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Gen (Ret) Shinseki just resigned (aka fired) as the Secretary of Veterans Affairs. Whats your take? Legit, scape goat, or...? And was the problem handled at the appropriate level?
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Edited >1 y ago
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My personal opinion is he needed to resign. He has proven in the past to be incapable of managing effectively. The move to the black beret was conducted under his watch and I think we can all agree that has been one the greatest failures of leadership in the past 15yrs in the Army. The beret caused serious morale issues, wasted millions of tax dollars, and to this day thousands of NCOs spend countless hours training troops on how to wear it (unsuccessfully). And how did the beret enhance or improve the Soldier? It didn't. And Shinseki was not strong enough to admit failure then. While the VA job is one of the most difficult one anyone could possibly attempt to take on, and we can applaud his courage for trying, ultimately he was the wrong man for the job. His resignation was symbolically what the country needs but also necessary so a stronger leader can take the reins. Congress must give the new VA Secretary powers to deal with the corrupt and/or inept staff. I read somewhere that we should take a page from Jack Welch at GE years ago and also fire the bottom 10% of poor performing staff. From my experience as a staff NCO when the clerks don't care enough to do their jobs correctly despite all my motivating talks and training, then its time to remove them (from my unit or the army).
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CSM David Hopkins
I will not get into the politics of this whole situation, but suffice to say you are correct in some of what you say. I am curious if it is the failure of the lower percentage as you say or more of a failure in those junior echelon leaders and staff to not tell the truth in what the issues were. Too many times the subordinates will say what they think the boss wants to hear vs. what (s)he needs to hear. I believe there is another issue here besides a poor performing staff. When OEF and subsequently OIF began, no one in the Bush administration could have predicted the large number of survivors from the wars. Many servicemembers that would have been killed or DOW in previous conflicts are still with us due to the huge advancements in medical treatments. I think because of this, there are not enough medical personnel to properly care for the veterans. More money needs to be allocated from Congress in order to get more VA medical personnel or allow non-VA treatment facility visits for the Veterans. Just my two cents.
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SFC A.M. Drake
SFC Benavidez,
You came really close from me giving you a thumbs down, reason being I gave you a reprieve only because you are only looking at it from the point of the military point of view, instead of civilian government employment.
1. As a civilian employee of the government you earn career-status after 3yrs.
2. You're basing Gen. Shinseki as a failure based on his view/authorization of the Black beret? What about the current leadership on the ACU's we currently wear now? Did you ever look at his whole career by any chance? What about he told the last administration that we needed about 500,000 troops for after the combat operations were over? He got ridiculed for that by the senior administration officials, turns out he was correct all along.
3. Do you know exactly how the VA is setup and ran as an organization, I do as I worked there in the 90's. So you just cant fire a career-status employee without approval of the AFGE (Union)
4. Lets say your the Secretary of VA, what would be your gameplan of righting the ship since Gen Shinseki did not live up to your expectations? How are you going to restore the veterans trust, your shareholders the American people, the board members (Congressional members, The President)?? Do tell.
Just my 2 cents..btw if you need any assistance in filing for your disability let me know or any assistance in that arena. look me up on global
You came really close from me giving you a thumbs down, reason being I gave you a reprieve only because you are only looking at it from the point of the military point of view, instead of civilian government employment.
1. As a civilian employee of the government you earn career-status after 3yrs.
2. You're basing Gen. Shinseki as a failure based on his view/authorization of the Black beret? What about the current leadership on the ACU's we currently wear now? Did you ever look at his whole career by any chance? What about he told the last administration that we needed about 500,000 troops for after the combat operations were over? He got ridiculed for that by the senior administration officials, turns out he was correct all along.
3. Do you know exactly how the VA is setup and ran as an organization, I do as I worked there in the 90's. So you just cant fire a career-status employee without approval of the AFGE (Union)
4. Lets say your the Secretary of VA, what would be your gameplan of righting the ship since Gen Shinseki did not live up to your expectations? How are you going to restore the veterans trust, your shareholders the American people, the board members (Congressional members, The President)?? Do tell.
Just my 2 cents..btw if you need any assistance in filing for your disability let me know or any assistance in that arena. look me up on global
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SSG William Patton
CSM, I retired from state government and saw similar failures in the leadership in my state. Anytime you tie performance to statistics and then reward the leadership if they achieve high numbers, you set yourself up for a scandal like the current VA scandal. If the leader is going to get a big bonus for timeliness, then some will doctor the statistics to ensure they get the money. The greater the bonus the greater the chance of fraud becoming present and that is exactly what happened with the VA. Shenseki, as the leader, okayed the bonuses and must share in the responsibility for creating an environment that opened the door for malfeasence by hospital administrators and others in leadership positions.
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1SG (Join to see)
SFC Drake, I appreciate your honesty and for the recordm I did give you a thumbs up because you make some valid points. Of course, I did preface my statement with "My personal opinion". As a professional, I have a different take that is more objective in nature, but something about this issue made me want to publicize my personal opinion (which I don't do too often). Several others have brought up a very valid point, he was in office for 5 yrs and did not bring to congress the issues that were discovered by the IG in a few weeks on investigation. If congress is the one to grant him the power to make changes (read: take on the union) then he should have made more noise. The SecVA is part politician and that is not one of his strengths.
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My apologies to the audience and the General on his combat record. I had been misinformed. I stand by my comments on the berets and his lack of critical look at the VA during his tenure.
