Posted on Aug 18, 2015
"Ben Bernanke: Being In the Military Won’t Actually Help You in the Real World"
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From: Foreign Policy
The U.S. military has spent tens of millions of dollars on TV advertising promoting the armed forces as a great way to acquire skills and training that will pay dividends in the private sector. But on Monday, one of the country’s most respected observers of the U.S. labor force, former Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke, directly contradicted that message.
“The evidence appears to be that there really is not an advantage,” Bernanke told a crowd at a Brookings Institution event in Washington. “If you go into the military at age 18 — versus an identical person who stays in the private sector and takes a private sector job — 10 years later, if you leave the military, your skills and wages are probably not going to be quite as high on average as the private sector person.”
Bernanke specifically called out the U.S. Army for using misleading advertising and noted that for veterans who left the military after 2001, the unemployment rate is just above 7 percent, as opposed to the national average of 5.3 percent.
“The military takes our younger people and uses them for good purposes, but it’s not really adding much to the private sector through training or other experience,” Bernanke said.
The remarks have already drawn heavy fire from veterans who say the renowned economist, widely credited for leading the Fed out of the greatest financial crisis since the Great Depression, is wrong on the facts.
“I am not sure where Mr. Bernanke got his information, but the current numbers just don’t reflect saying military service does not help you succeed in the private sector,” said Fred Wellman, a 22-year Army veteran and CEO of ScoutComms, a veteran-focused advocacy firm. “The most current surveys show that veterans are far more likely to be employed than non-veterans and earn higher median incomes in those jobs.”
Frustrated by the claim, Wellman added that Bernanke’s remarks were “just another example of the civil-military divide, wherein Americans have ill-informed or dated views of what veterans bring to our country.”
Phil Carter, an Army vet who served in Iraq and is now a senior fellow at the Center for a New American Security, says the reality is more complicated than both sides are letting on.
According to surveys and data from the Department of Veterans Affairs, Wellman is correct that the total unemployment rate for veterans overall is lower than for the general public. However, Bernanke is also correct that post-9/11 veterans, specifically, have a higher unemployment rate than non-veterans when adjusting for demographic differences.
Carter said that an important factor is that veterans who served prior to 9/11 — predominantly white males — tend to do well in the private sector and are beating the national average for unemployment by a significant margin, a fact that distorts the average.
However, he also pushed back against Bernanke, noting that post-9/11 veterans won’t immediately see a benefit from military service due to the time it takes to readjust to private sector work. But, he said, those skills do pay off over time — which will be reflected in future surveys.
“It takes time for veterans to catch up, but the data show that they do catch up and, in many ways, surpass their peers over time,” he said.
Ultimately though, Carter acknowledged that Bernanke’s contention is a sensitive one because it threatens the entire premise of America’s modern military. “Bernanke’s speaking a very uncomfortable truth that goes to the core of the all-volunteer force,” said Carter. “The whole idea is it can recruit people by saying, ‘You’ll serve your country and be better off afterwards,’” he said. “Bernanke’s comments suggest that might not be true, and that’s a big problem for the all-volunteer force.”
https://foreignpolicy.com/2015/08/17/ben-bernanke-being-in-the-military-wont-actually-help-you-in-the-real-world/
The U.S. military has spent tens of millions of dollars on TV advertising promoting the armed forces as a great way to acquire skills and training that will pay dividends in the private sector. But on Monday, one of the country’s most respected observers of the U.S. labor force, former Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke, directly contradicted that message.
“The evidence appears to be that there really is not an advantage,” Bernanke told a crowd at a Brookings Institution event in Washington. “If you go into the military at age 18 — versus an identical person who stays in the private sector and takes a private sector job — 10 years later, if you leave the military, your skills and wages are probably not going to be quite as high on average as the private sector person.”
Bernanke specifically called out the U.S. Army for using misleading advertising and noted that for veterans who left the military after 2001, the unemployment rate is just above 7 percent, as opposed to the national average of 5.3 percent.
“The military takes our younger people and uses them for good purposes, but it’s not really adding much to the private sector through training or other experience,” Bernanke said.
The remarks have already drawn heavy fire from veterans who say the renowned economist, widely credited for leading the Fed out of the greatest financial crisis since the Great Depression, is wrong on the facts.
