Posted on Apr 12, 2015
Does God exist? Or, is there a God?
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What are the best arguments for or against the existence of God?
I mean an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent, omnibenevolent Supreme Being -- the eternally and necessarily extant Creator of the universe.
Atheists, Theists, Agnostics, Polytheists, Pantheists and anyone else are all welcome to weigh in!
I'm not asking what you believe, I'm asking about the best arguments for or against the existence of God.
To clarify omnibenevolence, I mean simply 'perfect goodness,' not "the quality of being kind and generous towards everyone and everything." CH (CPT) (Join to see)
I mean an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent, omnibenevolent Supreme Being -- the eternally and necessarily extant Creator of the universe.
Atheists, Theists, Agnostics, Polytheists, Pantheists and anyone else are all welcome to weigh in!
I'm not asking what you believe, I'm asking about the best arguments for or against the existence of God.
To clarify omnibenevolence, I mean simply 'perfect goodness,' not "the quality of being kind and generous towards everyone and everything." CH (CPT) (Join to see)
God
Religion
Atheism
Edited 9 y ago
Posted 9 y ago
Responses: 332
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I can not make you believe in God, I can only tell you my Experiences and why I believe in God. and what being a Christian means to me. it is impossible for me or anyone else to change anyones mind all that can be done is to share experiences and let someone make up there own mind.
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Wow, very interesting commentary on this subject! Great Debate! So here is my thought since everyone had one.
It seems most of the debate for non-belief is from younger service me members. I can appreciate the new generation and their need to know everything and why. Guess what? You will never be able read research and understand everything in this life. Don't take this personally at all. When you have lived as long as me and been through all I have then we can sit down and talk about life.
You never ASSUME as I was taught at a very young age!
Before you get your drawers all tied in knots "I'm A CHRISTIAN" and very proud of that fact. I'm not perfect because I'm human and my GOD gave me a brain to make my own decisions and I must say along the way I made a few I regret but for the most part I did alright and still going strong. i've read the Bible and I believe what says. I can also refer back to it when I'm contemplating tough issues.
See I have been a non-believer even though I was raised as a church going Christian. I learned more about life and the world through my Christianity. The most interesting thing about my religion is that no mater what I do it brings me back to my center and guides me through a better life. I do believe there is a place for my soul once my physical body fails me.
NOW WAIT! Before everyone that doesn't agree with how I feel is fine with me. You don't have the right to criticize or persecute me for my beliefs unless I force you to believe or suffer the consequences
There will never be a time when all humans will agree with one Religion. The debate has been going on since the beginning of time and will not be solved by anyone on RP. MILLIONS HAVE DIED AND MILLIONS MORE WILL DIE WITHOUT ANY MORE EDUCATION, KNOWLEDGE OR OPPINIONS. I do know that MY GOD taught me right from wrong and my parents insured I followed the same path. This has allowed me to live in peace and harmony and know that there is something more when my body fails.
I'm not going to call anyone by any mane because it doesn't need to be said. I feel sorry for other humans who don't believe. Just my feelings, it has nothing to do with you, they are my feelings. It doesn't require you to say anything to me I'm only answering the original question that was asked.
I believe in God, I'm a Christian and the Bible explains everything I need to know. I'm not telling you to believe so. Why do you feel the need for me to prove anything. It's your job to decide whether you want to believe or not. It doesn't require a debate. That debate has killed millions and still is.
So, humans decide if you want believe in what Christians believe or not. It's your personal choice with you and what you want to believe. My religion works for me and I would be happy to explain my thoughts about what I believe one on one but I will not push my thoughts on you.
Non-Believers I hear all the time "Show Me The Proof", well I don't have to prove anything to you or anyone else it's what I believe. The only question non-believers need to ask is if they believe or not. If you don't it's alright with me however, you don't have the right to question or try to debate me on what I believe.
If you don't believe that's fine with me. That is your prerogative and is none of my concern.
When you decide to use this media to ask such an ignorant question only to create animosity. You have to admit, you knew before you even wrote the question on here that you would not find the answer. Additionally you were not able to give a difinative rebuttel to your theory.
Stupid Debate: if everyone was supposed to be the same and have the same oppinion we can look back in history and you can see how that worked out.
