Fact or Fiction? A Diagnostic APFT can be used as Record APFT.

<p>CSM,</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>AR 350-1 states</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>"(2) Commanders may administer the APFT as often as they wish; however, they must specify beforehand when the results are for record." </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Seems pretty cut and dry. I did have a Soldier pose this same question to me once as the training NCO. My thought is if we change your diagnostic to a record because you did well could we also tell you it is a diagnostic and change it to a record if you do poorly. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Has to be the same standard across the board.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

CSM,

Fiction. As stated above by SSG Schmidt, and by extension the excerpt he cut and pasted from AR 350-1, the unit commander must specify beforehand whether the APFT will be for record or Diagnostic. the only exception is in the case of an APFT used for NCOES, in which case the APFT  can only be administered as a diagnostic APFT and is prohibited from being administered as a for record APFT.

The key words in the excerpt from AR 350-1 is "must" and "beforehand". "must", to me, indicates a strict requirement, not an optional requirement. "beforehand" furthermore gives us a timebase for that requirement. failure to specify beforehand, whether the APFT is diagnostic or for record, would constitute a clear violation of both the letter of the law, its intent, and could be cause to invalidate that APFT.

The question does not add up. If the Soldier is not due one then why would they need to use the score. If you are implying that sometime after the diagnostic that the failed and the unit fell back on that diagnostic to give the Soldier credit, then the answer is no. It would also be unethical, and likely punishable. Thank you for your service.

I know this is an old post, but when in doubt, ask the regulation.
AR 350-1 (2) Commanders may administer the APFT as often as they wish; however, they must specify beforehand when the results are for record.
While the term "diagnostic" is used often, it is not referred to in the AR350-1 or FM 7-22. If the commander does not indicate the upcoming APFT will a record APFT, then it is a
" not for record " APFT. The National Guard does not have to give 4 months notice before an APFT. We are all required to meet the Army standard and pass an APFT at any given time.

no

It got to the point where enough Os & Es were failing APFTs at MOSQ schools that it became command policy to take a "diagnostic" APFT with 30 days of our report date. We would then take the school APFT and would have to take a "for record" annual on the scheduled drill weekend. Needless to say our APFT average went up.

I was told this was possible years ago. I had a good Soldier that took a diag and the following month injured himself which kicked him out of a school. I petitioned to use his diag for record and was told it was commander's discretion. Is there a reg?

By regulation, absolutely not. By experience? Sure does.

Personally I don’t like picking which regs to follow and which ones not to follow, but I will say I’ve never seen this done to the detriment of the soldier...

Ar350-1. You must declare record or diagnostic at the start of the test. You must also comply with the frequency and spacing of record tests

I believe any administered APFT needs to be clear to the grader and soldier taking it, whether its record or diagnostic. Once that has been documented on the 705 as one or the other, it cannot be changed.