Posted on Jun 17, 2016
I think it's great we are being allowed to roll sleeves again, but we need to do it the way we did BDUs. What do you think?
36.7K
752
231
36
36
0
In the photo you can see this Soldier is wearing it rolled like the Marines wear theirs. I think we need to go back to the way we rolled with BDUs, where the cuff was to the outside. It looks better , and you can just tug the cuff down to easily access your long sleeves when you needed them.
Uniforms
Soldiers
Army Regulations
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 108
Best thing the Army did was stop rolling the sleeves .. Rolling the sleeves up exposes the service member to radiation burns, it STOPS or severely limits air flow though the uniform. It does not dramatically lessen heat retention.
If anything, in hot weather situations service members should be allowed to cuff the sleeve, allowing for a LARGER opening encouraging ventilation. That combined with unblosing and cuffing the pant leg is a significant improvement in hot weather.
Uniform choices should be based on empirical evidence that shows improved performance and adaption to environment...
Then you have the uniformity issue, sleeves up or down.. who decides, when, what month, temp, environment?
What of the SM with large arms that cannot physically roll the sleeve like that and not significantly cut off circulation when is detrimental to performance if not a physical danger condition.
Making decisions to be popular ... what a crappy leader choice.. , SMA lost a few respect points from me on this one...not that he cares much what i think..
If anything, in hot weather situations service members should be allowed to cuff the sleeve, allowing for a LARGER opening encouraging ventilation. That combined with unblosing and cuffing the pant leg is a significant improvement in hot weather.
Uniform choices should be based on empirical evidence that shows improved performance and adaption to environment...
Then you have the uniformity issue, sleeves up or down.. who decides, when, what month, temp, environment?
What of the SM with large arms that cannot physically roll the sleeve like that and not significantly cut off circulation when is detrimental to performance if not a physical danger condition.
Making decisions to be popular ... what a crappy leader choice.. , SMA lost a few respect points from me on this one...not that he cares much what i think..
(44)
(0)
PFC Bradley Campbell
this a perfect example of the problems we have. just make uniform shirts that are short sleeve. then some asshole officer will decree we will only wear long sleeves. instead, we waste time talking about sleeves instead of being better mentors and leaders who lead by example. and protecting toxic NCO's and Officers. and kicking people out for being 5 pounds over weight......or who fail a PT test. and if i get my mitts on the idiot who brought in the black beret, i will twist his head off.
(0)
(0)
SGM Erik Marquez
PFC Bradley Campbell - " kicking people out for being 5 pounds over weight......or who fail a PT test."
And you see it as wrong to uphold standards why?
Your profile says Vet and PFC... that implies you had issues and did not warrant promotion to E4 or were demoted.. Thus your rant is likely as biased as it is unprofessional..
If you had a valid point is was lost on readers...if you can pout together a response that is less biased and even approaching polite discussion, please do. Join the many members here that can agree to disagree, but do so with some manners.
And you see it as wrong to uphold standards why?
Your profile says Vet and PFC... that implies you had issues and did not warrant promotion to E4 or were demoted.. Thus your rant is likely as biased as it is unprofessional..
If you had a valid point is was lost on readers...if you can pout together a response that is less biased and even approaching polite discussion, please do. Join the many members here that can agree to disagree, but do so with some manners.
(0)
(0)
PFC Bradley Campbell
ah yes another "expert" who thinks every soldier should be a career soldier. it is and was not for me, but i never ever had any disciplinary anything for any reason. not one black mark of any kind. not that it is any of your concern. as a man, vet and taxpayer i have every right to call out military stupidity as i feel like it. i left and have worked 25+ plus years in a field where it is 100 percent commission. i am all about doing what i say, when i say and not destroying a few people along the way. but please do tell me about standing around drinking coffee and smoking and yelling at people over dumb shit, i 'd love to hear more about it.
(0)
(0)
SGM Erik Marquez
PFC Bradley Campbell - Sorry cant help you, I don't smoke and have no time for SM that do "dumb shit" I just did not allow them to be promoted past PFC and made sure they left the service on their own, or with help.
