Posted on Apr 22, 2017
SGT Team Leader
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Had an interesting moment where in a soldier had me direct dial his BN CMD while correcting him about him wearing black lipstick, earrings, finger jewlery and ripped pants.

The CMD informed me I needed to read the regulations, which I have done so.

As far as I've read and know, there has been no update that allows male soldiers to wear this off-duty while on post.
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Responses: 363
SFC Caretaker
221
221
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Ok let's stop right their! I'm all for flaming individuals and their rights and your personal choice! A lot of these individuals make outstanding soldiers! But NO! I do not agree when a female soldier off duty on base dresses like a $2 hooker! And I do not agree that a male dresses like the damn crow with no hair!

I hate to be controversial, but the buck has to stop somewhere! if your going to a crazy club where you dress like this then ok that's one thing. But save the on base costumes for Halloween and Mardi Graw if your stationed out that way!

Uniformity is a time honored tradition! Your part of legacy! You should be honored to be a part of.
Just my thoughts on this subject!
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SPC Stiv ChenRobbins
SPC Stiv ChenRobbins
>1 y
Um, WTF is going on here? This has degenerated into some wierd drunken pissing contest between sgt dan and po2 john.... I haven't been on rallypoint very much for a while, is this what it has become?
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SSG Russell Busicchia
SSG Russell Busicchia
>1 y
SFC (Join to see) - I don't get your security clearance reference. I was in the Army Security Agency (ASA), later Intelligence and Security Command (INSCOM). I held TS SCI access my entire 20 year career. At one time or another I was given access to most SCI projects. I was never not allowed to drink or take OTC drugs. In fact, ASA troops were heavy drinkers and big party people. Please explain, I retired in 1994 have things changed that much?
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SFC Caretaker
SFC (Join to see)
>1 y
SSG Russell Busicchia Crypto 14x3 with Cosmic & Eyes only NTK. I don’t know what’s behind the green dor though?.... yet I have my suspicions lol
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SP5 Derick Johnsohne
SP5 Derick Johnsohne
>1 y
even though i feel personally about the right to freedom of expression, when we joined, we voluntarily agreed to submit to a common set of rules . those who were involuntarily 'joined' naturally did not agree to that mindset, and i feel for them, but that army was a 'long' time ago .
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SSG(P) Ncoic
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197
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Sometimes, I really wonder why individuals join a team organization which requires uniformaty, customs, and structured rules since the 1800's. That, they think that some of the infractions are ok and question you or make you the bad guy because you have intergrity to pump the brakes. There is other terminology I want to use but this is not the place, so I will conclude with YIKES!!!! So not ok by any means. Hopefully, others will post a more educated reply. Good Luck
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LTC Armor Brown
LTC Armor Brown
>1 y
We should remember that as you were whisked through the processing center you did hold up your hand and adhere to the constitution and rules and regulations of superior officers. While I believe young soldiers should have a word or two about this issue, they must be given time to gain the experience to discuss this rationally. I am so very tired of the quick retort or snappy remark that show you take no honest effort to understand the issue or thoughtfully respond.
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SP5 Derick Johnsohne
SP5 Derick Johnsohne
>1 y
SPC Chris Ison - down thumb that i am not allowed to click yet . comment is out of place because not being extravagant does not mean one is only allowed to be a bull dyke .
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SPC Chris Ison
SPC Chris Ison
>1 y
SP5 Derick Johnsohne - That was in repsonse to the follwing comment:

SGT Arno Paul Schumann
4 y
Gay culture has no place and feminine culture has very little place in the American military
culture. The necessary psyche for nat'l defense is a tough and masculine one. Men took Normandy and Fallujah - not human beings or dedicated persons or trusting team members - men, with training, won these and other similar battles.

He basically said bull dykes shoudl enlist and women should not.

