Posted on Feb 11, 2022
Can a corporal in a team leader position have me do corrective action (“smoke” me)? And was I wrong to tell him to eat a bag of dicks?
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We just got a new Corporal who recently reclassed to mortars. He’s highly motivated (hooah), and during a training event, we had a disagreement over how to perform large deflections. He told me to "drop," but the fire mission he was calling would’ve put us outside the safety fan during a live fire and could have potentially caused injuries to other elements participating in the exercise.
Now, I understand and respect his rank, but I’ve been a mortarman longer and currently serve as the Gun 2 gunner. The fact is—he was wrong. He just became an 11C, and when he wouldn’t listen to correction or reason, I told him (admittedly out of frustration) to eat a bag of d***s.
I’m curious to hear what others think—especially when it comes to situations where rank clashes with experience and safety is on the line.
Now, I understand and respect his rank, but I’ve been a mortarman longer and currently serve as the Gun 2 gunner. The fact is—he was wrong. He just became an 11C, and when he wouldn’t listen to correction or reason, I told him (admittedly out of frustration) to eat a bag of d***s.
I’m curious to hear what others think—especially when it comes to situations where rank clashes with experience and safety is on the line.
Edited 5 mo ago
Posted 4 y ago
Responses: 358
He should have smoked your arrogant ass right away, then recommended you for an Article 15. Just because you're the same pay grade doesn't make you equal. So what you've been doing it longer, so what you're the gunner. If he was wrong, show him where he went wrong and how he went wrong, but be tactful. He's got the hard stripes and you've got the sham shield. He tells you to drop, you fucking well better drop. Get over yourself, stop being an asshole, and yes, you were not only wrong, you were insubordinate and disrespectful.
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If you are so stupid as to have to ask that question, you deserve three days of P and P!
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Yea you were, but I don't blame you, just don't get mad at what comes after it....military life is all cause and effect, with context serving very little....if you felt the Cpl was wrong you should have rogered up and went to the Sgt, then if you didnt like his answer to the SSgt, and so on. Hard for some to swallow but you do your duty first, then contemplate the justification for how you feel about it, unless he's asking you to do something dangerous you just "aye aye" and that way if you present it and did everything a junior service member should do it gives your arguement more weight when you bring it up....course you could just wait till after work hours and jump him if he's being a douche...you know like it should be...then just say he fell. Basically what im sayin is rank has its privileges but you also can hang yourself with that same rope if your not careful.
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Really? I can’t believe this question. When are you boots gonna learn? If your higher up gives you a command, and as long as it is not gonna endanger lives, you may Tactfully state your disagreement by ways of saying,” I’m a little perplexed. We’ve always done it this way, is this the new way I haven’t been informed of?” Wait for his/her response. If he/she insists, then do it in a safe manner. When it blows up in their face, don’t do a victory dance. Just let it marinate in their mind. Never challenge a superior. Your gonna lose. Learn to be creative in messing with them tactically. It’s much more fun and you learn how to deal with idiots. Something you will need when you ETS.
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I hope he smokes the crap out of you, wrong or right it doesn't matter if you wish to correct anyone be sure to have the correct information with you and approach the subject tactfully, in the meantime how is that Bag of Dicks going down for you.
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I’ve informed many NCOs they were wrong or the orders they are giving would take up more time than we have. Some listened others did not. So stuff was damaged or took a lot longer. I’ll follow the dumb order then laugh or shake my head when it goes wrong, unless someone’s life could be in danger.
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"Leaders are only as good as the men around them". Some NCOs and Officers have no idea what the hell they're doing, and if what he was telling you to do was clearly wrong, you were right to correct and call him out for an order that was procedurally and factually wrong. How else is he supposed to know?
Now, I say that, but just know that theres always 2 answers to a question. The "right" answer, based on your knowledge of the regs and experience, and the "branch" answer -which often has nothing to do with the regs or experience. Its based on "getting the mission done at all costs" and its 9/10 times the most stupid. BUT its often levied by brass and rank. If you're gonna challenge brass and rank, be prepared to be smoked. The key is standing your ground and using your knowledge of the regs to back up your actions.
Now, I say that, but just know that theres always 2 answers to a question. The "right" answer, based on your knowledge of the regs and experience, and the "branch" answer -which often has nothing to do with the regs or experience. Its based on "getting the mission done at all costs" and its 9/10 times the most stupid. BUT its often levied by brass and rank. If you're gonna challenge brass and rank, be prepared to be smoked. The key is standing your ground and using your knowledge of the regs to back up your actions.
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SSG Robert Perrotto
There is no "knowledge or Reg" that justifies disrespect, insubordination. or jealousy. this specialist acted this way simply because he was jealous for being passed over for the team leader position. He deliberately challenged his team leader, and then lost his military bearing. Disrespect, disobeyed, and sexually harrassed his team leader, not to mentioned he also fostered a hostile work environment by utilizing sexually charged language. All because he wanted to undermine his teamleader.
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Well hate to say it, but rank has its privileges. It would have been better to help him out/teach him. Now a new position can go to a person head especially a first assignment as a leader! Now mind you a bad leader will be found out, some one watching the watcher will call him on his actions/treatment. Just remember when it comes to orders from a higher up you have to carry them out except if they are unlawful orders and even that has been a subject of debate. Also remember your leader has a leader, if you think it unlawful you got a change of command. Experience in the civilian world will get you power and money, but in the military it will get you certain awards that will eventually get you a promotion. When you get your rank hopefully you will remember how you were treated and treat your troops with dignity. Best regards and remember rank has its privileges.
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It shows how jealousy is an ugly color maybe if you'd tried harder you'd have been promoted. Buy the super Hookah comment shows that the other guy is invested in his career and you're collecting a paycheck. It doesn't matter that you're both E-4 your professionalism in that situation proved that your not ready for the rank you're wearing yes you know the job but you don't know your place.
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A CPL is a Jr. NCO as such out ranks any specialist E-4, and has legal authority to order a specialist to do anything not restricted by the UCMJ as unlawful.
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