I applaud you for getting out knowing it was not for you. It sounds like it was the better plan for the US Army and you.
I noticed you did not respond to the question, here I'll try again.
You said " " kicking people out for being 5 pounds over weight......or who fail a PT test."
I ask again, "And you see it as wrong to uphold standards why? "
I applaud you for getting out knowing it was not for you. It sounds like it was the better plan for the US Army and you.
I noticed you did not respond to the question, here I'll try again.
You said " " kicking people out for being 5 pounds over weight......or who fail a PT test."
I ask again, "And you see it as wrong to uphold standards why? "
(0)
(0)
19
19
0
I think we should just wear the old khaki uniform from the 1950's! Shorts and short sleeve shirts during summertime. It only makes sense. Most of us change into shorts and t-shirts as soon as we get off because the uniforms are ridiculously hot in 100 degrees plus humidity! I don't know why the Army ever went away from them! Especially in garrison!
(19)
(0)
LTC Robert McKenna
Top, what I would have preferred is a long and/or short sleeve "garrison top" similar to what the British have. With UCP pants and boots, this would be something between the combat uniform and the class B. All your sew on stuff (skill badges, SSI, etc) can be on that shirt, with the long sleeve outside the pants blouse used for the field.
I
I
(3)
(0)
(0)
(0)
SGT Terry Pool
I wished that the Army would have never gone away from the khaki uniform! It still gave a very professional look, and was much lighter than the dress greens, and looked so much better when people were on leave or attending a semi-formal type of function.
(1)
(0)
12
12
0
I don't see how this is even viable with either the current multicam or the ACUs - the uniform design doesn't support rolling without looking completely jacked up. Also, given the recent issues that the army has been having with tattoos, better just keep the sleeves down lest senior leader's heads start exploding when they see all the ink that ACUs have been covering up for the last 8 years.
(12)
(0)
MAJ Jim Woods
Being real "old school", I don't see a problem with going sleeves up other than for a tactical reason. Â Anyone who has been stationed 90+ degree heat (don't even talk about the humidity of the Southern School's for Boys and Girls), it is much more comfortable with sleeves up. Â The new ACU/Multicam's should be modified to accomodate this issue.Â
I feel however that common sense is not that common anymore. Â And about the ink? Ask the question "Does the ink affect their effectiveness"?Â
I feel however that common sense is not that common anymore. Â And about the ink? Ask the question "Does the ink affect their effectiveness"?Â
(2)
(0)
(0)
(0)
10
10
0
MSG (Join to see) - I actually liked the former "BDU" sleeve roll for the Army. Plus, it was an easy way to differentiate soldiers from Marines from a distance.
(10)
(0)
7
7
0
Is this really a serious issue? I served in the Army and the Navy so I've rolled them both ways. In fact when I was in 82nd I rolled them two different ways based on the uniform I was wearing. If I wore jungle candies then I rolled them the "Marine" way if I wore the new BDUs I rolled them the "Army" way. If you do it right the "Marine" way looks fine. And if your sleeves are rolled up then you are in garrison and should have no need to immediately roll your sleeves down. As for keeping them down to prevent "radiation burns" or to access your pen pockets? Seriously? Are soldiers now too stupid to understand how to use sunscreen or their breast pockets for carrying a pen? Is this really what's become of an Army that once freed Europe from fascism?!?
(7)
(0)
(0)
(0)
SFC (Join to see)
You must be the smartest guy in the room, so me saying this probably won't matter. In 20 years of service I have never been in a unit that allowed sleeve rolling, to include the 82nd, so my opinion on this is limited. I have always been in infantry units and we always looked at guys with their sleeves up like they were foreigners and would laugh at the uniformity issues amongst them. Just like with the awesome beret, there are going to be far too many that won't put the time or effort into making it look good. I really don't care though, I'm on my way out there door.