This poster hung on my office wall and I required every new person read if and understand it before I would hire them. For those who read this and think it's weak, I can assure you I don't allow substandard performance and I did my 20 and another 30 on top of that and like my Dad always. said. "Son, sometimes you have go back to the basics to see what happened". At my age my memory isn't as quick so I don't remember the author.
"EVERYTHINGI EVER LEARNED ABOUT LIFE I LEAENED IN KINDERGARTEN" . I learned how to treat other people with respect, even if they didn't feel the same way. I learned that you don't hurt other people. Sometimes it's alright to get your blankie and take a nap and lastly it's alright once in awhile to eat cookies and milk before your nap or bed but don't forget to share.
It seems most of the debate for non-belief is from younger service me members. I can appreciate the new generation and their need to know everything and why. Guess what? You will never be able read research and understand everything in this life. Don't take this personally at all. When you have lived as long as me and been through all I have then we can sit down and talk about life.
You never ASSUME as I was taught at a very young age!
Before you get your drawers all tied in knots "I'm A CHRISTIAN" and very proud of that fact. I'm not perfect because I'm human and my GOD gave me a brain to make my own decisions and I must say along the way I made a few I regret but for the most part I did alright and still going strong. i've read the Bible and I believe what says. I can also refer back to it when I'm contemplating tough issues.
See I have been a non-believer even though I was raised as a church going Christian. I learned more about life and the world through my Christianity. The most interesting thing about my religion is that no mater what I do it brings me back to my center and guides me through a better life. I do believe there is a place for my soul once my physical body fails me.
NOW WAIT! Before everyone that doesn't agree with how I feel is fine with me. You don't have the right to criticize or persecute me for my beliefs unless I force you to believe or suffer the consequences
There will never be a time when all humans will agree with one Religion. The debate has been going on since the beginning of time and will not be solved by anyone on RP. MILLIONS HAVE DIED AND MILLIONS MORE WILL DIE WITHOUT ANY MORE EDUCATION, KNOWLEDGE OR OPPINIONS. I do know that MY GOD taught me right from wrong and my parents insured I followed the same path. This has allowed me to live in peace and harmony and know that there is something more when my body fails.
I'm not going to call anyone by any mane because it doesn't need to be said. I feel sorry for other humans who don't believe. Just my feelings, it has nothing to do with you, they are my feelings. It doesn't require you to say anything to me I'm only answering the original question that was asked.
I believe in God, I'm a Christian and the Bible explains everything I need to know. I'm not telling you to believe so. Why do you feel the need for me to prove anything. It's your job to decide whether you want to believe or not. It doesn't require a debate. That debate has killed millions and still is.
So, humans decide if you want believe in what Christians believe or not. It's your personal choice with you and what you want to believe. My religion works for me and I would be happy to explain my thoughts about what I believe one on one but I will not push my thoughts on you.
Non-Believers I hear all the time "Show Me The Proof", well I don't have to prove anything to you or anyone else it's what I believe. The only question non-believers need to ask is if they believe or not. If you don't it's alright with me however, you don't have the right to question or try to debate me on what I believe.
If you don't believe that's fine with me. That is your prerogative and is none of my concern.
When you decide to use this media to ask such an ignorant question only to create animosity. You have to admit, you knew before you even wrote the question on here that you would not find the answer. Additionally you were not able to give a difinative rebuttel to your theory.
Stupid Debate: if everyone was supposed to be the same and have the same oppinion we can look back in history and you can see how that worked out.
This poster hung on my office wall and I required every new person read if and understand it before I would hire them. For those who read this and think it's weak, I can assure you I don't allow substandard performance and I did my 20 and another 30 on top of that and like my Dad always. said. "Son, sometimes you have go back to the basics to see what happened". At my age my memory isn't as quick so I don't remember the author.
"EVERYTHINGI EVER LEARNED ABOUT LIFE I LEAENED IN KINDERGARTEN" . I learned how to treat other people with respect, even if they didn't feel the same way. I learned that you don't hurt other people. Sometimes it's alright to get your blankie and take a nap and lastly it's alright once in awhile to eat cookies and milk before your nap or bed but don't forget to share.
