Posted on Oct 24, 2017
2LT Infantry Officer
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I deal with cadets a lot, and they insist they out "rank" every NCO in the army. My usual response is somewhere around the guides of "uh-huh." Can I get some clarity of this?
Posted in these groups: Thcapm08l9 ROTCEnlisted logo EnlistedGeneral of the army rank insignia Officer
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Responses: 1044
SSgt David M.
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While I was stationed in Ludwigsburg, Germany with the 34th Signal BN, 7th Corps, we were visited by a group of 3rd LTs from West Point. This was in 1975 or 1976. These 3rd LTs were in their Senior year at West Point and were required to visit a unit that would be of interest to them. We had a Company formation in front of A Company and were told in no short order that we were to treat these visiting 3rd LTs as 'Real Officers', Salute, and provide assistance as much as possible. I wish that I had taken note of their names as it would be interesting to see just how they did once they graduated and became REAL Officers! LOL There were a few that did understand that they were not really Officers and there were a few that acted like they were gods. You know which we helped more I am sure! We had a lot of Viet-Nam Veterans and they told us how some green LTs did not last long even when they were not at the front lines. We had a few sit down one on one discussions with a couple of the 3rd LTs. One of the questions that they asked was 'What is one thing that keeps you from doing your job as efficiently as it could be done?' We discussed many thoughts but most came down to all the wasted time buffing floors and excessive cleaning of everything. Needless to say when they did an out briefing nothing changed! Not that we really expected any changes to come about! LOL ;-) I Salute all My Fellow Veterans!
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SGT Jeremy Andrews
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I had wondered that myself when I first enlisted. So a Cadet receives the equivalent of E-5 pay while in service assigned to unit. Any LT outranks a Cadet but from my experience I’ve seen Platoon Sergeants and First Sergeants put them at Parade Rest.
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SSG Squad Leader
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Absolutely NOT!! A cadet is just that. Until they become a commissioned officer in the military they don't know s#!t from sugar. It's best to not even entertain the notion.
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SSG Marc Moore
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Really?! A cadet (ROTC) is paid at the E-5 level; a USMA Cadet at the E-6 level like his OCS counterparts so how do they outrank senior NCO’s? What regulation gives them authority over a senior NCO?
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SSG Douglas Shaffer
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I say "No" however they do, I don't understand how this works since they have not graduated from a military academy. Put it this way if a someone was going to go the "Green to Gold" (Enlisted to Officer) program and technically stepped away from the military to attend college full time, they carry the rank of Sergeant and are paid as such whether they were E-1 to E9. So why is this not applied to Cadets? However, they are treated as the rank of 2nd LT. Could someone tell me why? Is it because enlisted don't matter for they are not attending an academy? Is it that an enlisteds struggle to reach officers rank don't matter? How is it a cadet, with no actual military experience, has not graduated from an academy, is treated better than enlisted?
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MSgt Mark Donaldson
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I would say ‘no’, they are in the “boot” training status. I would not take any guff from someone in the status.
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LT Christopher Miller
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The rank of cadet and midshipmen actually goes back hundreds of years. Here is the answer, right from the Army:

AR 600-20, Section 2:

2-8. Death, disability, retirement, reassignment, or absence of the commander

a. Commander of Army element.

(1) If a commander of an Army element, other than a commander of a headquarters and headquarters element, dies, becomes disabled, retires, is reassigned, or is temporarily absent, the senior regularly assigned Army Soldier will assume command.

(2) If the commander of a headquarters and headquarters element dies, becomes disabled, retires, is reassigned, or is temporarily absent, the senior regularly assigned Army Soldier of the particular headquarters and headquarters element who performs duties within the element will assume command. For example, if a division headquarters and headquarters company commander is temporarily absent, the executive officer as the senior regularly assigned Army Soldier who performs duties within the headquarters company would assume command and not the division commander.

(3) Senior regularly assigned Army Soldier refers (in order of priority) to officers, WOs, cadets, NCOs, specialists, or privates present for duty unless they are ineligible under paragraphs 2-15 or 2-16. They assume command until relieved by proper authority except as provided in 2-8c. Assumption of command under these conditions is announced per paragraph 2-5. However, the announcement will indicate assumption as acting commander unless designated as permanent by the proper authority. It is not necessary to rescind the announcement designating an acting commander to assume duties of the commander “during the temporary absence of the regularly assigned commander” if the announcement gives the time element involved. A rescinding announcement is required if the temporary assumption of command is for an indefinite period.
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SSgt Security Forces
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Not until their take their oath after graduation and receive their commission.
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MAJ Public Affairs Officer
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Tell them, "Of course you do, it's written right here. If you have any guts, go to your nearest sergeant major and lock him/her up ... better yet, get on a plane to the Pentagon, barge into their office and demand the respect you deserve."

LT Obourn, you have a thankless job. You're "uh-huh" response will do you well.
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SSG Byron Hewett
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Edited >1 y ago
try this on for size LT but the best advice to give is assign that KID-DOT SPOT an NCO who has been around along time and who a really good good background knowledge and a Command of respect and can get things done and sets a good example for all. If you want that Cadet to become a potentially really good Officer pair them up to that really knowledgeable NCO that has been around and that can guide that Cadet to success as an Officer. Still the courtesy of yes Sir or Ma'am or No Sir or Ma'am does apply. please refer to the hyperlink from West Point USMA it should help to establish a good setting for that Cadet to learn from.

https://mwi.usma.edu/yes-sergeant-actually-west-point-cadet-outrank/
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TSgt Travis Wheeler
TSgt Travis Wheeler
3 y
Actually that's incorrect. Cadets are contracted at E-4 or below. That means they have a functional, non-active duty rank of E-4 or below. They don't outrank anyone unless given temporary positional authority over someone of the rank of E-4 or below.
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