As for the sunburn issue, let me enlighten as to how that one would work. You send a spy out to see if 1SG or SGM has their sleeves rolled before formation. He doesn't at 0900 so you go to formation with sleeves down and go about your day that way. One of them decides to have a random formation later in the day only to find out it is sleeves up when you get there (I know, this could NEVER happen in the Army). You frantically roll your sleeves and jump in formation. 1SG/SGM goes on a rant for the next hour and a half about whatever. Those stupid soldiers you spoke of didn't have the time to put on sunscreen and now look like lobsters. Oh well, not you. It is dumb that sunburn would be an argument, but it is because even back in the day when there were times of the year when you were allowed to roll them, leaders liked to play games and make soldiers guess whether or not the could based on a single formation.
As for "what's become of an Army that once freed Europe from fascism" comment, seriously? Unless you are in your middle late 70's, neither you nor I have known that Army. To compare our modern Army to that one is just silly. The focus is more and more being pulled from war fighting to learning how not to hurt ones feelings. Not all the PC classes are bad and some were way over due, but some are flat out stupid and need to go away. They won't, just like we will never go back to the Amy of the "Greatest Generation". As leaders all we can do is adapt to the changes that come and move forward instilling morals and values in our young Paratroopers and Rangers that mommy and daddy aren't at home ensuring the success of our Army.
As for the sunburn issue, let me enlighten as to how that one would work. You send a spy out to see if 1SG or SGM has their sleeves rolled before formation. He doesn't at 0900 so you go to formation with sleeves down and go about your day that way. One of them decides to have a random formation later in the day only to find out it is sleeves up when you get there (I know, this could NEVER happen in the Army). You frantically roll your sleeves and jump in formation. 1SG/SGM goes on a rant for the next hour and a half about whatever. Those stupid soldiers you spoke of didn't have the time to put on sunscreen and now look like lobsters. Oh well, not you. It is dumb that sunburn would be an argument, but it is because even back in the day when there were times of the year when you were allowed to roll them, leaders liked to play games and make soldiers guess whether or not the could based on a single formation.
As for "what's become of an Army that once freed Europe from fascism" comment, seriously? Unless you are in your middle late 70's, neither you nor I have known that Army. To compare our modern Army to that one is just silly. The focus is more and more being pulled from war fighting to learning how not to hurt ones feelings. Not all the PC classes are bad and some were way over due, but some are flat out stupid and need to go away. They won't, just like we will never go back to the Amy of the "Greatest Generation". As leaders all we can do is adapt to the changes that come and move forward instilling morals and values in our young Paratroopers and Rangers that mommy and daddy aren't at home ensuring the success of our Army.
(0)
(0)
CW4 Russ Hamilton (Ret)
CPO Francis, I'm afraid you are right. Yes, the Army got lobotomized some years ago but there is still hope. Soldiers aren't too stupid to figure this issue out but I truly wonder about our senior leaders making decisions like this.
(0)
(0)
7
7
0
I cant handle our military any more, really all the shit going on in the world and we have guys complaining about problems caused by rolling sleeves. There is 36hrs of chickenshit rolled into your standard 24hr military day, if it helps out the troops some then just do it. This is right up there with our famous beret. Lets use a piece of head gear that cooks the skull, doesnt keep the sun from your eyes and you have to fucking shave! Awesome decision. Is there any chance of just allowing some common sense back into the uniforms? Kinda like my brothers white coveralls in a navy engine room, ya common sense.
(7)
(0)
7
7
0
The reason we went sleeves down all the time, prior to the GWOT, is that it does actually keep you cooler in the long run as it traps the perspiration on the skin and doesn't allow the wind/sun to evaporate it as quickly. Now, being a native Floridian, it went against everything I grew up believing and doing, especially in the summer months, long sleeves, hell no; but once I got used to it, it made more sense and actually worked well. As an added plus, I had less of a "farmer's" tan as my arms from the biceps down were not the only part getting sun lol! I do not think with the current design of the ACU/Multicam coat that it would work out too well if allowed to roll 'em up, but that is just my opinion as a an "older" retired guy!