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SPC Elijah J. Henry, MBA
SFC Walt Littleton, I have a similar saying, "Everything you need to know in life, you learn in Kindergarten." My wife disagrees.
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SFC Walt Littleton
Ya missed the point! Read it again and understand the meaning of getting back to the basics of life. Just because people don't believe in what another believes, it's not their place to criticize or show any proof. People are untitled to their opinions and that is an individual's right. In a topic as large as religion you have to go back to the basics and treat everyone fairly and understand not everyone thinks the same. This arugument will never be won so, you go back to the basics and thank them for their opinion. If you don't know how or why I believe I will be glad to tell you how I feel and then you can choose your own path. I have raised 8 children with 3 different mothers and my oldest is 40 and my youngest is 19. As I have grown and watched my children in different years and age groups there is a trend to be less tolerant of individuals who don't beleive or have the same opinions you do. Young people feel the need to bully and push their opinions on others. If you don't I will build an alliance against you. This makes for sad life to live.
Young people today have forgotten to listen and understand before they speak. I don't want you to feel I was singling you or anyone else out only to have everyone stop, think, understand and except that both can agree or disagree on this subject and the difinative answer is only with the individual. Some people are very closed minded and refuse to accept that others have different OPPINIONS. I hope that helps you understand the topic here. Lastly, people with closed minds and unable to accept what other feel and think will never change their minds until life keeps kicking them down and then they will be able to accept others opinions. Reach out anytime if you want to talk. Grey hair and wisdom I call. I think you young people say been there done that lol. Oh and I had so many wives because I had 2 that passed away due to illness and I raised and still mentor those children as my own.
Young people today have forgotten to listen and understand before they speak. I don't want you to feel I was singling you or anyone else out only to have everyone stop, think, understand and except that both can agree or disagree on this subject and the difinative answer is only with the individual. Some people are very closed minded and refuse to accept that others have different OPPINIONS. I hope that helps you understand the topic here. Lastly, people with closed minds and unable to accept what other feel and think will never change their minds until life keeps kicking them down and then they will be able to accept others opinions. Reach out anytime if you want to talk. Grey hair and wisdom I call. I think you young people say been there done that lol. Oh and I had so many wives because I had 2 that passed away due to illness and I raised and still mentor those children as my own.
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SPC (Join to see)
SFC Walt Littleton , I respect your opinion on the subject, but i have to disagree on a specific point you made. Everyone has every right to criticize and question any claim they come across. No how one may feel about texts or supernatural forces, no idea is above reproach. If an idea is worth propagating, than it should be questioned. The only alternatives are blind obedience or willful ignorance.
One should not express their opinion and especially not make a claim publicly if it cannot stand up to criticism. One also should not believe what another expresses without examination.
One can criticize and even ridicule an idea while still maintaining respect for the individual. Frankly, if i respect a person's opinion, then I owe it to them to examine their claims and opinions carefully.
One should not express their opinion and especially not make a claim publicly if it cannot stand up to criticism. One also should not believe what another expresses without examination.
One can criticize and even ridicule an idea while still maintaining respect for the individual. Frankly, if i respect a person's opinion, then I owe it to them to examine their claims and opinions carefully.
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SFC Walt Littleton
You are correct. Then again opinions are like well you know everyone has one. The original post asked our thoughts for or against and try to prove our point.
The proof lies the what you beleive and we can argue the point for a 10000 more years and never provide an absolute answer for either side of the equation.
As I stated in my original answer. It seems non-beleive tend to question or attack anyone who is a believer and try to have us prove our point.
Their lies the problem. God is a personal choice for an individual and the bible guided their beleif. Read the bible, choose which side of the fence you want to be on.
No one has the right to question my faith. It's mine and therefore I dong have to prove anything to anyone. Surly I don't have to defend it but I choose to if I'm attacked.
It's a good question to get everyone talking and starting desension with others.
If you want to know about what I beleive then ask a direct question and I will tell you what I know and feel. If you don't beleive it's your choice and I won't pass judgement on you or anyone. I just know it works for me.
The proof lies the what you beleive and we can argue the point for a 10000 more years and never provide an absolute answer for either side of the equation.
