Posted on Nov 20, 2019
SPC John Canning
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For dereliction of Duty, Insubordination, and whatever else fits for their efforts to work around the Commander in Chiefs wish for the military.

In my opinion Green should immediately face the maximum reduction in Rank and be dishonorably discharged by President Trump.
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Responses: 188
SGT Charles Bartell
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17
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It is truly funny how so many of you there seem to have such a problem with Trump getting involved in Military Court Marshals. But do not have any problems with Obama pardoning Drug dealers.
Killing a terrorist is the job of today's military. not unlike killing the North Vietnamese or North Koreans
or the Chinese in both of those wars. none of you out there should be condemning the men on the lines for there actions unless you were there and saw what happened. NOT by what some arm chair none warfighter thinks should have happened.
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SFC Casey O'Mally
SFC Casey O'Mally
>1 y
Iraq, 2003-2004
Iraq 2008-2009
Iraq 2010-2011
Afghanistan 2015.

There's my creds. And I still condemn what he did.
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COL David S.
COL David S.
>1 y
Don't forget the pardoning of a deserter, Bergdal who left his post and walked intentionally into Taliban hands. He was traded for several known Taliban terrorists and the then President allowed him to be "promoted". No great outcry there.
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SSG Elyzabeth Cromer
SSG Elyzabeth Cromer
5 y
COL David S. Point of record, the Department of the Army promoted Bergman. President Obama stayed out of the way and allowed the UCMJ process to move forward. Current U.S. Military guidance is that Commanders will not be involved in the process of investigating, or making determinations on issues where their own troops are involved or a conflict of interest may exist. As the CinC the President certainly has with in their scope of power pardoning or commuting a punishment, after the completion of the UCMJ or other legal process.
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TSgt Brian Herman
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My thoughts are, that as CIC, the President sets policy. The new policy as just set forth, puts an end towards the PC era in the military. THe job of the military is to kill people and blow shit up. Were the actions of the individual in question a particularly good idea? Probably not. However- military people who are actually involved in combat operations have earned an amount of lee way. Political correctness is the greatest threat this nation has faced, and I for one am extremely glad to see that there is starting to be some back lash to it!
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SFC Retention Operations Nco
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14
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Did you actually read the article? The Navy isn't kicking the guy out, they are kicking him out of the SEALs and revoking his trident, as well as the trident of two of his commanding officers. He will still get to retire, he will just never be able to call himself a SEAL again.
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1SG Civil Affairs Specialist
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I think the SEALs are an elite organization that chooses it's own standards and members must meet rigorous and constant assessment.
Whatever one thinks of Chief Gallagher, a whole lot of shit came up in the proceedings that pitted SEAL Team members against each other. There is NO WAY that the community will be able to trust one another in the way that they must after this. His time in Navy Special Warfare is done.
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SPC John Canning
SPC John Canning
6 y
Correct he was retiring.
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1px xxx
Suspended Profile
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This is the perfect assessment.
1SG Civil Affairs Specialist
1SG (Join to see)
6 y
MAJ Ken Landgren me neither
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1SG Civil Affairs Specialist
1SG (Join to see)
6 y
MAJ Ken Landgren - I hadn't heard that one.
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MAJ Eric Greek
10
10
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Yes, senior leadership needs to be cleared out on this one.
When accused of crime, even very serious ones, you are innocent until proven guilty. That is a bedrock principle of the constitution. It applies to both civilians and service members. Putting aside my many encounters of the military failing to investigate credible reports of war crimes, when they do decide to pursue charges, they actually have to prove guilt. The Navy had its chance and blew it, badly. Do you know what you call someone who is exonerated by a court martial panel? Innocent. Your personal feelings or mine on the matter are simply not relevant.

The Navy had the opportunity to appeal the findings of the court martial. They have refused, apparently acknowledging the evidential shortfall in their case. Instead, they have tried to maximize punishment for 'posing with a dead body'. Trump, whether you like him or not, is the Commander and Chief. Not not only issued guidance to stop these efforts, he officially pardoned Gallagher. That is the end of the process, full stop. There is no appeal. If senior Naval officials disagreed and genuinely believed that this would undermine military discipline, they had the option to resign rather tan follow the guidance. they elected not too, indicating that there disagreement was not quite as fundamental as they have allowed partisan politics to make it out to be.

There are serious problems with UCMJ. There are serious problem in Naval Special Warfare units that have become public knowledge. There are undoubtedly more that we do not know about. That breakdown in discipline occurred with senior leaders on the watch reporting to Congress that everything was all well and good. There are few, if any, prosecutions of misconduct during this period, validating the old adage that walking by a violation of standard sets a new standard. Combine that with emerging command interference on issues like sexual assault. Service members accused any kind of sex crime face railroad justice, and, again, senior officials over seeing this practice have signed off on it (to the point where the Navy's senior JAG was retired early for unlawful command influence).

