Posted on Jun 12, 2019
SPC(P) Medical Laboratory Specialist
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We have a new 1SG and new commander. The 1SG noticed one day that only 5 people in the whole company showed up to PT. Now he put out to all the platoon Sergeants that everyone must show up to PT at either the 0530 formation or the 1600 formation.

However, my section is the only one in the hospital that has a 1600-0000 shift. I am being told by my first line that the 1SG says that I have to be at the morning formation, no exceptions.

I don’t want to sound like I’m whining but at the same time it’s unfortunate that I have to explain to myself as to why this isn’t right.

As a junior enlisted I do feel stuck.

How do I bring this issue up and solve this effectively and professionally?
Also: Do you know of any Army Regulations that can support anything?
Edited >1 y ago
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SFC Michael D.
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I can remember coming home from a club just in time to change into PT uniform and go to PT. We held each other up and maybe one or two puked but we made it through. If you can't work on only four to five hours of sleep, you may want to pick up a new career. If you get deployed you will get less sleep than that. Plus you have two different time to go. I believe command is being very accommodating. You may need to do some time management.
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MSgt Michael Perkins
MSgt Michael Perkins
28 d
There is so much missing here to be able to properly answer this; however, this is still the wrong mentality for the given problem. Is there a physical fitness problem within the unit? Is everyone being forced to do PT because of a handful of people? I worked every shift there could possibly be and every schedule you could possibly come up with. I also deployed multiple times. I still managed to get my PT time in when it was convenient for me and never had an issue with passing a PT test. Physical fitness is a must and vital to a combat ready force. The only people that should be mandated to attend frequent PT sessions are those who are failing their fitness test. With that said, I see nothing wrong with a unit PT session every now and then where all available members attend. If organized properly, it shouldn't take more than a couple of hours out of someone's day, and everyone should know way in advance of when it will be. This allows them to plan accordingly.
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MSG Logistics (S4)
MSG (Join to see)
27 d
LTC Patrick Mulloney - A more positive response than 'your comment is wasted' is merited here. He at least offered advise from his experience. There is no way that my Company would have 5 people showing up for PT without some drastic measures.
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SSG John Jennett
SSG John Jennett
26 d
Write up a PT plan for your platoon that works for your platoon since yours is the only one that works that shift. Make it concise with the pro's and con's listed and why this PT schedule for your platoon would increase performance and still maintain personnel accountability. Then run this through your Squad Leader, Platoon Sergeant and First Sergeant making sure you follow the CoC. My first Squad Leader taught me, if you have a complaint don't say anything unless you have a plan of action to fix it......I just noticed the original post was in June of 2019....Rally Point why did this thread show up in my email?
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CPL Jason Northedge
CPL Jason Northedge
26 d
Amen to everything you said brother. Story: drinking at every club in the ville getting into fight getting hand split open sowing my own hand up and taking a shower just in time to go to pt. Running 5 miles.
Gotta rely on your brothers n sisters to get through tough ones.
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SGT Retired
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FM 6-22.5 and FM 22-51 Are good reference points to start.

However, I’d ask, how are you only getting 4-5 hours sleep? If you work 1600-0000, and now the 1SG makes a 0530 PT sesh mandatory, there’s plenty of time for sleep. It seems as though you have a time management issue with a now inconvenient PT formation.

Alter your pattern to adjust working the night shift. For example.
1430: wake up, personal hygiene
1500: first meal
1600: work starts
0000: work ends
0000-0530: personal time (to include naps if you want)
0530-0730: PT
0730-0830: last meal, personal hygiene
0830-1430: sleep

I get it. It sucks. It might not be the best leadership decision, but it’s not an illegal leadership decision. However professional your approach might be, the most effective approach (for everyone) is to just show up, sound off like Forrest Gump in basic training, and after the 1SG feels like his point has been made, things will go back to normal.