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SGT Craig Northacker
Captain, I do not know how you are measuring his critical look at the VA - the opposite is true. He was undermined by a lying pack of backstabbing REMF's who were more interested in manipulating statistics to claim bonuses than to treat the veterans they are already paid to take care of. And I would bet his salary for a year that there are a great many VA employees who feel the same way. I suggest you take a hard look at the many changes he instituted while navigating the treacherous shoals of Washington. Then ask if any one person could have realistically done more. Execution in the field is always the issue, and while he has an excellent military record, the military never had unions to protect the incompetent while hurting the veterans. I have spoken with top management who complained bitterly that they had people earning 6 digits who often did not even show up for work, and took over a year to fire. I think when you look hard at his record, you will have a different picture than you are seeing at this point in time. The VA has more problems than you can shake a stick at, but there are a lot fewer of them now under his watch.
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CPT Arthur Jacobs
You make good points about liars and the lazy bureaucracy. However, did he think that the VA was a perfect institution when he arrived? It was rife with complaints from veterans over the years. How was it that the IG so quickly found dirt, and yet in his long tenure things were in cruise control. Why are there no counter-reports on his behalf citing all the mismanagement and waste "he must have found" as a General "visiting the field?" Surely, he could have brought over individuals from his long past who he knew were guys he could trust to shake things up a little. It's classic, the new CEO brings in a team of "independent auditors" as is his duty, and these guys become "semi-hatchetmen" in the name of objectivity ("calls 'em likes they sees 'em) while he stays above the fray. I am just sorely disappointed that he for all his time there, he is only "now" discovering that he was surrounded by lying lackey subordinates!
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I DID NOT WANT HIM TO STEP DOWN AND I THINK HE IS AN HONORABLE MAN AND HE IS JAPANESE DECENT AND THAT MAKES IT EVEN BETTER AND I THINK HE IS THE ONLY ONE WHO COULD HAVE FIXED THE MESS IN THE VA.
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SSG (Join to see)
I second what MAJ Ballinger asked. What does ethnic background have to do with him doing a job?
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He didn't create the problem. But he allowed it to exist for the five years he was in charge.
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SSG Jeffrey Spencer
SFC V, he is the man in charge. He was for over 5 years. If he didn't know there were issues, what does that say about his leadership?
If you are put in charge, and you delegate the tasks, who is responsible? The buck stops at the top. That's why he earned the big bucks.
If you are put in charge, and you delegate the tasks, who is responsible? The buck stops at the top. That's why he earned the big bucks.
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SSG Jeffrey Spencer
True that. But we know how that story will end.
MAJ Chris talk about failures in the system. I do believe the controls put in place have overrun their benefit.
I recently encountered something in my own fed job that had me SMH. An employee sang to an IG and is now politically paying for telling the truth. I hope he gets to use the whistleblower law in his favor.
MAJ Chris talk about failures in the system. I do believe the controls put in place have overrun their benefit.
I recently encountered something in my own fed job that had me SMH. An employee sang to an IG and is now politically paying for telling the truth. I hope he gets to use the whistleblower law in his favor.
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I don't know much about him, but I think he lost a degree of staff accountability at some point to end up where he is now. Most likely not entirely due to his fault. I'm sure VA will take care of his medical needs nevertheless
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I think he is partially a scapegoat. We need to ensure the folks closer to the scandal are held accountable.
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SGT Ben Keen
I think you are spot on sir. Mr Shinseki oversaw the entire VA which of course includes the VHA and the VBA. Both sides of the house reported to him but both sides never talk to each other and both sides have people in high positions that allows these things to happen. Those people need to fired. Don't let them resign or collect any sort of package. Hand them a box and tell them to pack up their office.
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Col (Join to see)
I agree, but then you need to ensure the replacements are more trustworthy and responsible. Otherwise you are back to the same problems. Clean house, make examples, and bring in a new crew.
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Like someone said earlier is he just the scapegoat ?
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Am I mistaken, but is this the same non-combat (admin) General who decided when he was on active duty that the Army would switch headgear to the black beret so that everyone would feel "special" and their precious and delicate self-esteem would get a boost. If not, I apologize for the error (but at least you'll know I thought it was a bone-headed decision to take the traditional and distinctive Army Ranger black beret and hand it out wholesale). If I am not mistaken, then there is a pattern of bone-headedness here! He said he guessed he "trusted" people he should not have! Excuse me, but his job in taking the position was to have done a thorough and objective analysis of the operation to replicate the good stuff and correct the poor stuff. Perhaps the IG who so quickly found all the incompetence and bureaucracy should have been the one to head up the VA in the first place! Yes, you want to trust your subordinates, but that should come after they have proven their competence. Because this thing is about veterans, both sides of the aisle have (finally) joined in. You would have hoped that the Democrats would have been just as incensed about the IRS or Benghazi, but alas, politicians (and increasingly, Generals) are looking for their personal nest to be feathered as opposed to doing the right thing. Hooray for McRaven and McCrystal who tell it like it is. Okay, my rant.
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SFC James Verdejo
With all due resopect Sir, He IS a Combat Vet (Vietnam) who lost a portion of his foot from a Mine. And the way I see it, before ANY member of Congress opens THEIR mouth calling for resignations, THEY should look within. Congress over the last 20 yrs has done nothing but get fat and blame everyone else for their ineptness. I guess that Congress thought all those Visits to Iraq, Afghanistan, the VA Hospitals and all those photo ops with the troops got everyone thinking our Politicians cared about us. NOW the public is AWARE of all the crap going on at the VA and they want to blame GEN Shinseki because He's been there 5 yrs?
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