Posted on Mar 6, 2020
Could you still able to switch from OCS candidate back to enlisted after you already signed the contract?
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Hello everyone, I have a quick question. So I signed the contract with the ARNG last week as an officer candidate. My original plan was to enlist as a 12T Technical Engineer. Everything was going great until I arrived at MEPS when they told me that because they had to make a slot for me as a 12T, I won't be able to qualify for the student loan repayment program. I was in shock because my recruiter didn't mention this to me before I went to MEPS. They told me that I have to pick another MOS, but then they advised me to go for federal OCS since I already have a college degree. Since I didn't do any research about OCS and they didn't have any position open for my second and third MOS pick, and they were kind of rushing me, so I chose to proceed with the OCS option. I will be shipping out to BTC in September and OCS right after. That's six months from now. I asked if I could ship earlier, but they said I couldn't because OCS won't start until November.
After MEPS, I went home and did some research about OCS and found out that the OCS graduation rate is like 60%. If I fail OCS, then they will not pay for my student loan. I have a degree in Construction Management and have more than a year of experience in construction. I recently just quit my job (I hate my job) because I expected to be shipping out immediately. My recruiter told me that it's going to take 15 to 30 days after the contract is signed. Now I'm jobless and have to wait six months for basic training. Even if I pass OCS, I still have to attend BOLC. I found online that some people have to wait six to twelve months for a slot to attend BOLC. So basically, I have to wait six months to go to BTC and OCS. Then if I pass OCS, I might get sent home and wait another six months or more for BOLC. That's more than two years of my life, and I might lose all of my recent work experiences. I'm 28 years old, and I don't have more time to waste. So I'm thinking of switching from OCS candidate back to maybe another MOS or wait until another 12T slot opens up. I haven't spoken to my recruiter about this yet. I want to ask you guys first before coming to talk with my recruiter. Please give me some advice. Thank you very much
After MEPS, I went home and did some research about OCS and found out that the OCS graduation rate is like 60%. If I fail OCS, then they will not pay for my student loan. I have a degree in Construction Management and have more than a year of experience in construction. I recently just quit my job (I hate my job) because I expected to be shipping out immediately. My recruiter told me that it's going to take 15 to 30 days after the contract is signed. Now I'm jobless and have to wait six months for basic training. Even if I pass OCS, I still have to attend BOLC. I found online that some people have to wait six to twelve months for a slot to attend BOLC. So basically, I have to wait six months to go to BTC and OCS. Then if I pass OCS, I might get sent home and wait another six months or more for BOLC. That's more than two years of my life, and I might lose all of my recent work experiences. I'm 28 years old, and I don't have more time to waste. So I'm thinking of switching from OCS candidate back to maybe another MOS or wait until another 12T slot opens up. I haven't spoken to my recruiter about this yet. I want to ask you guys first before coming to talk with my recruiter. Please give me some advice. Thank you very much
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 10
Where did you read that the OCS graduation rate was 60%? It’s closer to 99%. If a class got anywhere near 60%, the Cadre would be fired. I can understand that you are apprehensive about OCS, but you also failed to do the proper amount of research. Just go to OCS. It’s not that hard. As long as you can pass a PT Test, Height and Weight, and you don’t do anything illegal, or immoral, you will be fine. If you screw up and fail a test multiple times or get kicked out by your peers, that is entirely on you. The tests aren’t overly difficult and you have to be either selfish or incompetent for your peers to rate you low enough to get booted.
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CPL (Join to see)
Sir, I signed for Federal OCS but still. I did a lot of research and the people that failed land nav and history are high. Plus even if i pass, it's going to eat at least 2 years of my life if i'm lucky and get a slot to go to BOLC right after OCS.
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MAJ (Join to see)
CPL (Join to see) A lot of people fail Land Nav, History, and the Military Intelligence test at OCS, but nobody in my class failed any of them twice. We only had 2 people get recycled; they both graduated later. One guy was recycled for cheating on a survey about 3 days before graduation. It wasn’t even part of the curriculum, but he looked at his neighbor’s survey and then lied about it to the Cadre that watched him do it. The other recycle was my roommate. He never failed anything, but he only passed tests by a point or two and his PT was marginal. He was recycled for “failure to progress.”