(7)
(0)
LTC Paul Labrador
Absolutely correct. There is a reason why you see men wearing dishdashas in the Middle East, even when it's over 100 degrees. It keeps you from getting burned and will help keep you cool.
One caveat is the materials your clothing is made from. In OIF1 I purchased my own DCUs to bring with me. I bought the 100% cotton ripstop that the old Jungle BDUs were made out of. MUCH cooler than the 50/50 NYCO that standard BDUs and DCUs were made of.
One caveat is the materials your clothing is made from. In OIF1 I purchased my own DCUs to bring with me. I bought the 100% cotton ripstop that the old Jungle BDUs were made out of. MUCH cooler than the 50/50 NYCO that standard BDUs and DCUs were made of.
(1)
(0)
CSM Chris McKeown
Sleeves down is great in dry environments like deserts, but do not work so well in humid environments. Take the current ACU uniform down to Panama and see how well them sleeves down and that heavy material uniform works for you.
(1)
(0)
SGT Shaun Nestler
I have never worn the current ACU uniform, however when I was stationed in Panama back in the late '90s, I would actually prefer to wear sleves down in the BDU's. Yes, it might be warmer, however we were pushed to keep hydrated (of course on the weekends, that was out of the question down there!). Sleeves down kept you from getting burnt, bit, cut on differant plants (although it didn't help out on Black Palm!). I found to be less comfortable having rolled sleeves in garrison, I felt like I was sweating more.
(1)
(0)
7
7
0
I'm stuck in Africa where it's blazing hot and humid and insects are everywhere. I have yet to feel the benefit of having my sleeves down. It's just the Army being overly protective as usual.
(7)
(0)
1SG David Niles
Where you at in Africa SSG Woods, I did time in Dj, Kenya and surrounding area. Would have liked to join up with Africa command but I was already retired when it was up and running.
(0)
(0)
SSG V. Michelle Woods
I went to Senegal 1SG David Niles . There are so many differences between America and Senegal but I think the coolest part was seeing how similar we all are. Definitely an experience of a lifetime :)
(0)
(0)
SSG Robert Perrotto
CW4 Russ Hamilton (Ret) - not as easy as that Chief - uniformity - cannot have half your unit sleeves up or sleeves down - either you are "all right" or "all wrong" - personal choice is irrelevant.
(0)
(0)
5
5
0
Just for shits and giggles I tried rolling a set just to see. IMHO. It looks like grade A dog shit. Takes away from using pen holder, and limits use of pockets on shoulders. What's the use of making a practical uniform design i.e. Pen holder, pockets on shoulders when they going to turn around and do some stupid crap like this?!
But hey I guess some will be happy now...."suns out, guns out"....SMH
But hey I guess some will be happy now...."suns out, guns out"....SMH
(5)
(0)
Sgt Dale Briggs
It would seem to me there's a difference between being in garrison stateside and being ideployed. I'd think rolled up is fine stateside but when your deployed they would be better down for many reasons. Regardless of branch. But how they're rolled IMO is kinda picky, everyone wants to be a bit different or they'd all wear the same BDUs to begin with.
(0)
(0)
Absolutely, or optional, or only rolled between 10:15 and 11:45 on fun casual dress fridays, Or optional unless in formation, or not at all.
The next question you should ask is.. WHICH commander ? Company? BN? BDE? DIV? CORPS?
The next question you should ask is.. WHICH commander ? Company? BN? BDE? DIV? CORPS?
(4)
(0)
(1)
(0)
SGM Erik Marquez
SGT Robert George - Never waste a single word when a verbose run on sentence will suffice
(1)
(0)
SSG (Join to see)
SGM Erik Marquez - I told my old SGM that he had been a SGM for so long he had forgotten how to just be a soldier .. he laughed, and laughed.. I can't remember how many push-ups did .. but he was still laughing when he walked and way and I was pushing...lol
(1)
(0)
Read This Next
Continue with Facebook 
Continue with Google