You need to learn how to fucking read before you start running off at the fucking mouth.
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SP5 Derick Johnsohne
SP5 Derick Johnsohne
>1 y
SPC Chris Ison - the thread is unclear . would you ever forgive me for being so out of your line of thinking ? thank you so much . peace .
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Capt Seid Waddell
136
136
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Lord have mercy! It's not your Daddy's military any more, is it?
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SPC Mark Mercer
SPC Mark Mercer
5 y
Right??? Holy crap some of these questions!!!
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PO3 Paul Belham
PO3 Paul Belham
5 y
It certainly is not the military I served in that why I got out in 82 when all this shit started.
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LTC Armor Brown
LTC Armor Brown
>1 y
When you got out this stuff had already been happening. First Line supervisors ignored it, and commands said they less I know the better. The military is constantly changing, and our military tries to change tactics, strategy and leadership. If you don't you end up on the dustbin of history
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SP5 Derick Johnsohne
SP5 Derick Johnsohne
>1 y
no it isnt . i found out myself when i joined post vietnam, i thought i was in girl scout camp .
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Can male soldiers wear lipstick, earrings and ripped clothes while off duty, but on post?
1SG First Sergeant
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AR 670-1 states that male soldiers are not authorized to wear earrings. Until their gender is officially changed by DEERS on the DA 1172 and ERB they will follow all regulations as a male. This issue needs to be brought to the chain of command to fix the infraction. There is also a blurb within the regulation that addressed ripped clothing and maintaining a professional appearance while in civilian clothing.
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SSgt Heather-Lynne Van Wilde
SSgt Heather-Lynne Van Wilde
8 y
SGT Brianna MacKinnon - Heh ... yeah, I had that same issue, just Air Force myself. A very rough few years of my life realizing who and what I was but having to hide it from literally everyone
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1px xxx
Suspended Profile
5 y
1SG, AR 670-1 states "Male Soldiers may not wear earrings when in civilian clothes on duty". When male and female Soldiers are not in uniform and off duty, earring wear is not restricted as long as the earrings do not create or support ear gauging (enlarged holes in the lobe of the ear, greater than 1.6 mm).
1SG First Sergeant
1SG (Join to see)
5 y
SFC Wilfredo Ramos Tracking all. This was written a long time ago. I am aware of the changes as a lot more have come out over the past month as well.
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PO2 Sandra Schreiner
PO2 Sandra Schreiner
5 y
SPC Michael Blanton - "if they do don't join a man's Army, Marines, Navy Or Air Force or any of the Guards..they don't need these type of "people " serving our great country"
.....Man's military huh? Be sure to point that out to any female Sailor, Soldier, Airman, or Marine you see. Be sure to let them know that they're serving in the "men's service". I served and witnessed first hand how strong the female community in the military is and we have to worker harder than any man for the same amount of recognition. Hopefully you don't have a daughter hoping to follow your lead and join the service knowing full well you think it's just a men's club. That absolutely disgusting.
Also, get off of what people do off duty. Not on watch or muster or in any sort of working capacity at the time? Who cares what you wear. They're just clothes. Let people be who they are.

Also, let's just go ahead and remember that DADT was repealed for a reason, how about we pay closer attention to mental health of service members and understand why don't ask don't tell made for a weaker and more divided military.
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1SG Civil Affairs Specialist
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Let's go down the list:
1. Black lipstick - nope. Females can't wear that color either, so that rules out any transgender loophole.
2. Earrings - nope. Not for males.
3. Finger jewelry - has a limit of two rings. More than that is wrong.
4. Ripped pants - local judgment call. For me, depends on where the rips are. IE knees maybe, crotch or backside exposed whole lot of nope.

