Posted on Jun 11, 2016
LTC Stephen Conway
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1.The USN has retired the S-3 Viking made famous by President G.W. Bush on the supposed end of hostilities in Iraq back in May, 2003.

2. The S-3 Vikings at DM AFB are still flyable and have airframe time to spare.

3. Why wear the hell out of the F18 Super Hornet as a refueller when we have these planes sitting, just like the A-10 Warthog, ready for service?

4. Aviation experts: we need your feedback!
SGT Damaso V Santana COL M Stock Col (Join to see) PO1 John Miller CPT Pedro Meza] CSM Charles Hayden Passed 7/29/2025 TSgt Joe C. SMSgt Lawrence McCarter

CPO Tim Dickey] CPT Pedro Meza LTC (Join to see) [~802663:SSG Derrick L. Lewis, MBA, DSL, DL
Edited >1 y ago
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Responses: 12
MSG Military Police
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Because some Congressman has the factory for a replacement in his/her district or the new company is contributing greatly to the Congressman or his/her party
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LTC Stephen Conway
LTC Stephen Conway
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I hear the F-35 has subcomponents in all 50 states so it would be harder to say no.
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MSG Military Police
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I guess no one can complain if their all getting a cut of the action.
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TSgt Hh 60 G Maintainer
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Textbook example of "Pork Barrel Politics"
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COL Aviation Combined Arms Operations
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It's not a question of having airframes with "flight time" available on them in a field in mothballs. It was a great aircraft, but once the supply channel is shut off and the parts are divested from the inventory, the cost to re-implement is prohibitive. Trying to operate an S-3 now would be like trying to find parts to keep your Saab 900 Turbo going. Just not practical, nor cost effective. The reason airframes are retired is because the operational cost (time, energy, maintenance, money) to sustain them outweighs the operational benefit to the warfighter. Moving towards versatile, multi-role platforms saves the U.S. taxpayer BILLIONS while keeping the advancement of technology moving forward. I know this is an unpopular view to have with all the social media experts these days on the subject, but in my professional opinion, it's better for us as a nation to spend billions advancing technology and capabilities vs. spending billions to sustain antiquated equipment and stagnate the forward progress of R&D.
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LTC Stephen Conway
LTC Stephen Conway
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CPT Pedro Meza - in my ILE class I discovered it was G.W. Bush that did a presidential decree to approve the F-35 and bypassing the normal procurement process.
Here is a description of the the procurement from the Washington News Service.
https://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/weapons/RL30563.pdf
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LTC Stephen Conway
LTC Stephen Conway
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GySgt John Olson - At least you know there are some there at Davis Montham.
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COL Aviation Combined Arms Operations
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You can't buy anything with the $160 billion invested in the F-35 except for F-35s... It's gone. Killing the program now would only result in no product following a substantial investment.
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Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen
Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen
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My aircraft, F/FB-111 met the same fate. When you get to the point that replacement parts come from a little old lady in tennis shoes from Taiwan hand making the part in a garage it's just no longer practical to keep an aircraft operational. The capability of the aircraft just doesnt top the costs of maintaining it, especially in times of shrinking budgets.
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PO1 William "Chip" Nagel
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Works for me. S-3 is an excellent Aircraft.
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Do you agree we should save the Air Frames on the newer F-18 SuperHornets and use the still safe and useable S-3 Vikings instead?
LTC Stephen Conway
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Here are the S-3 Vikings awaiting orders and getting a tan in Arizona.
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PO1 William "Chip" Nagel
PO1 William "Chip" Nagel
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What a waste of an excellent aircraft. I used to pride myself on providing HF Support to these birds in the ES-3 Configuration.
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LTC Stephen F.
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The F/A 18 Super Hornet is a dual role combat aircraft not a refueller LTC Stephen Conway. I certainly am in favor of ensuring that all military aircraft which either can fly long distances or deploy OCONUS are equipped with the same refueling equipment and that the USA does not develop special refueling systems tied to specific aircraft. The only exception I would concur with would be for "spy" aircraft that fly at much higher than usual altitudes.
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MSgt Electrical Power Production
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SFC Senior Small Group Leader (Ssgl)
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Did I miss something? Are we using Hornets as refuelers?
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LTC Stephen Conway
LTC Stephen Conway
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SFC (Join to see) - Kind of like the Milk Cow U-boat in WW2. It was a fueler and it carried torpedoes for the other U-boats. I think its a waste when we have planes more capable now just getting a tan in Arizona.
http://uboat.net/types/milkcows.htm
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SGT Aaron Atwood
SGT Aaron Atwood
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I'm no aviation expert by trade, but I still like to think of myself as a bit of a nerd about it. Personally I'm still trying to wrap my head around the idea that the F-18 is looked at being used for the purpose as a refueling aircraft especially when its range couldn't compare to other military aircraft. I know on the USMC side of aviation our Hornets are way overdue to be scrapped based on flight hours alone yet somehow through Marine ingenuity we're keeping them going.
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LTC Stephen Conway
LTC Stephen Conway
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SGT Aaron Atwood - Same with Canada. Most are due to retire but they still have not been junked. Canada is buying a bunch of F-18 Superhornets instead of the F-35 Junk Strike Fighter as a stopgap. I think Australia is doing the same.
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Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen
Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen
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My initial thought as well. Sure can't pass much gas. Kind of seems counterproductive.
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Lt Col Nurse Anesthetist
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While it makes sense to utilize S-3s as dedicated tanker aircraft (and it has many advantages over the Super Hornet in this regard), the 18 is a multirole aircraft, which is the new flavor of the day... it can be reconfigured to strike, refuel, or to provide air interdiction. I also agree with the lack of parts availability, but if you only have limited space on a carrier, the Navy believes it makes more sense to have an airframe that can do as many things as possible.
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LTC Stephen Conway
LTC Stephen Conway
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You maybe correct if the milk cow F18 cans still have its minigun.
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SSgt Vendor Relations
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Limited repair/ Maintenance resources, they have to choose where to utilize assets.
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LTC Stephen Conway
LTC Stephen Conway
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Lately DM Air Force Base has been bring planes back into service due to limited funds and the black hole called the F-35 fiasco.
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MSgt Michael Lane
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It all comes down to money there is none! To get something new you have to get rid of something old, to keep something old you have to cancel something new. It really is getting bad equipment wise in the field. Not only do service members have to worry that they will get support when they need it they don’t know if the equipment they have will make it through the day.
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LTC Stephen Conway
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We can also offer the pilots and crewchiefs/mechanics(if we use the wrong navy term you know what I mean) from the Navy a 2-3 year contract to come back to active duty at their former rank and get them back on active duty. We can use the S-3 as a utility aircraft as part of the Carrier Air Wing and, like it or not, we do have a new Chinese, Russian and Iranian diesel electric sub threat. Most can be used as in-flight refueling and other utility tasks other ASW.
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