Posted on Oct 30, 2015
Fraud, Waste, Abuse? Unit to spend more money on TDY to not pay soldier Per Diem.
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I have a SPC that is going to BLC. The army unit that is in charge of his administration does not want to send him to a base within 3 hours of driving because they do not have a dinning facility and he would have to receive additional per diem. In stead they want to send him halfway across the county which now involves flights that cost way more than the additional per diem required at the other base. Would you consider this under Fraud , Waste, or Abuse?
Posted 10 y ago
Responses: 13
Sounds like regulations with unintended consequences coupled with a fear of challenging standing orders with the responsible command. Surely, whoever wrote that regulation would grant exceptions if the facts were brought to his/her attention.
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Can he not submit an constructive travel worksheet to show which option is advantageous to the government and traveler? (is he doing this in DTS or are orders being made for him?)
That's what I do on most of my TDY's because I prefer to drive if it can be done in a day. Most of the time it is cheaper to just compare driving mileage costs vs. the airfare to show that it's better for the government.
You have to take ALL costs into account however to show which one is better.
Option 1 - within 3 hours of driving
- Include the daily per diem costs
- Include the daily lodging costs
- Include the Mileage costs for driving his POV (I'm assuming that would be the travel method within 300 miles)
Option 2 - fly to another location
- Include cost of flights (including taxes, baggage & booking fees)
- Include the daily lodging costs
- Include rental car and rental car expenses (gas, taxes) if he would be authorized a rental car
- if not authorized a rental car, include expenses incurred to travel from airport to the place of duty (taxi, shuttle, public transit, etc.)
If you want option 1, you must show ALL costs that are not identical for each trip. Then, you must show costs for option 2 that at least show that it is more expensive. It's better to show everything, but like I said above many of mine will just show the cost of the airfare if that is higher than all other costs on option 1.
That's what I do on most of my TDY's because I prefer to drive if it can be done in a day. Most of the time it is cheaper to just compare driving mileage costs vs. the airfare to show that it's better for the government.
You have to take ALL costs into account however to show which one is better.
Option 1 - within 3 hours of driving
- Include the daily per diem costs
- Include the daily lodging costs
- Include the Mileage costs for driving his POV (I'm assuming that would be the travel method within 300 miles)
Option 2 - fly to another location
- Include cost of flights (including taxes, baggage & booking fees)
- Include the daily lodging costs
- Include rental car and rental car expenses (gas, taxes) if he would be authorized a rental car
- if not authorized a rental car, include expenses incurred to travel from airport to the place of duty (taxi, shuttle, public transit, etc.)
If you want option 1, you must show ALL costs that are not identical for each trip. Then, you must show costs for option 2 that at least show that it is more expensive. It's better to show everything, but like I said above many of mine will just show the cost of the airfare if that is higher than all other costs on option 1.
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CWO3 (Join to see)
The Brigade is making the decisions currently. Option 1 is around 1200.00 cheaper.
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COL Vincent Stoneking
Key words: "Limited to constructed costs of a common carrier."
I will drive almost EVERY time that I can make it work with my other commitments, even when that requires taking leave/vacation.
I just got back from a 4 day TDY to DC. I flew for that, because I couldn't justify 1.5-2 weeks of driving added to a 4 day TDY. This summer, I will go to PA for 2 weeks of TDY. I will be taking a week+ of leave on either side in order to drive (and also drop my wife off at her family's for the 2 weeks of the TDY).
I will pay most of the costs out of pocket. "Constructed costs" means that they will reimburse you what it would have cost to go by the cheapest means - usually air. That generally means a two-way coach ticket, with 1 travel day of per diem each way. Works for me.
I will drive almost EVERY time that I can make it work with my other commitments, even when that requires taking leave/vacation.
I just got back from a 4 day TDY to DC. I flew for that, because I couldn't justify 1.5-2 weeks of driving added to a 4 day TDY. This summer, I will go to PA for 2 weeks of TDY. I will be taking a week+ of leave on either side in order to drive (and also drop my wife off at her family's for the 2 weeks of the TDY).
I will pay most of the costs out of pocket. "Constructed costs" means that they will reimburse you what it would have cost to go by the cheapest means - usually air. That generally means a two-way coach ticket, with 1 travel day of per diem each way. Works for me.
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This is what we refer to a "colors of money" issue.
It's counter-intuitive because we think it all spends the same. It doesn't, because there are rules regarding how it is allocated and spent.
Using your example, they may have a surplus of Travel money, but no per diem money. Likewise many units won't send people places because they don't have adequate travel budgets. We're just seeing the reverse of this.
It's counter-intuitive because we think it all spends the same. It doesn't, because there are rules regarding how it is allocated and spent.
Using your example, they may have a surplus of Travel money, but no per diem money. Likewise many units won't send people places because they don't have adequate travel budgets. We're just seeing the reverse of this.
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Maj Matt Hylton
Unless other services operate differently from the Air Force and I'm not aware of service specific rules, there is no difference in the color of money when it comes to travel and per diem. Per diem is a part of the travel allocation. It's all 3400 funds.
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Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS
Maj Matt Hylton - It may be who (echelon) pays for it more than anything. It's been over a decade since I ran into it, but per diem was "local" for me, but travel was Command Level. It didn't affect my situation much as we were 1 removed, but for someone at a BN/Squadron level, that could make a huge difference for training money.
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It may sound like fraud, waste and abuse depending on where the funds are coming from and how they determined which is advantageous to the unit.
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I would recommend following MAJ Matt Hylton's guidance and do do the cost analysis to submit to the unit command to make the call.
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Everyone has already covered the funding sources, and variety of policies and regulations so I will leave that alone. I thought it was a live in course and all students are placed on a meal card? That would mean eating in the DFAC for the majority if not all of your meals.
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