Posted on Dec 20, 2018
How do you feel about the decision to pull American troops out of Syria?
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Posted 7 y ago
Responses: 43
2500 men surrounded by hundred of thousands of muslims it's not my idea of a good ratio. I know tha SF's are force multiplayers, and the Kurds deserve better support from us, but I want our boys back home from that mess.
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Syria is a civil war, with multiple conflicting alliances. We have Syria, Iran and Russia in one alliance, rebels, ISIS and the US in another alliance, then Turkey versus the Kurds (Christians) and Syria. Not all of these are aligned, especially if the US has to arm current/former members of ISIS, who are fighting with the rebels. More importantly, this is a fight between Sunni and Shiite factions of Islam, who have been in conflict for several thousand years.
Although a case can be made that the US should seek to deter a Sunni or Shiite majority control of the region, we aren't even protecting our own borders against invasion. The priority of effort, politically, economically and militarily should be the defense of our homeland against invasion. The forces returning from Syria could be deployed along the border as the primary force, not supporting force to ICE/DHS, as the military has done since 1910.
Finally, one party has stated that using the military to secure the border is a violation of the Posse Comitatus Act. This act was written after the Civil War and precluded the use of military forces to conduct domestic policies (police duties against US citizens). However, immigration is not a domestic policy but an enforcement of immigration laws. The military has the authority to stop the invasion being perpetrated by non-citizens and is therefore not a violation of the Act. If the Pose Comitatus Act applied, then the Punitive Expeditions of 1916 would not have been authorized. Congress did not declare war and US forces policed the US border on both sides.
Although a case can be made that the US should seek to deter a Sunni or Shiite majority control of the region, we aren't even protecting our own borders against invasion. The priority of effort, politically, economically and militarily should be the defense of our homeland against invasion. The forces returning from Syria could be deployed along the border as the primary force, not supporting force to ICE/DHS, as the military has done since 1910.
Finally, one party has stated that using the military to secure the border is a violation of the Posse Comitatus Act. This act was written after the Civil War and precluded the use of military forces to conduct domestic policies (police duties against US citizens). However, immigration is not a domestic policy but an enforcement of immigration laws. The military has the authority to stop the invasion being perpetrated by non-citizens and is therefore not a violation of the Act. If the Pose Comitatus Act applied, then the Punitive Expeditions of 1916 would not have been authorized. Congress did not declare war and US forces policed the US border on both sides.
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COL (Join to see)
SSG Greg Miech - 'Although the act does not explicitly mention the United States Navy and the United States Marine Corps, the Department of the Navy has prescribed regulations that are generally construed to give the act force with respect to those services as well. The act does not apply to the Army National Guard or the Air National Guard under state authority from acting in a law enforcement capacity within its home state or in an adjacent state if invited by that state's governor. The United States Coast Guard, which operates under the Department of Homeland Security, is not covered by the Posse Comitatus Act either, primarily because although the Coast Guard is an armed service, it also has both a maritime law enforcement mission and a federal regulatory agency mission. '
MacArthur did violate the Act but under specific orders from the President.
As to your point of 'fixing the problems in the country, you used the example of neighborhood militias by Iraqis. This is the perfect solution because it requires the country's citizens to solve their own problems, not US intervention. When we intervened in the late 1800s and early 1900s, we created 'Banana Republics.' We used our military and economic influence for Dole and other companies to gain access to resources, creating corrupt governments that lasted nearly 60 years. When the people revolted, the military took over or corrupt politicians took control. Now, it is time for the citizens to revolt again, instead of fleeing to America.
At the same time, the US needs to protect itself from inheriting all of the problems from every country with problems (health, economic, social, political, etc.). We cannot and should not be expected to solve everyone's problems. As such, we send those entering or remaining in our country illegally, back home to fix their problems.
MacArthur did violate the Act but under specific orders from the President.
As to your point of 'fixing the problems in the country, you used the example of neighborhood militias by Iraqis. This is the perfect solution because it requires the country's citizens to solve their own problems, not US intervention. When we intervened in the late 1800s and early 1900s, we created 'Banana Republics.' We used our military and economic influence for Dole and other companies to gain access to resources, creating corrupt governments that lasted nearly 60 years. When the people revolted, the military took over or corrupt politicians took control. Now, it is time for the citizens to revolt again, instead of fleeing to America.