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1LT Rich Voss
MAJ (Join to see) - Major, maybe he heard stories from the "bad old days" of OCS during Cold War/Viet Nam era...in other words, when I went. 6 months at Fort Knox to become an Armor officer (at 19 with zero college). Our company lost at least a third of the original candidates. Whole host of reasons. Physical, psychological, mental, test taking ability (lack thereof), TAC officer/s finding a weak spot and working it until you broke, etc. Most of the guys that got booted or left of their own accord were guys with the most enlisted time and some rank, i.e. SP4s and duck SGTs. Anyway, I agree with all of you that have suggested he "stay the course" and go to OCS. Best thing I ever did in my life for myself, and my country !
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I'm a bit confused. Are you prior service or is this your initial enlistment? If you aren't prior service and they enlisted you at E-4, the Rank is Specialist in the Army since you aren't in a Chain of Command yet. But that't not t big deal.
What is your goal for going the service and the National Guard in particular? Was it your intention to become an Officer? Your time frame on BCT and OCS seems to about average. I finished OCS is July and didn't ship to IOBC, the version of BOLC at the time, until November. Realistically, a bit over a year from you start point at BTC, depending on the length of you Branch Course.
Success rate at Federal OCS varies, but averages about 90% (I looked it up), but it is also the most competitive to get a slot. That recruiter may have funding and a slot, but it you haven't been through the application and board process, you aren't there yet. The Success rate for the Guard Accelerated program is around 40% and the Traditional Guard somewhere in the middle. On the Guard side, most of those that don't succeed quit and submit a Letter of Resignation. If that was your goal, pursue it. If not, I would suggest doing a bit of enlisted time because you have a couple of years before you would even need a waiver
If your goal was to do some service time and get your education paid for, go that route first. Either wait for your MOS to open up or pick another one. I've found that recruiters can often pull slots out of thin air if they think they will lose a recruit. The recruiter has a mission that does not always mean that he wants to do what you want, but that changes if they know you won't go if you don't get what you want. I had a GT score of 133 and then volunteered Infantry, that is not the jobs the recruiter had lined up for me.
I enlisted Infantry and did almost 3 years enlisted before I went to OCS. I went through One Station Unit Training at 27, and I was not the oldest in my class. I commissioned at age 30. You have time if you want to take it.
The Military isn't College. Courses are designed to be passed, or they are if you know the basic rules. You get to that point, contact me and I will walk you through how to get better than passing scores. My GPA is college was not good, but I finished at the top of my OCS class Academically (tied) and in the top four of my Basic Course. It's learning the Army Way.
What is your goal for going the service and the National Guard in particular? Was it your intention to become an Officer? Your time frame on BCT and OCS seems to about average. I finished OCS is July and didn't ship to IOBC, the version of BOLC at the time, until November. Realistically, a bit over a year from you start point at BTC, depending on the length of you Branch Course.
Success rate at Federal OCS varies, but averages about 90% (I looked it up), but it is also the most competitive to get a slot. That recruiter may have funding and a slot, but it you haven't been through the application and board process, you aren't there yet. The Success rate for the Guard Accelerated program is around 40% and the Traditional Guard somewhere in the middle. On the Guard side, most of those that don't succeed quit and submit a Letter of Resignation. If that was your goal, pursue it. If not, I would suggest doing a bit of enlisted time because you have a couple of years before you would even need a waiver
If your goal was to do some service time and get your education paid for, go that route first. Either wait for your MOS to open up or pick another one. I've found that recruiters can often pull slots out of thin air if they think they will lose a recruit. The recruiter has a mission that does not always mean that he wants to do what you want, but that changes if they know you won't go if you don't get what you want. I had a GT score of 133 and then volunteered Infantry, that is not the jobs the recruiter had lined up for me.
I enlisted Infantry and did almost 3 years enlisted before I went to OCS. I went through One Station Unit Training at 27, and I was not the oldest in my class. I commissioned at age 30. You have time if you want to take it.
The Military isn't College. Courses are designed to be passed, or they are if you know the basic rules. You get to that point, contact me and I will walk you through how to get better than passing scores. My GPA is college was not good, but I finished at the top of my OCS class Academically (tied) and in the top four of my Basic Course. It's learning the Army Way.
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Which OCS? The Federal one at Benning is 12 weeks, recycle wasn't bad, I recall around 10-15%. If you can run 5 miles and Ruck 12 the physical part is handled. If you can't today you will be able after BCT. Learn to Land Nav solo, no buddy teams during OCS Land Nav, the big shake out is the history test, but you've crammed in college, you can, and will, pass that. Also, you're going in November, which isn't bad in GA. Gets cold down there in Jan/Feb but you should be done by then. Don't lie, don't cheat, lock your closet. You'll be fine.