Senior military leaders are no strangers to political interference in the UCMJ process. In this particular case, there appears to be a happy coincidence between the Navy's catastrophic misapplication of UCMJ and Trump's determination of a motivated political constituency. The same officials decrying Trump's intervention have had been silent when those interfering where senior military officials. In this particular case, the SECDEF was very correct to relieve SECNAV. He would be very correct to institute changes to the UCMJ that would eliminate this kind of political interference with military justice ... to include by the same commanders lamenting the President's, rather than their own, decisions on cases.
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SPC John Canning
SPC John Canning
6 y
Could not agree more.
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MSgt Michael Smith
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I think you got some stuff mixed up. This is the problem with tyrants...they make their subjects believe they are all-powerful, that they can do as they wish. Trump has the power to pardon--pardon does not mean that the pardoned individual didn't do the crime, or that they aren't guilty of the crime. Pardon means that the crime doesn't matter. So just because a person is pardoned by no means indicates they are fit for service, or that they are somehow now honorable or even fit for duty. Conduct unbecoming is just that. Even though Trump might this the behaviors of this individual are honorable, it isn't up to him. He's lot the faith of his commanders, peers, and is a smear on the reputation of the Navy and all people in the service. He isn't going to be in prison, but he has NO place in uniform. He is a disgrace. A pardoned disgrace, but still a disgrace. This is EXACTLY why Trump should not get involved in stuff like this.
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SFC David Xanten
SFC David Xanten
>1 y
SFC Casey O'Mally - 894. ART. 94. MUTINY OR SEDITION
(a) Any
person subject to this chapter who–
(1) with
intent to usurp or override lawful military authority, refuses, in concert with
any other person, to obey orders or otherwise do his duty or creates any
violence or disturbance is guilty of mutiny;
(2) with
intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of lawful civil authority, creates,
in concert with any other person, revolt, violence, or disturbance against that
authority is guilty of sedition;
(3)
fails to do his utmost to prevent and suppress a mutiny or sedition being
committed in his presence, or fails to take all reasonable means to inform his
superior commissioned officer or commanding officer of a mutiny or sedition
which he knows or has reason to believe is taking place, is guilty of a failure
to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition.
(b) A
person who is found guilty of attempted mutiny, mutiny, sedition, or failure to
suppress or report a mutiny or sedition shall be punished by death or such other
punishment as a court- martial may direct.
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SFC Casey O'Mally
SFC Casey O'Mally
>1 y
SFC David Xanten why am I being tagged in this?
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SFC David Xanten
SFC David Xanten
>1 y
SFC Casey O'Mally - Because people in the Military DO NOT fall under the USC, they are subject to and only to the UCMJ. a perfect example is that Military Personnel don't have 1st Amendment rights or Fourth Amendment either. And the Article 94 reference is to remind you of your words.
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SFC Casey O'Mally
SFC Casey O'Mally
>1 y
SFC David Xanten USC is US Code. It is federal law and it DOES apply to people in the military. Military members are subject to all applicable laws PLUS the UCMJ.
Regarding Art 94. Are you saying the it is seditious for me to discuss the Constitution or the enumerated powers within it?
And yes, military personnel DO have 1st AND 4th Amendment rights. Those rights may be curtailed to an extent for good order and discipline, however the rights are not completely removed.
While Ibwas still in (I am now retired) there is no way in he'll my Commander or an MP could enter my home against my will without a warrant. Why? Inown my home off post, ans I have 4th Amendment rights.
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LTC Trent Klug
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While they are able to do this, the optics do look bad on the senior leaders of the Navy. Since he's requested retirement, just let him. If they want to pull his Trident because of the one Article he was convicted of why aren't they doing the same to the others in the photo?
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Maj Gail Lofdahl
Maj Gail Lofdahl
>1 y
Please give me one example of a military retiree who was recalled to active duty and courts-martialed for an offense committed IN RETIREMENT. I've only seen retirees recalled to active duty and tried for offenses that were committed while on active duty (when those offenses weren't discovered until after retirement).
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SSG Robert Perrotto
SSG Robert Perrotto
5 y
SPC John Canning - A retiree has to do something so hienous that a recall to face court martial is warranted. Most times, the military lets the civilian court handle such transgressions. when you recall someone, you have to pay them, and render all curtesies due their rank, until such time a courts martial finds them guilty. It is less hassle to the military to let civilian courts deal with the situation. That being said, other then voluntary retirement, whatever the Military does would be seen as a political move.
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SPC John Canning
SPC John Canning
5 y
Not following your redponseSSG Robert Perrotto
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SSG Robert Perrotto
SSG Robert Perrotto
5 y
SPC John Canning - put simply, the military would not recall a retiree for anything less then treason. And that can only be applied in a time of war.
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PO3 Michael Wiedenhoeft-Wilder
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It pains me to see Trump destroy the U.S. military and everything it stands for. He’s making a mockery out of the UCMJ. The draft dodger in chief has destroyed the historic credibility of our nation’s military. He has used the military for political purposes which is completely wrong. Now, he has destroyed the credibility of the joint chiefs of staff by calling them names because he’s a fuc*king moron. When he wore a maggots hat on to the field of the Army Navy game he again used the military for political purposes. In my opinion, deep down Trump hates the military because he feels Intellectually inferior to the admirals and generals. We should amend the constitution to disqualify anyone from being president who dodged the draft. I just hope the UCMJ and the military are strong enough to survive Trump’s pathetic presidency.