At the same time, the US needs to protect itself from inheriting all of the problems from every country with problems (health, economic, social, political, etc.). We cannot and should not be expected to solve everyone's problems. As such, we send those entering or remaining in our country illegally, back home to fix their problems.
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SSG Greg Miech
I agree with most of it. I think there should be reputable work programs that help the farmers with the labor issue at the same time having the workers go home after the season while not giving jobs that Americans can have.
Just like the US was founded, developed, these banana republics (Basically everything south of the Pecos) need to develop, grow and identify what type of country they want to be. Politics, economic, religious (or lack of). It can start small like in the Country of Georgia (I think it was Georgia). All the police were fired or retired, for normally a person making a trip usually got stopped twice for a bribe. New police came in and it was put a stopped to. Those who tried to be corrupt were immediately jailed. Confidence in the government went up
Do'nt take this the wrong way but one needs to learn from pre-World War II Germany as explained to me by an instructor. His idea was to get bread, beer and work for the masses. Okay, not necessary beer, but it was Germany. To the industries the offer of cheap labor, resources was open to them. The way he did things for money with kidnappings, camps and collecting heavy taxes was wrong but new ideas can be utlized now that are ethical.
One really has to look at the viewpoint of the Iraqi, Syrian and El Salvadorians. They are the ones that just want to make a living, raise a family. Talking to an Iranian at the Dubai airport it was evident the general public does not give a damn about fighting the US and all. The Iraqi with 26% unemployment is given a sucicide vest and $10K for his family. The genreal public here and abroad being threatned by gangs and such. Perhaps it is a good idea to give El Savadorians guns. The Old West was basically tamed as most people open carried their Colt Pistols "God made men, Sam Colt made them equal".
Just like the US was founded, developed, these banana republics (Basically everything south of the Pecos) need to develop, grow and identify what type of country they want to be. Politics, economic, religious (or lack of). It can start small like in the Country of Georgia (I think it was Georgia). All the police were fired or retired, for normally a person making a trip usually got stopped twice for a bribe. New police came in and it was put a stopped to. Those who tried to be corrupt were immediately jailed. Confidence in the government went up
Do'nt take this the wrong way but one needs to learn from pre-World War II Germany as explained to me by an instructor. His idea was to get bread, beer and work for the masses. Okay, not necessary beer, but it was Germany. To the industries the offer of cheap labor, resources was open to them. The way he did things for money with kidnappings, camps and collecting heavy taxes was wrong but new ideas can be utlized now that are ethical.
One really has to look at the viewpoint of the Iraqi, Syrian and El Salvadorians. They are the ones that just want to make a living, raise a family. Talking to an Iranian at the Dubai airport it was evident the general public does not give a damn about fighting the US and all. The Iraqi with 26% unemployment is given a sucicide vest and $10K for his family. The genreal public here and abroad being threatned by gangs and such. Perhaps it is a good idea to give El Savadorians guns. The Old West was basically tamed as most people open carried their Colt Pistols "God made men, Sam Colt made them equal".
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COL (Join to see)
SSG Greg Miech - Desperate people will do desperate things, especially for their families. We need to find a way for people to be less desperate or fulfill their desperation within their own country, without bombs, guns and death. Ideally, we get out of the way and coach/mentor on building a government that is 'for the people.' You are correct about the country of Georgia. They eliminated everyone in government and started from scratch. Usually, we help by eliminating the government, through military intervention or cripple it through economic sanctions. We need to find another way. We need to assist in monitoring elections and ensuring people actually vote for people to represent them. We need to jail corrupt politicians (might start in the US first). We need to ensure that the people determine their own fate. At this time, most elections are pre-determined and the people are either fearful of the government or the country is incapable of providing for anyone but the wealthy or politicians. Somehow, we need to find the means to end this cycle.
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SSG Greg Miech
Georgia got rid of the policemen, not the politicians. One has to define corruption. Middle East it is normal, called Graf. Puerto Rico it is normal and look at that place. There was hope with the Arab Spring but that failed. Panamanians rioted to only be killed, Bloody Friday. But give them independence and the first three presidents are impeached for being corrupt. They want the US there, then they do not want them. Need to really look for success stories of countries developing successfully.
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Good to get out. Probably a topic in the Trump and Putin talk with only the interpreters.