Back in my day, a joe walking around like this would not make it far before a flock of NCO would descend and regulate. How this is no longer the case is mind-boggling to me.
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1SG Civil Affairs Specialist
1SG (Join to see)
8 y
Sgt Ron Harris - Worse, there is a distinct infection of people who wish to protect them in their snow-flakey tendencies.
We can argue over what the regulation MEANS, but there isn't a whole lot to argue about regarding what it SAYS.
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MSgt Electronics Maintenance Chief
MSgt (Join to see)
>1 y
Times change and so does the military, just not as radically or rapidly as the civilian world. Case in point, when I was a Pvt in the Marines in 68, we were required to wear trousers , belts, shoes other that PT type (and we all knew what that meant), and shirts with collars before we could go on liberty. And that was whether it was off base or on base. Doing otherwise lent you open to a multitude of NCOs, SNCOs, and Officers grabbing ahold of you and having your command knowing about it the next morning. No tattoos were allowed, visible or not. And that was the norm at El Toro and Camp Pendleton. Over the 20 years I served, regulations relaxed, although not by much, but the mores of the senior enlisted and Officer corps didn't very much. Yes, you had Marines with earrings, but heaven help said individual if he was observed wearing one. And it wasn't just the senior personnel. Many young NCOs were just as adamant about off duty wear as I and my contemporaries were. But Corps wide, regulations were being relaxed. Tattoos not visible while in uniform were being allowed, you could wear jeans (no holes) and collarless shirts as long as they weren't considered PT items off and on base. But males wearing make-up, not so much. Marines have always had to have proper haircuts and be clean shaven, but that was a no brainer, although you always had those that would push the reg's just to see how far they could go. That was 30 years ago. El Toro is gone, but the Marines I observe either off base or on at Camp Pendleton are still pretty much squared away. I still don't see anyone with torn jeans or long un-kept hair. I have seen more Marines with tattoos and even some wearing earrings off base. While on base I haven't observed much of a change in what was back in the day referred to as conforming to proper attire. But, as has been stated before, I was in the Marines. We cling to our ways a lot more than our brother services. Would someone who wore the above described articles be any less effective in a combat role? I can't answer that without knowing the individual. But, someone who will disobey or question regulations gives me the impression they might be incline to do so when the shit hits the fan. Especially, if they are confronted and continue to argue. Best to go change, then see your SgtMaj for clarification the next day.
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1SG Civil Affairs Specialist
1SG (Join to see)
>1 y
MSgt (Join to see) - Finest response so far.
I don't get it, truly, why anyone would WANT to go out looking like a freaking carnie.
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SCPO Henry Malone
SCPO Henry Malone
>1 y
Contrary to popular belief and political correctness the military is not a democracy.!!!!!
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CPT Aaron Kletzing
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Edited 5 y ago
I would check with your local command's policies on this.
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SA Wayne Chapin
SA Wayne Chapin
5 y
1SG Fred "SARGE" Bucci the exact comment "it's kinda eye opening to even be telling about male soldiers ....etc. wearing lipstick..." is ignorant, repugnant and bigoted at best.
Regs are regs, fine. Go with that. The additional bullshit silly ass commentary is a pathetic attempt at covering for his obvious self hating hemophilia. Yours is just a boomer shooting off at the mouth.

And really, fuck you "Sarge" (real original knickname, you obviously picked for yourself). Telling me to pull me head out, no matter how creatively you tried to do so is still the same thing. So where's the respect you're preaching about? And man up and just say it. Don't mince words like a little bitch. Come out and say what you mean.
While we're at it, what is it that you and the good captain are so afraid of? Huh? All this chest thumping hooah makes me wonder how much meat peeking you've been doing in the showers.
The soldier in question wearing lipstick was going goth, not gay, but you poor guys in the closet are just so ashamed of yourselves that you lash out at him because he has the guts to be himself while you wear your wife's panties while she's away. Come on out of the closet Top, it's okay.
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SA Wayne Chapin
SA Wayne Chapin
5 y
1SG Fred "SARGE" Bucci okay boomer
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SA Wayne Chapin
SA Wayne Chapin
5 y
1SG Fred "SARGE" Bucci in 30 years of service you never learned English? I never called you thin!
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SA Wayne Chapin
SA Wayne Chapin
5 y
The comment you've made about eye opening to talk about male soldiers etc. wearing lipstick is such bigoted homophobic garbage that you as an officer, let alone an American should be ashamed. He wasn't in uniform, wasn't on duty or operating in any official capacity. But your tiny little ego is so affected by the mere thought of someone possibly crossing bullshit gender lines that you make a public statement of such ignorance that it smacks of incompetence in other aspects of your command.
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SGT(P) Jazmin Johnson
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36
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Unfortunately your establishment soaked in tradition and uniformity has been attacked by the social standards of "accepting without question". I believe that the military should stay as such, we have a job to do and shouldn't have time to conform to the milenials agenda.
I realize I'm low on the todom pole as of now, but some day...
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SGT(P) Jazmin Johnson
SGT(P) Jazmin Johnson
>1 y
My apologies, I meant our not your. I'm not sure how I missed that typo. No matter how silly regulations may get in this matter I will always be proud in this uniform.
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SGT(P) Jazmin Johnson
SGT(P) Jazmin Johnson
>1 y
I see the term milenial as more of a mindset, however I do see your point as well.
I suppose I'm just set in an old army way from my father that whether in uniform or not you are a soldier and should conduct yourself in that professional manor. The military has survived so many cultural changes, for example the Vietnam war left us with very few allies in our own country yet our customs ans traditions were still intact.
The army I was raised in was a family, it taught me values morals customs and traditions, I hate to see them being attacked.
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PVT Raymond Lopez
PVT Raymond Lopez
8 y
4be2b3db
SGT(P) Jazmin Johnson - You are Cav that is all that maters Little Sister welcome to to the Family!!
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SPC Tj F.
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And so, queue TAPS, we say so long to the "Professionalism" aspect of our "elite" armed forces. All stand and cheer for the future pussification of America.
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MSG James Hughs
MSG James Hughs
>1 y
SGT (Join to see) - Why can not the term "pussification" refer to a baby cat??? By assuming a different interpretation....is it not YOU that is being "sexist"?
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PO2 Buddy Stewart
PO2 Buddy Stewart
>1 y
MSG James Hughs - SPC Alyssa Knight's response is what's wrong with today's military IMHO.
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PVT Raymond Lopez
PVT Raymond Lopez
8 y
55a231ce
SGT (Join to see) - You would be surprised at what we said to each other the old days and we kicked ass!!!
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SFC Gerald Gatlin
SFC Gerald Gatlin
8 y
"A yellow bird, with a yellow bill..." "Casy Jones said before he died..."
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SSG Trevor S.
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20
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I found nothing concerning makeup for male Service Members when off duty. Please remember that there are almost always local policies regarding civilian attire as well.
As for the rest of this the latest version of 670-1 that I know about says this:

