Posted on Jan 13, 2017
SGT Quality Control Technical Inspector
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Trying to set myself up for the maximum amount of success.
Posted in these groups: Officers logo OfficersP240 RangerUs o7 insignia.svg BG70px us o6 insignia.svg COL
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GySgt Bill Smith
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Setting the bar a little low aren't you? Lol, I had a roommate that would wake up and say good morning SgtMaj to himself in the mirror. He is an E-7 with a career to be very proud of.
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LTC Psychological Operations Officer
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Edited >1 y ago
No. And if you are looking at professionally developing schools in terms of how they make you look instead of how they will help you become a better leader, you are destined to fail anyway.
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SGT Quality Control Technical Inspector
SGT (Join to see)
>1 y
Sir you couldn't be more right. I could have the best leadership skills by that point in my life. But still get looked over by someone else who could have the same ORB as me. But have ranger school and he get selected.
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LTC Psychological Operations Officer
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SGT (Join to see) - what I'm saying is no, it just doesn't work that way. The wickets you go through to get to that stage (like excelling at battalion and brigade command) are so demanding and so selective that no tab on your orb is going to mean a thing. It is your performance in the highest responsibility jobs that matter. It's not like you get promotion points as an officer for a ranger tab.

All your energy and effort should be focused on being the best platoon leader you can be. That's what your soldiers deserve. There are so many variables that will determine how far down the road you will end up that it is not worth a second of thought.

The real question you should be asking yourself is will Ranger School help you to be a better platoon leader, and IMO the answer is a resounding yes. So get your 2LT ass to Ranger School because it will make you a better 2LT. It won't make you a general.
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MSG Intermediate Care Technician
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Serious Long Term Goal there.
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SGT Quality Control Technical Inspector
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Oh no doubt, I set the bar high for myself. I'm in for the long haul. And I want a goal that is out of the way, but yet a small percentage to achieve it.
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MSG Intermediate Care Technician
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>1 y
SGT (Join to see) - I'm sure the Ranger Tab will be nice to have throughout your career, but it certainly won't set you apart as by the time you get to that stage, there will be others you will compete against that will probably have the Tab, too. Instead, focus on assignments and education. Start researching (if you haven't done so already), all current and past GO's and see what kinds of assignments and education they have in common. In regards to assignments, as an example, every Colonel that I ever saw command both the 11th ACR and Landstuhl Regional Medical Center....everyone of them received a Star on their shoulder somewhere down the road.
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Does having a Ranger tab make a difference when being looked at for promotion from O-6 to O-7?
1SG Vet Technician
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You have that General Star attached to the velcro under your collar for the eventual day? One step at a time.

Go back and re-read what CAPT Kevin B. posted. He has "been there and done that"
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SPC Erich Guenther
SPC Erich Guenther
>1 y
Ahhh the Velcro Rrrrrriiiiiipppp, every Vietnam Veterans nightmare....lol
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CAPT Kevin B.
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Actual experience time. I'm a Mustang which means i went from E-1 to O-6. I sat O-5/6 boards and recorded a Flag board. What you're asking is if one pedigree thing of limited availability makes a difference at that level. Doubtful as the discussion morphs between O-6/7 boards to something different. The tab is one thing. What it made you later is another. When going up for O-6, sure they look at the past and pedigree stuff, but the discussion is focused on likelihood of performing well at O-6. You vote for "Level of Confidence". The same level of crowd also leans in later on what billets you get. I'd characterize O-6 billets as above/below the line. In other words, the serious Flag candidates will be cycled through the "above" set of billets. At the O-7 board, I noted how much more focused it was because they're only picking a very small number, have an idea of what jobs they'd slot them into, etc. How well will that candidate look and feel on The Hill? Temperament. And things not necessarily directly found in the precepts, but good luck seeking flag if you're on your third divorce. They're looking for people they can work with and will fit into the "club". So what you're asking is really determined as much post O-6 board as O-7 board in my experience. As for me, making Flag wasn't on my to-do list. Having challenged a couple Flags on mission without force protection, I presumed I'd not be a perfect fit in the club. It was time for me to leave and pass the baton to the next generation. Never looked back.