As I stated in my original answer. It seems non-beleive tend to question or attack anyone who is a believer and try to have us prove our point.
Their lies the problem. God is a personal choice for an individual and the bible guided their beleif. Read the bible, choose which side of the fence you want to be on.
No one has the right to question my faith. It's mine and therefore I dong have to prove anything to anyone. Surly I don't have to defend it but I choose to if I'm attacked.
It's a good question to get everyone talking and starting desension with others.
If you want to know about what I beleive then ask a direct question and I will tell you what I know and feel. If you don't beleive it's your choice and I won't pass judgement on you or anyone. I just know it works for me.
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Yes! When I look in depth at creation it shows that it didn't just happen by accident.
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A bit of humor that fits in to the Creator aspect I wrote on earlier.
The World's finest Scientists called a meeting with God.
The Scientists proceeded to lecture the Creator on how he is irrelevant. That they, as Scientists could combine the correct ingredients and create life in a test-tube.
The Creator said, "Show me".
So, the scientist says, first we go to a swamp and take this mucky dirt......
The Creator interrupts and says......"Hold on there a minute"........... "Get your OWN dirt!"
The World's finest Scientists called a meeting with God.
The Scientists proceeded to lecture the Creator on how he is irrelevant. That they, as Scientists could combine the correct ingredients and create life in a test-tube.
The Creator said, "Show me".
So, the scientist says, first we go to a swamp and take this mucky dirt......
The Creator interrupts and says......"Hold on there a minute"........... "Get your OWN dirt!"
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Well, i posted a few times in reply, so I suppose i should actually respond to OP:
I don't believe there are any gods. I don't know there aren't any. I can't argue for the non-existence of something that is not only poorly defined, but whose attributes are like-wise nebulous.
I will say most arguments for the "necessarily extant Creator of the universe" are so illogical and impractical that they are easily extinguished by anyone who applies a little bit of logic and empiricism. Having heard no argument and seen no evidence of creators (or gods) that i find credible, let alone convincing, i necessarily don't believe they exist for the exact same reason i don't believe there's a sewing machine in orbit around alpha centauri.
I don't believe there are any gods. I don't know there aren't any. I can't argue for the non-existence of something that is not only poorly defined, but whose attributes are like-wise nebulous.
I will say most arguments for the "necessarily extant Creator of the universe" are so illogical and impractical that they are easily extinguished by anyone who applies a little bit of logic and empiricism. Having heard no argument and seen no evidence of creators (or gods) that i find credible, let alone convincing, i necessarily don't believe they exist for the exact same reason i don't believe there's a sewing machine in orbit around alpha centauri.
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COL Ted Mc
SPC Nathan Freeman - Spec; Don't hold out any hope for "Einstein's Theory of Relativity". After all, since it isn't mentioned in The Bible it is only a "theory". The fact that it has practical applications no more means that it is "true" than does the fact that NASA used the (Biblically sound) "Earth Centred" model of the universe to plot orbits and trajectories.
Face it, we have no idea of whether "God" created the universe with a myriad of false trails simply as a test of faith or not. For all we can "prove" (given an omnipotent and yet inscrutable "God") the entire mess was created a week ago last Wednesday and that all the "so-called 'evidence'" to the contrary was created at the same time.
You either BELIEVE without the need for "proof" or you do not BELIEVE at all.
If you DO BELIEVE then any and all "facts" are irrelevant and if you DO NOT BELIEVE then any and all "facts" are irrelevant.
Jesus DID NOT say "If I have convinced you with irrefutable concrete evidence then you will be saved.".
About the best that one can hope for is not to arrive as "The Pearly Gates" and find oneself greeted by an 8' 9", ten armed, green, being who says in flawless Arabic "Allah Akbar.". And what do you mean by coming here?".
[PS - It could happen.]
Face it, we have no idea of whether "God" created the universe with a myriad of false trails simply as a test of faith or not. For all we can "prove" (given an omnipotent and yet inscrutable "God") the entire mess was created a week ago last Wednesday and that all the "so-called 'evidence'" to the contrary was created at the same time.
You either BELIEVE without the need for "proof" or you do not BELIEVE at all.
If you DO BELIEVE then any and all "facts" are irrelevant and if you DO NOT BELIEVE then any and all "facts" are irrelevant.