1–13. Wear of civilian clothing
a.
Civilian clothing is authorized for wear when off duty, unless the wear is prohibited by the installation
commander in CONUS or by the MACOM commander overseas. Commanders down to unit level may restrict the
wear of civilian clothes by those soldiers who have had their pass privileges revoked, under the provisions of AR
600–8–10.
b.
When on duty in civilian clothes, Army personnel will conform to the appearance standards in this regulation,
unless specifically exempted by the commander for specific mission requirements.
1–14. Wear of jewelry
a.
Soldiers may wear a wristwatch, a wrist identification bracelet, and a total of two rings (a wedding set is
considered one ring) with Army uniforms, unless prohibited by the commander for safety or health reasons. Any
jewelry soldiers wear must be conservative and in good taste. Identification bracelets are limited to medical alert
bracelets and MIA/POW identification bracelets. Soldiers may wear only one item on each wrist.
b.
No jewelry, other than that described in paragraph 1–14
a
, above, will appear exposed while wearing the uniform;
this includes watch chains, or similar items, and pens and pencils. The only authorized exceptions are religious items
described in para 1–7
b
, above; a conservative tie tack or tie clasp that male soldiers may wear with the black four-in-
hand necktie; and a pen or pencil that may appear exposed on the hospital duty, food service, CVC, or flight uniforms.
c.
Body piercing. When on any Army installation or other places under Army control, soldiers may not attach, affix,
or display objects, articles, jewelry, or ornamentation to or through the skin while they are in uniform, in civilian
clothes on duty, or in civilian clothes off duty (this includes earrings for male soldiers). The only exception is for
female soldiers, as indicated in paragraph 1–14
d
, below. (The term “skin” is not confined to external skin, but includes
the tongue, lips, inside the mouth, and other surfaces of the body not readily visible).
d.
Females are authorized to wear prescribed earrings with the service, dress, and mess uniforms.
(1) Earrings may be screw-on, clip-on, or post-type earrings, in gold, silver, white pearl, or diamond. The earrings
will not exceed 6 mm or
1

