mobilization, if you have graduated from ROTC Advanced camp you are recalled, commissioned, and sent to BOLC for training in order to put you in a unit. If you are contracted but not a Advanced Camp Graduate, you are sent to OCS or serve in an enlisted capacity (AR145-1).
- you are issued a military ID card and draw pay.
- you don't accrue time in service.
- if you are injured, you aren't eligible for VA services nor long term treatment.
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CPT Lawrence Cable
LTC Jason Mackay - As an SMP, even though they are if fact enlisted, you are attached to that unit but not on the TO&E, so again you get the not regularly assigned. I'll take your word about Korea, although I personally wouldn't have let a new 2LT lead a combat patrol right out of the gate, let alone a cadet.
Any JAG officers out there that want to offer a legal opinion?
Any JAG officers out there that want to offer a legal opinion?
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LTC Jason Mackay
CPT Lawrence Cable - all your points support my premise: it is vague and nebulous whether Cadets are "in" the Army.
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1LT (Join to see)
Hello, contracted cadet here. For SMP cadets like myself I will say yes. I have unit, I am still expected to drill, follow army rules and regulations and I can still be punished under UCMJ. Deployable? No. As to commission you need your degree and deploying would hold this up so contacting makes you non-deployable. However, if you are not SMP I'll say no. Yes you are expected to follow Army rules and regs, follow your chain of command etc. But if you get kicked out or fail out, you're free (might have to pay back some money though). However if I leave the program for whatever reason, I am still obligated to finished my original enlistment contract to my ETS or extension if one was signed, which usually has to happen to get your full pay. I also occur TIS. Non SMP do not.
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If they are drilling in an Army Reserve or National Guard unit as an Simultaneous Membership Program (SMP) then they are in the Army (Selected Reserve capacity).
If they are just an ROTC Cadet, but contracted then they are not officially "in the Army" as LTC Jason Mackay outlined- it is a very grey area. Some people consider them in the Army, but they are just in training.
Cadet Command is a separate part of the Army anyways since they don't fall under Forces Command (FORSCOM) or Training and Doctrine Command (TRADOC) like other Soldiers do. Cadets go to training but are only provided meals and lodging, but not pay (since they are not in the Army officially).
If they are just an ROTC Cadet, but contracted then they are not officially "in the Army" as LTC Jason Mackay outlined- it is a very grey area. Some people consider them in the Army, but they are just in training.
Cadet Command is a separate part of the Army anyways since they don't fall under Forces Command (FORSCOM) or Training and Doctrine Command (TRADOC) like other Soldiers do. Cadets go to training but are only provided meals and lodging, but not pay (since they are not in the Army officially).
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That's an interesting question...when I was on Army ROTC scholarship, I got a 3-yr in my 2nd yr undergrad, I wasn't able to finish the program, and went USAF OTS instead back when it was at Lackland after I finished my bachelors, before it got moved to Maxwell...I'd most definitely say yeah, purely from an experiential standpoint, obviously, that's not law, per se, of course...I spoke with an attorney once who'd been in Army ROTC during Vietnam, he was physically needed, he'd been on scholarship, he couldn't finish the program, he was told he'd been activated, he said he was still in school and was flat out told no, that they needed a body, and he was going to be used, so the whole activation thing for him, at least, was actually invoked, rare as that might be, I gather...now, in my case, they didn't activate me, in similar fashion, that was long before I had the discussion with him about what happened to him, though, I gather, they certainly could've used me if there'd been a similar need, when I was released from the program, I was actually given my honorable discharge, plus, all my records are actually on file from Army ROTC at NPRC in St. Louis, so, and I entirely realize this is purely my own viewpoint, I'd, as I'd said, most definitely say yeah, for sure...I entirely grant I could be wrong, and he was the only instance I'd ever personally run across of someone who'd been so activated, he wasn't used in Vietnam, he'd been sent to Germany, he'd said, then he'd gone back to finish his undergrad, then went for law, however, it it happened to him, which I know for a fact it apparently did, I'd be quite certain it could certainly happen to others as well, by all means, it'd depend on circumstances, certainly, of course, however, I'd by no means place it outside the bounds of legal reality, you know? I just figured you'd find that an interesting story, if nothing else, OK?
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You are not in the Army.
From MIT ROTC webpage explains this question as good as any other.
Enrolling in Army ROTC is not, strictly speaking, joining the Army. You will not be sent to boot camp. However, the primary purpose of the Army ROTC program is to produce its Officers, so you must agree to serve as Officers in the Army after graduation in order to go through the entire program, or if you have received an ROTC scholarship. Enrolling in the ROTC Basic Course (the first two years of college) does NOT obligate you to serve unless you have also received a scholarship.
So, you are not in the Army, and solely being a contracted cadet doesn't subject you to the UCMJ.
Scholarship winners must serve for four years; non-scholarship Cadets who enroll in the ROTC Advanced Course must serve for three years. All who graduate and complete ROTC training are commissioned as Second Lieutenants in the U.S. Army.
From MIT ROTC webpage explains this question as good as any other.
Enrolling in Army ROTC is not, strictly speaking, joining the Army. You will not be sent to boot camp. However, the primary purpose of the Army ROTC program is to produce its Officers, so you must agree to serve as Officers in the Army after graduation in order to go through the entire program, or if you have received an ROTC scholarship. Enrolling in the ROTC Basic Course (the first two years of college) does NOT obligate you to serve unless you have also received a scholarship.
So, you are not in the Army, and solely being a contracted cadet doesn't subject you to the UCMJ.
Scholarship winners must serve for four years; non-scholarship Cadets who enroll in the ROTC Advanced Course must serve for three years. All who graduate and complete ROTC training are commissioned as Second Lieutenants in the U.S. Army.
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MAJ Ronnie Reams
When I was in ROTC, most cadets, such as myself, were commissioned as a Reserve Officer in the Army of the United States. Only Distinguished Grads and Scholarship cadets were commissioned in the United States Army.
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SMSgt Lawrence McCarter
MAJ Ronnie Reams - Ye, and some that did go on active duty with Reserve commissions were later upgraded to regular commissions which was usually as a result of some outstanding performance. Sometimes also some officer's held a higher Reserve rank than a regular commissioned rank that they actually wore on their active duty service time.
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MAJ Ronnie Reams
SMSgt Lawrence McCarter - Yep, AUS rank. During the 12-12-12 times you would be a Captain AUS 24 months after commissioning, if you agreed to stay 12 more months. At 36 months when REFRAD You were a brand new 1LT USAR with 0 TIG. I knew some integrated RA Os, they had an OF prefix on serial number.
RVN still going but winding down, so many went into the AUS. When in OBC, we were asked many times to take an AUS tour, if not on one.
RVN still going but winding down, so many went into the AUS. When in OBC, we were asked many times to take an AUS tour, if not on one.
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