Best of luck
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SSgt Jeanne Wallace
SSgt Jeanne Wallace
29 d
SGT (Join to see) - Maybe i mis read your intent..but it seemed you were saying Air Crew rest did not apply to army
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SSgt Jeanne Wallace
SSgt Jeanne Wallace
29 d
SGT Hector Rojas, AIGA, SHA - never said anything about lab techs...EVERY enlisted in the army does PT..cooks, clerks, med techs,mechanics....the troop who started this thread is whining that the ARMY wont accomodate their schedule...they have 24 hours in a day they can figure it out ...if they cant ? well maybe they should re think their job choice...
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SGT Retired
SGT (Join to see)
28 d
SSgt Jeanne Wallace - “ but it seemed you were saying Air Crew rest did not apply to army”

You’re going to need to show me where I even remotely stated that. 100% incorrect.
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SGT Hector Rojas, AIGA, SHA
SGT Hector Rojas, AIGA, SHA
28 d
SSgt Jeanne Wallace - Again, the shift NCOIC could very well be conducting PT for the shift. Again, it is done all over the army for aviation night shifters and phase inspection workers. I'm sure it can be done for a medical unit with Lab Techs.
Never said anything about this particular soldier not doing PT, I did say however that as long as PT is done daily, the time can be shifted. At one point in 4th ID, the CG and CSM had the heretical idea of conducting PT at the end of the day. Work call for everyone at 0900. PT at 1630-1700 and home by 1800-1830.
What we are talking about here is the intent of a particular 1SG being a hard@ss trying to make a point.
There is a difference.
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CW3 Kevin Storm
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Edited >1 y ago
Some of you are going to have your ego hurt by what I am writing, but read this this all the way through and think long and hard on this before you hit that dislike/vote down button.

I have read some of the most bizarre, asinine, dare I say fool hardy comments, I have ever seen on Rally Point on this thread. Leaders, get a fracking clue, we are talking about soldiers who work in hospitals, not CQ, not Duty NCO, but soldiers who are treating YOUR soldiers! Would you want a civilian hospital to do the same thing as your loved one is laying in the ICU, NICU, or ER? How would you feel if you knew the staff only got 4-5 hours of sleep for weeks to months on end, and now your child is in their care? Feel good about yourself now? Feel like this is the way it should be for those who work these shifts? Feel like their soldier who got medevacked in deserves the best care we can give them, or some sub-standard level of care because we need to have full PT formations?

If you have never worked in health care, never had to work second or third shifts for prolonged time periods, had to work a person dying in front of you, well I got news for you: you haven't a clue! Ever watch a cardiac monitor for hours on end, try doing that in a sleep deprived environment, see how well you work out, or how well you like telling the survivors that their loved one passed away last night. With all the shortages in medical staff in the civilian world you don't think this kid is going to walk when his/her time is up? This is a case of Ego's, not leadership, or a lack of it. " I need to see a big unit in front of me." Hey Top, you run a hospital, that kid in ICU with the traumatic brain injury is far more important then your sniveling PT formation. That Kid in ICU is some ones loved one, if your second and third shift people are passing their PT tests lay off, or you will lose them, and won't be able to replace them, then you have bigger problems.
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CPL Aaron Novak
CPL Aaron Novak
28 d
CW3 Kevin Storm I love how a bunch of Sgt’s are trying to tell a w3 he is wrong. SMH
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SSG Retired
SSG (Join to see)
27 d
CW3 Kevin Storm I see your point however this is not a bad command decision it is a time management issue on the part of this young troop. If he works from 1600 to 0000 then he is on personal time till that pt formation and can sleep after PT till about 1400 that is plenty of time to sleep and get ready for his shift.
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SFC Brion Wood
SFC Brion Wood
25 d
There were times when I got little sleep. Working rotating shifts and all that. Granted, this my not be the best leadership decision. Probably should re-evaluate their PT schedule. However, PT is typically 3 days per week.
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SGT(P) Jody Hall
SGT(P) Jody Hall
22 d
None said if this was in garrison or the field. If in the field/deployed it is reasonable. As a medically retired NCO I can tell you that the leadership in Aviation or 20th Eng would have had a reverse cycle PT program for the night shift. They would do PT before the start of their shift like everyone else. Over long periods of time it would hamper morale and retention. Needless to say 275+ was my requirements for my Squad or I put them on remedial PT and did it with them. Regardless a a good Platoon Sargent can get this taken care of. If not him the PLT leader. I suspect this was a short term problem.
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