4
inch in diameter, and they must be unadorned and spherical. When worn, the earrings will
fit snugly against the ear. Females may wear earrings only as a matched pair, with only one earring per ear lobe.
(2) Females are not authorized to wear earrings with any class C (utility) uniform (BDU, hospital duty, food service,
physical fitness, field, or organizational).
(3) When on duty in civilian attire, female soldiers must comply with the specifications listed in (1) above when
wearing earrings, unless otherwise authorized by the commander. When females are off duty, there are no restrictions
on the wear of earrings.
e.
Ankle bracelets, necklaces (other than those described in para 1–7
b
), faddish (trendy) devices, medallions,
amulets, and personal talismans or icons are not authorized for wear in any military uniform, or in civilian clothes on
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PVT Lee Mckague
PVT Lee Mckague
>1 y
thank you for the update, when I was in army the code was different, only earrings were allowed to be worn if and only if the piercings had taken place before taking the oath of service, as far as makeup goes, had I seen any male wearing any kind of makeup while I was in service I would have brought it to the attention of the duty sgt. and ripped clothing for the posts I was stationed at were not allowed at all
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SFC Human Resources Specialist
SFC (Join to see)
>1 y
Males are prohibited from wearing cosmetics, except when medically prescribed. AR 670-1 3-2 B(1)
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SGM Robin Johnson
SGM Robin Johnson
8 y
Note that the entire personal appearance section is written almost exclusively to apply in uniform or in civilian clothes ON DUTY. It generally specifies when it applies off-duty and out-of-uniform as well. So the prohibition in par 3-2b(1) on make-up for males may be interpreted to apply in uniform or civilian clothes ON DUTY. IAW para 3-1b, it is up to the Soldier's commander to interpret the regulation and determine if his or her Soldier is in compliance when the regulation is not specific. Evidently this Soldier's commander determined he was in compliance. The prohibition on earrings for males in para 3-4c is actually only on piercings, so if the earrings were clip-on or magnetic, they could be determined to be in compliance as well. And para 3-4a limits the number of rings only in uniform or civilian clothes ON DUTY, so there is no prohibition on 'finger jewellry' off duty and out of uniform. The ripped jeans would only be prohibited if the commander determined they did not meet the 'professional appearance' standard of para 3-1a, and most commanders do not get too into the weeds on this when their Soldiers are off-duty and out of uniform.
Bottom line, compliance with the regulation goes both ways; just as Soldiers must obey the regulation, regardless of opinion or preference, Soldiers must enforce ONLY what is in the regulation, regardless of opinion or preference.
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Sgt Ron Harris
Sgt Ron Harris
8 y
Yeah, yeah, yeah! When I was in, the only personnel that wore ear rings and lip stick squatted to pee!
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1SG Charles Simpson
16
16
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Edited >1 y ago
Any male human being who wears lipstick, earrings, ripped clothing or adheres to any other of the ridiculous, childish fads of the civilian culture is not, has never been nor will ever be a soldier. Soldiers are willing to accept the atmosphere of regimentation and brotherhood at all times while serving in our military forces because they know it is necessary to win the battle and protect those civilian misfits back home. If you don't want to be a soldier 100% of the time, stay home with those misfits and let the willing soldiers do their jobs without distraction.
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Sgt Joseph Baker
Sgt Joseph Baker
8 y
I propose that much of what you see is a direct result of the recruiting methods of the Army over the last 30 years. The Army recruiting ads mostly focus on what the Army has to offer the recruit, things like Montgomery GI Bill for example. While it is a great benefit, the Army recruiters turned it into a primary reason for joining the Army. Today when a war starts you hear people (note I don't use 'soldier' here) whining they joined the Army for college benefits and didn't actually think the Army would make them go into conflict if the need arose. This same attitude permeates the thinking of soldiers who buck all the regulations all the time. They didn't sign up to be soldiers, they signed up for the benefits. I rarely witnessed this in the Marines, and I believe that the difference is the Marine Corps Recruiting advertisements generally focus more on the challenge and the honor of becoming a Marine, member of an elite cadre with an illustrious reputation and history. This puts a much greater emphasis on the team over the individual. That gets reinforced in the Corps by discipline. Marines know what is expected and that bucking those expectations will leave you on the sideline.
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1SG Charles Simpson
1SG Charles Simpson
8 y
Sgt Joseph Baker - When I joined the army in 1960, we had strict regimentation and strong discipline but today's army is completely different. I just pray we never have another all-out war where all our soldiers are put to task at the same time because I don't think we are morally strong enough to win it.
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