What was the goal? How well did it work when Russia and US forces were in the same country? Going to build another wall? What have they achieved so far? When you have mice in the house you can kill all the mice but if you do not kill the sources of the mice. So regardless, unless we want to stay there for generations, this is it. While the military does not want to give out their plan for secrecy, does one really think they have a plan to secure, develop that country? Seems they forgot about the Marshall Plan and all. Let the Russians do it and they can fight ISIS.
What was the goal? How well did it work when Russia and US forces were in the same country? Going to build another wall? What have they achieved so far? When you have mice in the house you can kill all the mice but if you do not kill the sources of the mice. So regardless, unless we want to stay there for generations, this is it. While the military does not want to give out their plan for secrecy, does one really think they have a plan to secure, develop that country? Seems they forgot about the Marshall Plan and all. Let the Russians do it and they can fight ISIS.
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SSG Greg Miech
Different terrain, not landlocked and judging by the exodus of people not really supportive of ISIS or other terror groups. Tactics and tools have changed for the better and they are volunteers now.
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Don't you feel that the other countries of the free world should be obligated to furnish ground troops in places such as Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan. I know that other countries have been involved in these conflicts, but pull their troops out at the first chance. I feel that the U.S. has done more than their share of the heavy lifting and should not have to be the world's full time police force. If these countries, by now, cannot defend themselves they will never be able to the future. The democrats were upset when the U.S. sent in troops, now they are upset when President Trump pulls them out.
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SGT Joseph Gunderson
So, your answer is to play the "what about" game? We cannot control what other countries do, only what we do. Of course, I think that they should be doing something but we cannot control that.
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Sgt Thomas Proctor
I agree, we have no control over other countries and their military but I feel that President Trump has conveyed to them that the U.S. is through carrying the whole load for the free world.
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SSG Greg Miech
If President Trump eliminated taxes, gave illegal aliens and criminals a living wage, pulled troops from around the world, the Democrats would still be upset.
Other local countries can not get their own act together. Only when they all agree and act not to support the terror groups out of kickbacks or intimidation, will any peace occur.
Other local countries can not get their own act together. Only when they all agree and act not to support the terror groups out of kickbacks or intimidation, will any peace occur.
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SSG Greg Miech
Where is the UN in all this? It is like having an HOA you abide by but all the neighbors do not.
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The Commander-in-Chief made the call. Only, concern is not leaving but what the Turks may do to the Kurds who have fought beside the U.S.
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I agree with the decision which I believe there is a plan only known to a select few once ISIS comes out of the rubble. I think too many people have made a knee jerk reaction. President Trump is too smart to repeat BHO's fatal mistakes.
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SGT Joseph Gunderson
Although I don't believe this is the case I do hope that I am horribly mistaken. I pray that I am proven awfully wrong and you will be able to eventually say "I told you so".
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MSG Danny Mathers
SGT Joseph Gunderson - I don't believe in "told you so" which we all know the truth changes, the first report is always suspect. Thanks for the candid comment.
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SGT Joseph Gunderson
Accurate assessment. I was part of the last forces to be in Iraq and I feel that those who have served in Syria will soon feel the same kind of disappointment that we felt after leaving.
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SECDEF is experienced...in military matters, not politics. The POTUS has his reasons for doing things he only has a limited time in office to do what he needs to get America back on track to being a superpower again. MAGA
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SGT Joseph Gunderson
To say that a General Officer isn't versed in politics is a horrible misstatement.
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1SG (Join to see)
So, withdrawing from Syria, which permits ISIS to recover and gives them a victory of expelling the US, and benefits Iran and Russia, makes us a superpower?
He makes no decisions based on Intel, history, or politics, POTUS simply follows his gut, which has been wrong more than right in business. It is likely that his wealth has been created by defrauding the IRS and State revenue office, a long with the fraud against consumers with his university, and blue collar workers by forcing companies to accept less than what was agreed to after the work was completed.
His decisions are made solely for personal reasons, not for any other.
Stock market is in trouble, foreign policy is nonexistent, and the wheels are coming off.
He makes no decisions based on Intel, history, or politics, POTUS simply follows his gut, which has been wrong more than right in business. It is likely that his wealth has been created by defrauding the IRS and State revenue office, a long with the fraud against consumers with his university, and blue collar workers by forcing companies to accept less than what was agreed to after the work was completed.
His decisions are made solely for personal reasons, not for any other.
Stock market is in trouble, foreign policy is nonexistent, and the wheels are coming off.
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