Posted on Jul 4, 2015
Operational Camouflage Pattern, is it detracting from the Army's uniformity?
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"Soldiers are authorized to mix and match T-shirts, belts, and boots with either the Operation Enduring Freedom Camouflage Pattern or the Operational Camouflage Pattern during the transition period - expected to run through Oct. 1, 2019. To further ease the change, Soldiers, who already have Flame Resistant ACUs in the Operational Enduring Freedom Camouflage Pattern, will be authorized to wear them during the transition." -http://www.army.mil
Isn't the point of the Army uniform in garrison to maintain a certain level of uniformity amongst the service itself? So with the new uniform being released and the option to "mix and match" pieces from each uniform, won't there be quite a bit of irregularity in formations? I was not around for the switch from BDU's to ACU's, my father was though, and I don't remember there being the option to wear one uniforms undershirt with another's coat. Should the Army stress so much on keeping your hair cut and face shaven if they will allow their formations to look like a heard of commingled cattle?
Isn't the point of the Army uniform in garrison to maintain a certain level of uniformity amongst the service itself? So with the new uniform being released and the option to "mix and match" pieces from each uniform, won't there be quite a bit of irregularity in formations? I was not around for the switch from BDU's to ACU's, my father was though, and I don't remember there being the option to wear one uniforms undershirt with another's coat. Should the Army stress so much on keeping your hair cut and face shaven if they will allow their formations to look like a heard of commingled cattle?
ACU
OCP
Uniforms
Posted 10 y ago
Responses: 10
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Gotta give you a thumbs up SSG (Join to see) for expecting (and demanding) standards and discipline! (I hope your father is reading this as he would be proud!)
The thought to allow this to be a transition is to allow our force to purchase these items (over time) that will end up being part of the clothing bag issued during basic training. It could cause undue financial hardship to require a Soldier to purchase a new clothing bag of uniforms based on a uniform change...the phase in process is a four-year process which covers the cost of the clothing bag when you add up the clothing allowance over those four years. Therefore, if you used only your clothing allowance, you would be able to purchase the complete issue of uniforms over those four years.
The thought to allow this to be a transition is to allow our force to purchase these items (over time) that will end up being part of the clothing bag issued during basic training. It could cause undue financial hardship to require a Soldier to purchase a new clothing bag of uniforms based on a uniform change...the phase in process is a four-year process which covers the cost of the clothing bag when you add up the clothing allowance over those four years. Therefore, if you used only your clothing allowance, you would be able to purchase the complete issue of uniforms over those four years.
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SSG (Join to see)
Thank you CSM. I can definitely see where you are comming from and the goal with the transitional period for the changeover to the OCP's. Especially being a PFC, I understand that we aren't payed the greatest, and the uniforms are expensive. My proposition is merely all or nothing, meaning you either have all of the new OCP (after they start selling all components of course) or you just wear your full ACU's. Functionally they do the same thing.
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The OCP and OEF-CP are so similar in appearance that the mixing of undergarments and boots will not detract from uniformity that much. There was a time during the BDU to ACU transition that you were allowed to wear your brown BDU t-shirt with your ACUs. It is a transition, it has happened many times and if you hang around long enough you will see it again.
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CPT Christopher F.
SGM, I remember the ACU transition too. Everyone was wearing the tan boots with BDUs because you didn't have to polish them anymore!
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I do see what you are getting at. I don't think it will be much of an issue really. So many of us hate the ACU. I am one of them. I think it is a horrible pattern. I was in when we transitioned from BDU to ACU. Formations looked horrible. I was in the National Guard then and some were wearing BDU up the the last minute. With this new uniform we won't have this problem. So many of can't wait to get the new uniforms they are standing in line outside of clothing & sales before it even opens just to get a set. I have a feeling that this will be one of the quickest transitions we will see in our times.
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1SG (Join to see)
You, like many officers I know sir, are aware that they have to pay out of pocket for their uniforms (no recurring clothing allowance). Thus, many officers are just going ahead and getting the new ones now.
As crappy as it may look, and I think it will be better then the last transition, allowing enlisted the option of a slow phase in through their clothing allowance is a good move.
As crappy as it may look, and I think it will be better then the last transition, allowing enlisted the option of a slow phase in through their clothing allowance is a good move.
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CPT (Join to see)
1SG (Join to see) - You are right. I am on a deployment and we didn't get Multicams. We have FRACU's I plan on buying some when I get back. I don't want to spend money on ACUs anymore. I will just get one a month. Since I will go back to a drilling status I really don't need a large quantity of them.