Jesus DID NOT say "If I have convinced you with irrefutable concrete evidence then you will be saved.".
About the best that one can hope for is not to arrive as "The Pearly Gates" and find oneself greeted by an 8' 9", ten armed, green, being who says in flawless Arabic "Allah Akbar.". And what do you mean by coming here?".
[PS - It could happen.]
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SPC (Join to see)
PO3 Dale S. That's called a straw-man fallacy.
"...that I find credible..." From this alone the implication is that I have considered the evidence, or at least its source, and evaluated it. You indicate this is not what I do. Can you provide an example of this?
COL Ted Mc That's a lot like saying "you can't prove something un-provable doesn't exist". You do sincerely hold true to faith, I'll give you that, sir.
"...that I find credible..." From this alone the implication is that I have considered the evidence, or at least its source, and evaluated it. You indicate this is not what I do. Can you provide an example of this?
COL Ted Mc That's a lot like saying "you can't prove something un-provable doesn't exist". You do sincerely hold true to faith, I'll give you that, sir.
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COL Ted Mc
SPC (Join to see) - Spec; Indeed it is "a lot like". On the other hand, it is even more like saying "You can't prove something unprovable doesn't exits and you also can't prove that it does. You can, however, BELIEVE any damn fool thing you want to believe even if it flies in the face of those things you CAN prove/disprove.".
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CW3 (Join to see)
and none of that makes anything true. It just makes for very difficult conversations with people who do not allow for contrary evidence to their claims.
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Truly this is a question for the ages, in my heart I know the answer. The question could be considered rhetorical due to the variables between beliefs and existence. Just because you have not seen, experienced or validated something does not define it's existence.
Look at it this way, if you are adamant that something means the world to you does it need to exist?
For me I believe Jesus Christ is my Lord and Savior, for those that don't to include my own child. I pray for their spirituality, that they keep light in their heart and not darkness.
Look at it this way, if you are adamant that something means the world to you does it need to exist?
For me I believe Jesus Christ is my Lord and Savior, for those that don't to include my own child. I pray for their spirituality, that they keep light in their heart and not darkness.
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I hope someday you have a chance to see your child born. You will be convinced there is a God.
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PO1 (Join to see)
Coming to a knowledge of God is an individual journey. I know, I know, that statement in itself seems illogical and scientifically backward, but think about it.
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Sgt (Join to see)
basic biological functions, cell division and genetic coding create children... not god. god doesn't zap a baby into your wifes uterus, no you have to inseminate her with your genetic material then chemicals and hormones take over cause all sorts of nifty changes that ultimately develop into a fetus and so on. if god were real, and controlling every thing, why do people go to the hospital to give birth? to get healed? shouldn't we just let god sort it out for us?
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IF and this is a big IF, If this was a trolling attempt...good on you! Religon is always a firey topic. But to answer your question does God exist? or Is there a God. In all honesty thats noone's buisness but my own.
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SPC Elijah J. Henry, MBA
I assure you, I was not trolling. I posed the question to engage RP in a discussion of the most worthy topic I can think of.
If God exists, that matters more than anything else. If not, that's worth knowing, too.
If God exists, that matters more than anything else. If not, that's worth knowing, too.
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SPC (Join to see)
I'm pretty sure a god's existence is pretty much irrelevant to life on earth. It's certainly irrelevant to my life. now, when people start doing things in the name of their creator, that's when we start to have problems.
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Suspended Profile
SPC Elijah J. Henry, MBA On what grounds does the existence of a supreme being matter? The only way I can see it mattering, is if that claim carries the presumption then such a being also cares about humans and their actions, and can affect them. Given that one can't know that a supreme being doesn't exist, I don't see any worth there. MAJ Carl Ballinger Sir, I don't believe, yet I don't feel my life is mediocre! I enjoy it and I think I've been lucky to be a part of some great things in my short time.
Suspended Profile
Even when I believed in god I didn't think my life was mediocre. But there's no point arguing about this I guess, because no matter what we believe or don't believe, all our definitions of what would constitute more than or less than mediocre/good/sat/unsat are mostly arbitrary in my opinion anyway.
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