Trivia time. Most passionate (read screaming) boards? All three times I was back in Millington, it was the Chaplains hands down. Soundproofing around the "Tanks" only works so well. Loved the Holy Rollers.
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LCDR Chaplain
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CAPT Kevin Ball, PE - Sir, do you mind if I ask what level the Chaplains boards got interestimg at? Was that the flag boards? O5?
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CAPT Kevin B.
CAPT Kevin B.
>1 y
The Chaplain boards would have been at the same grade I was working on in another tank. So that'd be O-4 and O-5 on two separate occasions. Flag is O-7 and above.
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LTC Joseph Gross
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Everything makes a difference but having a Ranger Tab would not overcome screwing up anything between now and then.
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MAJ Mark N.
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Having the tab (along with ABN/AA), and retired as a Major, I feel qualified to say, "not really". As others have said, it is more of what you do (leadership) vs what you have hanging from your uniform. What they do not say is promotion boards can be as objective as subjective. I had several "top block" OER's (old system) and great assignments, but one person on the 0-5 board had a personal vendetta against me, so I was shown the door at 21 years - with my tab and patches in tow.
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1SG Darren James
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It's more on how you performed your jobs and what jobs you've held when it comes time for going up for a Star. However, those earlier assignments or the makeup of your career path in general can go a completely different path after you graduate. If you are even thinking about pursuing that long term goal and are up for the task in the short term, I'd say go get your Tab and see your career path after that.
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SGT (Join to see) I like your style and last name. SGM or COL Sword has a nice ring to it!
It would mean more if you served in the Regiment.
BG Mike Rowe
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No
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CPT Robert Hampton
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Edited 7 y ago
During the 1970s, the Army did a lot of research into leadership during the Viet Nam war.

For example, we determined that the “every man for himself” practice of sending soldiers individually with individual DEROS / ETS dates had not built cohesive units.

We further identified “crisis in command” issues in which leaders circled the battlefields in helicopters, out of range of small arms fire, to “direct” the battle did not build soldier trust in leadership.

So, your question about Ranger tabs:

We determined what armies have known for millennia, that leaders must share the risks with their soldiers. Leaders must go with the soldiers and face the enemy while taking care of their soldiers.

Soldiers must trust each other. So today we see great unit training in which soldiers practice and deploy together as units. No more “every man for himself.”

If your goal is to be a leader, a soldier, NCO, or officer who is a trusted member of a combat team, then any advanced leadership training is useful.

Just keep in mind that such training comes with great responsibility to protect your soldiers while defeating the bad guys. One generally advances in rank NOT because of the schools he has attended BUT because of his proven leadership.
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2LT Brian L.
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of course
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Cadet PVT (Pre-Commission)
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You've finished your commissioning program yet?
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SSG Waldo Yamada
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Getting a Ranger tab means you are a proven leader. It is a leadership school and that's why the scrolled one's go there because they are proven leaders. It would be an honor to have the Ranger tab, but if you don't go to a Ranger Battalion; more or less you'll be basically a n over glorified technical escort for a top ranked official. I think.

My advice, set up a short-term and long-term goal. Make an I love me book, and find a mentor who can mold you.
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SPC Erich Guenther
SPC Erich Guenther
>1 y
Due to numbers it is a lot easier to get into a Ranger Bn as enlisted than it is as an Officer. Myself as former enlisted regular Infantry guy....... Ranger TAB is a Ranger TAB and I could care less if they served with a Ranger Bn, accomplishment regardless. Honestly the TAB's value also ebbs and flows by rank and branch. If your Infantry Enlisted and have been from E1 to E7 you have your Ranger Tab via experience and at that point I would say the school is useless. If your Infantry Officer about O-4 really does not matter . However, Infantry O-3's without the TAB will tell you about having to constantly have to prove themselves without it.
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SSG Waldo Yamada
SSG Waldo Yamada
>1 y
SPC Erich Guenther - Sorry, I'm a POG and you are right. RASP is a different animal. However, being Ranger scrolled you do go through RASP again every promotion, if I'm not right. I dunno, I only work in the office and supported them on my later deployment.
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SPC Erich Guenther
SPC Erich Guenther
>1 y
SSG Waldo Yamada - Last I heard it goes like this: RASP ==> Assignmentr to Ranger BN ====> When they think you are ready RANGER school and Tab. Non-Ranger Bn, it goes RASP===>RANGER school, then awarding of Ranger Tab. The whole Ranger Bn assignment litmus test is roughly equal to the 82nd Airborne claim that Airborne School does not make you a paratrooper in that you need an assignment to the 82nd. What is behind this is Airborne units have higher standards than other non-Airborne regular Army units. Likewise Ranger Bn are part of SOCOM and have different standards than Airborne or other regular Army units. So to explain it better, in a Regular Army unit that is just Infantry or even support there is a lot of Army bullshit, in an Airborne unit there is comparitively less bullshit because the standards for squad leader, NCO, and Officer are a little higher. In a Ranger unit further levels of bullshit are stripped away because with their rapid deployment mission they need to have a narrow training focus, with Special Forces units some of the last layers of bullshit are stripped away. Now with the stripping away of each layer of BS as you progress towards elite SF unit. The individual responsibility and accountability increases and so do the penalties for screwing up. So for a basic regular Army unit, you screw up and basically your NCO gets blamed. Special Forces unit, same screw up.....a lot of the blame shifts to you from the NCO. Thats how the Army has it structured.
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SSG Waldo Yamada
SSG Waldo Yamada
>1 y
I agree on that notion.SPC Erich Guenther -
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Maj John Bell
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All things being the same yes. But all things are never the same with box checkers. People get their number.
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