“I am not sure where Mr. Bernanke got his information, but the current numbers just don’t reflect saying military service does not help you succeed in the private sector,” said Fred Wellman, a 22-year Army veteran and CEO of ScoutComms, a veteran-focused advocacy firm. “The most current surveys show that veterans are far more likely to be employed than non-veterans and earn higher median incomes in those jobs.”
Frustrated by the claim, Wellman added that Bernanke’s remarks were “just another example of the civil-military divide, wherein Americans have ill-informed or dated views of what veterans bring to our country.”
Phil Carter, an Army vet who served in Iraq and is now a senior fellow at the Center for a New American Security, says the reality is more complicated than both sides are letting on.
According to surveys and data from the Department of Veterans Affairs, Wellman is correct that the total unemployment rate for veterans overall is lower than for the general public. However, Bernanke is also correct that post-9/11 veterans, specifically, have a higher unemployment rate than non-veterans when adjusting for demographic differences.
Carter said that an important factor is that veterans who served prior to 9/11 — predominantly white males — tend to do well in the private sector and are beating the national average for unemployment by a significant margin, a fact that distorts the average.
However, he also pushed back against Bernanke, noting that post-9/11 veterans won’t immediately see a benefit from military service due to the time it takes to readjust to private sector work. But, he said, those skills do pay off over time — which will be reflected in future surveys.
“It takes time for veterans to catch up, but the data show that they do catch up and, in many ways, surpass their peers over time,” he said.
Ultimately though, Carter acknowledged that Bernanke’s contention is a sensitive one because it threatens the entire premise of America’s modern military. “Bernanke’s speaking a very uncomfortable truth that goes to the core of the all-volunteer force,” said Carter. “The whole idea is it can recruit people by saying, ‘You’ll serve your country and be better off afterwards,’” he said. “Bernanke’s comments suggest that might not be true, and that’s a big problem for the all-volunteer force.”
https://foreignpolicy.com/2015/08/17/ben-bernanke-being-in-the-military-wont-actually-help-you-in-the-real-world/
Posted in these groups: 
Military Life
Civilian Career
Military Life Civilian Career
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 33
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Any statistic can be manipulated to fit the individual's agenda. I have never met anyone in the military who joined to get rich. That type of personr is not typically motivated to become rich and powerful, more like a defender of the innocent from the bullies of the world. That has never been a high paying job. Military, EMT's, firefighters, cops, all bust their butt for peanuts yet get crap wages. But salary be damned. That type of service is a calling, not a line on some resume. Even if we start out behind our civilian counterparts, I would hire a veteran any day for what they bring to the table. It can't be taught in any classroom and certainly not in any board room.
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CPT Jack Durish
Pause me while I stop laughing...
What does Bernanke know about the military?
What does Bernanke know about "the real world"?
I'll start listening to economists when they display at least as much common sense as a weather forecaster. At least they assign percentages to their predictions. Economists predict with absolute certainty and then spend most of their time explaining why they were wrong.
What does Bernanke know about the military?
What does Bernanke know about "the real world"?
I'll start listening to economists when they display at least as much common sense as a weather forecaster. At least they assign percentages to their predictions. Economists predict with absolute certainty and then spend most of their time explaining why they were wrong.
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CH (MAJ) (Join to see)
"Any statistic can be manipulated to fit the individual's agenda" Daddy always said "Figures don't lie, but liars figure."
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SFC Dr. Joseph Finck, BS, MA, DSS
SFC James Sczymanski and SFC Mark Merino As Mark Twain said "there's liars, damn liars, and statistics."
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If true, then this is another example of what is wrong with our country and by extension, the world. Bernanke might be another child of the sixties who have only hidden contempt for the military since spitting on Vets became less popular.
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SGT Nelson Skinner
In Bernanke's world, all he sees are hereditary financial mavens and hereditary Ivy Leaguers.
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I went in homeless. I came out with the knowlege and skills to get a job in security and the ability to go to nursing school. Without the military I would still be homeless. Sorry Mr. Burnanke but you're wrong.
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"Catch up?" to what? So we can be as smart as you and say crap like this?
NO THANK YOU!
I'm fine Ben - and if it weren't for people like me and my RP brothers and sisters, you'd be saying that crap in a different language!
NO THANK YOU!
I'm fine Ben - and if it weren't for people like me and my RP brothers and sisters, you'd be saying that crap in a different language!
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SGT (Join to see)
With all due respect CMSgt, I think what he may have been referring to is the transition from military life to the civilian sector. That's just what I got from it.