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I always looked forward to my CA month when I was active duty, because I had little wear and tear on my uniform. In effect my CA month was extra spending money.
In a similar situation today, can a soldier be forced to use his clothing allowance to begin the transitional purchases before the wear out date? For example, if a soldier plans on ETS in 2 years, can he be forced to make the purchase?
In a similar situation today, can a soldier be forced to use his clothing allowance to begin the transitional purchases before the wear out date? For example, if a soldier plans on ETS in 2 years, can he be forced to make the purchase?
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1LT (Join to see)
No... Commanders cannot force you to purchase the uniform prior to the Mandatory possession date.
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1SG (Join to see)
What happens if mandatory date passes and soldier did not use a previous clothing allowance to get the items. Now the soldier cannot afford to buy the stuff until his next allowance. This could be even as far away as a year under this scenario.
Additionally, I don't think that the usual allowance amount is enough to purchase the entire uniform, including boots. (I may be wrong... I have no idea what the amount is today.
Doesn't this presume that a soldier should use at least two allowances prior to mandatory date to make the purchases, and if they don't, will the "I can't afford it" excuse fly?
Additionally, I don't think that the usual allowance amount is enough to purchase the entire uniform, including boots. (I may be wrong... I have no idea what the amount is today.
Doesn't this presume that a soldier should use at least two allowances prior to mandatory date to make the purchases, and if they don't, will the "I can't afford it" excuse fly?
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I think it would take personal courage NOT to mix the uniform. What happens when someone "accidentally" mix the uniform after the end date? I'd hate to see the fire and brimstone coming from their CSM.
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Is it detracting from uniformity? Of course.
Does it matter? It doesnt.
SMA and ACOS both have said that it doesn't matter, and in fact we are still the most efficient and ass kicking military.
Now let me ask you this:
You are a PFC so you make a pittance of a salary.
Can you afford to spend $450 to replace all 4 sets of ACUs in one sitting?
Add to that the roughly $250 foe a few sets of the also new APFU uniform?
That's $700 out the door.
If mix and match bothers you that much...you'll hate deployment, you'll see people wearing all sorts of stuff.
Does it matter? It doesnt.
SMA and ACOS both have said that it doesn't matter, and in fact we are still the most efficient and ass kicking military.
Now let me ask you this:
You are a PFC so you make a pittance of a salary.
Can you afford to spend $450 to replace all 4 sets of ACUs in one sitting?
Add to that the roughly $250 foe a few sets of the also new APFU uniform?
That's $700 out the door.
If mix and match bothers you that much...you'll hate deployment, you'll see people wearing all sorts of stuff.
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It is what it is. We wore tan or brown shirts and black or tan boot in BDUs during that transition (that was ugly). When the uniform costs more than the old (BDUs $55-60 a set, ACU $85 a set and now the new one $95 a set) you cant expect everyone to be able to drop that cash on new undershirts, socks, 2 pair of boots, a cap, a belt and 4 sets of the tops and bottoms at once.
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Are company level COs authorized to not allow the company to wear the new uniforms yet for the sake of uniformity, or any other reasoning?
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SSG (Join to see)
From what i have seen it is up to the unit commander to authorize the wear of the new uniform or the multicam uniform.
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1LT (Join to see)
correction on that. The "Senior Commander" is the one who can make that call. That person is usually the Division/Corps/Installation Commander. If your higher echelons are wearing it, you can too. Just beware of the toxic leader that will find another reason to crush you just because you "disobeyed" an unlawful order.
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I u sweat and that a complete purchase of every issued items would cause a strain on a Soldier's finances especially or young PVT-SPC. However the basic everyday items such as full set of OCP should not be mismatching do to availability. If so we should wait another year until we have all items before making the change. I don't see any other branch doing this mess. I love who i'm with but come on Army. Now I don't expect soldiers to run out and purchase assault packs, duffle and the other non essential items right away but I stand firm on the every day uniform.
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Not at all...common sense has been applied and it is refreshing that it has, as it doesn't happen that often from that high up on the totem pole.....we went through a similar mismatched period when the ACUs were rolled out, so for a while you had BDUs, DCUs and ACUs all being worn. Not everyone can run right out and purchase the new uniforms on day 1 or hell even day 30, it will be ugly to the eye for a while, but is not a detriment to the Army.
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