If you opted for Accelerated, 8 weeks, it's a bit rougher, but doable. Either way, BCT will set you up for fitness and discipline, people that had hardest time were long time prior enlisted who didn't want to play the games.
Source: Been there, done that BCT+OCS at 33 years old starting OCS in JUNE.
You'll go to drill as a 2LT after OCS while you wait for BOLC. You will like BOLC. I promise.
Stay the course, it will be a good decision. Find something to do in the mean time, six months is nothing in the grand scheme.
If you opted for Accelerated, 8 weeks, it's a bit rougher, but doable. Either way, BCT will set you up for fitness and discipline, people that had hardest time were long time prior enlisted who didn't want to play the games.
Source: Been there, done that BCT+OCS at 33 years old starting OCS in JUNE.
You'll go to drill as a 2LT after OCS while you wait for BOLC. You will like BOLC. I promise.
Stay the course, it will be a good decision. Find something to do in the mean time, six months is nothing in the grand scheme.
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CPL (Join to see)
Sir, history is what i'm afraid of. I had 2 C for my 2 history classes in college. I know that i will go to drill but that is only one weekend a month. What happen if they make me wait 6 months for BOLC? I can't survive on one weekend a month drill pay even as a 2LT. I knew a guy from my recruiter that graduated OCS March 2019 and they still haven't assigned a date for his BOLC yet.
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CPT (Join to see)
CPL Pham,
You will have two weeks of classes and work in study groups. You get two attempts at the test. If you need to take it twice, there is a test review. I think 20-30 required a retest, I think 90% of those passed. Subject matter is an inch deep and a mile wide, but you work together and get it done. Don't fear it, understand it.
As for work, you're in the Guard either way, if you're enlisted or officer you still go to drill roughly one weekend a month. You will need a civilian job.
You are not required to tell the interviewer you are waiting to go to training but after you are hired keep them informed early so they can work around it. Enlisted or officer you will have to attend schools throughout your career. So on this I say "No factor".
You will have two weeks of classes and work in study groups. You get two attempts at the test. If you need to take it twice, there is a test review. I think 20-30 required a retest, I think 90% of those passed. Subject matter is an inch deep and a mile wide, but you work together and get it done. Don't fear it, understand it.
As for work, you're in the Guard either way, if you're enlisted or officer you still go to drill roughly one weekend a month. You will need a civilian job.
You are not required to tell the interviewer you are waiting to go to training but after you are hired keep them informed early so they can work around it. Enlisted or officer you will have to attend schools throughout your career. So on this I say "No factor".
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If you have the opportunity to become an officer, take it. It's not an easy path, but well worth it.
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Lots of great comments that I echo!
Go and push hard to be the honor graduate...
That being said...anything is possible with the right approval person!
Go and push hard to be the honor graduate...
That being said...anything is possible with the right approval person!
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Going to OCS right after BCT will permit you to be in the right mindset and level of fitness. Go for it.
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CPL (Join to see) to answer your question, I don't know. Honestly I never heard of it. That being said, let me shoot a question your way. What is it that you want out of your military career?
Nothing against the officer's corps, but this is kind of my view on the enlisted vs officer side. You're now or will be a SPC coming into it since you have a college degree, and therefore will become a NCO within a few years. Or you could go through OCS, BOLC, and all that jazz and come out a LT. Either way you're going to be a leader. I see officers and management and NCOs as supervisors, yet at the end of the day, both are still leaders. Like someone else said, it comes down to if you want to actually get your hands dirty and work or manage and lead projects. Either way is completely your choice. If you decide you want to be a worker bee (nothing wrong with that) you can on the enlisted side. Officer side tends to get political.
Nothing against the officer's corps, but this is kind of my view on the enlisted vs officer side. You're now or will be a SPC coming into it since you have a college degree, and therefore will become a NCO within a few years. Or you could go through OCS, BOLC, and all that jazz and come out a LT. Either way you're going to be a leader. I see officers and management and NCOs as supervisors, yet at the end of the day, both are still leaders. Like someone else said, it comes down to if you want to actually get your hands dirty and work or manage and lead projects. Either way is completely your choice. If you decide you want to be a worker bee (nothing wrong with that) you can on the enlisted side. Officer side tends to get political.
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If you want to lead, do OCS. If you want to be a soldier and do what you're told, don't do OCS. Neither is "better" than the other, it just depends on the level of ownership you want in your military career.
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