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SP6 Christopher Haydon
SP6 Christopher Haydon
>1 y
Absolutely. I'm also concerned about the level of political and religious indoctrination that has occurred in the military since I got out. It's a different world. The Senate has abrogated it's responsibility to maintain three independent branches of government by acquiescing to the Executive Branch. We will not survive as a Constitutional Democracy if this continues any longer. I'm encouraged to see that there are others who view this as I do.
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PO3 Michael Wiedenhoeft-Wilder
PO3 Michael Wiedenhoeft-Wilder
>1 y
In all honesty, I’m shocked at how many veterans are ok with trump dodging the draft. There was a time when any man that dodged the draft he was considered worthless scum and cheat. While men were at war in Vietnam trump was partying with his friends. I for one cannot accept this. Same goes with religion. We live in a country with religious freedom and freedom from religion. SP6 Christopher Haydon
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SP6 Christopher Haydon
SP6 Christopher Haydon
>1 y
PO3 Michael Wiedenhoeft-Wilder - The Air Force Academy has gone through a trial of its policies over the last years. Your mention of freedom from religion triggered that memory. We are all tasked with defending the Constitution and all of its tenets.Discussions of this nature are not political...they're of national importance regarding issues we should all be reminded of regularly. Anything that draws attention to what we need to embrace as a nation is in the interest of the military...and we're suffering from extreme polarization right now. In order to be effective the military needs to be as neutral as possible. I'm not sure that's possible.
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CW3 Walter Goerner
CW3 Walter Goerner
>1 y
PO3 Michael Wiedenhoeft-Wilder - Article II of the Constitution gives the President of the United States the authority over all the military forces of the United States and it was purposely written that way for civilian control over the military without being in the military. Yes, as any General or Flag officer in a chain of command can overrule the decision of a Courts Martial...the appellate authority/convening....the President being the supreme Flag appellate authority for the military can overrule a Courts Martial prosecuted under the Uniform Code of Military Justice. As for the commentor, that a USC overrules a charge under the UCMJ, that's not so. All charges under the UCMJ and under punitive charges tried by Courts Martial are charged under the specifications of the UCMJ, not a USC, not a State code, not a local code. A Federal court, State court or municipal court will try you on charges under their jurisdictions and you will never see a charge for a UCMJ code violation as you won't in a military proceeding for other than a UCMJ code. Now, unless you have no further obligation to the military, meaning that you didn't retire which is what we call it but has been deemed deferred compensation, you are subject to Article 88, UCMJ about making disparaging and libelous comments regarding the President. The subject of who is still and those that are still held accountable under the UCMJ was addressed in a previous forum. You can cry about your right to "free speech" all that you want to, but because there are some laws also allowed by the Constitution as in the authority of the President to modify for the good order and discipline of the military, per Article II. Not only does it pertain to someone writing, speaking to, or making such statements in a social application such as this, it's still considered public and not private speech. UCMJ article 88 and UCMJ article 134. Active duty or receiving deferred compensation, enlisted or commissioned.
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SSgt Tracy Kawasaki
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7
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I understand from the posts, many of you support Gallager's actions.
In the future when American service members are executed after capture. When the enemy kills American civilians, I hope you have the decency to keep your mouth shut. By defending this war criminal, you ARE giving permission for our enemies to do the same.
If by chance that enemy is tried and the head of that country pardons him, I would expect you to accept it without complaint.
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1SG Bernhard Mattulat
1SG Bernhard Mattulat
6 y
Hit that nail square on the head! History supports the "What goes around, comes around
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SFC David Xanten
SFC David Xanten
>1 y
I do believe that in wars we have fought in since WW! our enemies have a=in all cases treat POW's with anything but respect. Being a veteran of RVN it is easy to see why some would get pissed after a member of their platoon was killed, to take and ear or two in retaliation. Was it right, no, but it happens and until you have been there I would hope you might understand.
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SSG Robert Perrotto
SSG Robert Perrotto
5 y
what planet do you live on? Our service members and civilians are killed by radicals routinely, or shall we forget the video taped beheadings of ISIS, or the Taliban and Al Queda attacks, the world trade center. None of the opponents we have faced follow the rules of war, or the Geneva convention. Do I think what he did was right, of course not, but do I understand why - absolutely.
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Maj Ted Mc Neel Sr.
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Two Star Rear Admiral Collin Green should have stopped any review of CPO Gallagher expulsion from the SEALS and taking away his TRIDENT Pin by a board of SEAL personnel when President Trump had already restored Gallagher to the rank of Chief Perry Officer and stated he would retire as a SEAL I look forward to Rear Admiral Green's letter of resignation and retirement from the U. S. Naval Service for failure to take heed of our Commander In Chief direction in regard to CPO Gallagher.
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