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CMSgt Mark Schubert
SGT (Join to see) - agreed. And in that transition, he's saying (what I'm hearing) is that when that happens, we (military) are far behind where we would have been had we not joined the military in the first place and stayed in the civilian sector - so we have to "catch up". The point (to me) is, catch up to what? Life is NOT about how smart you are, it's about how much you serve others! Life (to me) is measured by how much you give away, not by how much you get! You cannot take it with you! :-)
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SGT DelRay Davis
I would agree that the military gives a great deal in terms of commitment, integrity, teamwork, and brotherhood.
But I will give the decidedly unpopular opinion, that when my recruiter told me that my AIT skills would translate directly into the private sector, he was full of shit. On a professional level, I most definitely did play catch up after I got out.
But I will give the decidedly unpopular opinion, that when my recruiter told me that my AIT skills would translate directly into the private sector, he was full of shit. On a professional level, I most definitely did play catch up after I got out.
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I think part of that has to do that the private sector won't generally accept military training and certificates. That means that service members have to go back to school or take a test to get a job in the civilian world that they have already been doing in the military (and probably at a higher level too). Also, it seems like he is not accounting for the fact that a veteran can get out of service with all of that experience, then get a college degree (pretty much for free these days), and then get a better job than his civilian counterpart who couldn't afford to go to college. I think his assertions are disingenuous at best.
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SFC Michael Milihram
Sgt. Elphick, with all due respect to a fellow NCO, I spent 24 yrs in uniform as a Reservist and Guardsman.....did my last 4 years of service on active duty status. I've had numerous civilian professions and jobs during that time, and I could write, not a book, but at least pamphlets or papers on the advantages my military service brought to the work I did, and how the employers and fellow employees benefitted and in some cases were thankful for the depth and width of my experiences in the military-especially the leadership qualities and experience-which lent themselves to civilian work. Mr. Bernanke's perspectives and comments are very narrowly focused and more than a bit biased.
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I took it to mean , that military service is not a guarantee of success in the civilian world , as some recruiting ads might have one believe.
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SFC Michael Milihram
I dunno Sir; I spent 20 years as a classroom teacher, Middle School to College level, and I always maintained military service almost always gave a prospective employee an edge over someone else, equally qualified, who didn't have military service. There's a level of respect, loyalty, positive work ethic, integrity and individual pride which comes from MOST military people, which has been eroded or excised from our Public Educational systems in the last 30+ years, and that tendency to ignore qualities like these is being reinforced in movies, TV shows, music, etc....
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MAJ (Join to see)
I totally agree that it Can set you up for success.. Ultimately it falls on the individual though to determine whether one is successful or not. Military service does not guarantee future success, I agree with you that it Be a factor in one's success though.
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MAJ (Join to see)
Another question is how does one define "success"? For some it may be landing a six figure income job for others it might be putting it 1000hrs a year into volunteer work. Really it is a very subjective thing.
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Sure Mr. Bernake...If by that you mean that former military have a harder time adjusting to the sometimes less than honorable, often other than forthright and occasionally down-right confusing nature of some aspects of the modern work force.
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SPC Thomas Baldwin
Commander that is so on target, service members don't deal very well with back stabbing your fellows.
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I don't think he's wrong. But I also don't believe going to college will actually help you in the real world either. Your ability to leverage your interests, networks, people skills, and experience - to include the military and your education - is the biggest factor.
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It always seem to amaze me that there is someone who thinks he knows everything but doesn't have a clue about what the military is all about. As a young person coming out of high school who has no idea what career path they want to follow or can't afford to go to college the military affords them the opportunities to gain experience and education that they would never have been able to get otherwise. In addition, the military affords individuals the opportunity to receive leadership experience. I would hire a veteran who has all the experience the military provides before anyone else.
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There is a valid point in what he says, but only partly accurate. The fact that the military is a ranked based pay system vice job skill set pay scale differentiate's us from the commercial industry. There are a lot of over paid people in the military that stay in because they cannot make the same pay in the commercial industry based on their skill set. The highly technical people in the military tend to leave early after getting the training and find good jobs in the tech sector. I know people will disagree with me, but it is reality. Until the military begins to model the commercial sector in pay, it will continue to become an issue.
It will continue to be a problem of losing the best early or keeping the best to retirement.
It will continue to be a problem of losing the best early or keeping the best to retirement.
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