Posted on Dec 10, 2015
Should the Army Height and Weight Standards be revised?
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Height and Weight
AR 600-9
Height and Weight AR 600-9
Posted 10 y ago
Responses: 75
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The tape method needs to be replaced since it is completely unreliable. Whoever came up with idea that having thick neck, barrel chest, and no fat in stomach area means being overweight was out of their mind.
I was tape tested in Warrior Leader Course at 156 pound on 5'7ft and failed it. WTF? Seriously? Not even bragging I had six pack and I failed the fking tape test cause I didn't have double chin and pecks of Hulk Hogan? Not to mention passing PT test with 95 push ups, 120 sit ups and 13:30 2 mile run.
I was tape tested in Warrior Leader Course at 156 pound on 5'7ft and failed it. WTF? Seriously? Not even bragging I had six pack and I failed the fking tape test cause I didn't have double chin and pecks of Hulk Hogan? Not to mention passing PT test with 95 push ups, 120 sit ups and 13:30 2 mile run.
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Height/Weight standards.... There has to be some limitation on appearance/fitting into a MOPP suite, but considering that the combat role is amongst more MOS's, I feel, (and always have) that a combat PT test (obstacle course/full battle rattle) immediately followed up with a weapon qualification, would better evaluate a combat ready Soldier.
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SFC Martin Applegate
My entire carreer I had to be taped. I came in at 6' 208 and always worked out. I was the most muscular soldier in every unit I was in and because I was so into working out I just contnued to get larger. I was in 20 years and maxed every apft I took. I also was put in charge of pt failures and even ran unit pt as a PFC. I was chosen at 38 to become a Drill Sergeant and routinely dogged my soldiers despute the age difference. I was never over on my bodyfat percentage or looked overweight in any uniform. I was always meant to feel like a failure when getting taped and the negative comment on the NCOER always troubled me. 20 inch biceps helped out in almost every tactical situation but the stigma of getting taped was always there. I had one female who pulled the tape so hard around my neck it broke. What was she trying to prove. Please fix this system.
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It's easy to say we would like to have the standards relaxed, but the truth is that the real problem is that the standards are only enforced during peacetime. If they are that important, then they should be enforced always. I understand that the Army wants their Soldiers to "look" good and nobody wants a "fat" Army, but there has to be a more realistic standard that could be more readily applied during both peacetime and wartime. I understand that we don't need the extra burden of the paperwork associated with a "Weight Control Program" during wartime so that means we need to develop a better program for peacetime.
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CW5 Ivan Murdock
I agree the importance does seem to move during peacetime - but I think that is partly because to maintain a volunteer force we "allow" for flex in the program to retain experience in our ranks. Sadly that does mean that we overlook how important it is.
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SGT (Join to see)
Yes. Once I was retaped I was G2G. However what if there were no further options available for retape?
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CPT (Join to see)
SGT (Join to see)
I'm glad to hear this. Here is what comes next if you fail the test and retape.
If you exceed the Army's body fat percentage requirements you will receive an official letter stating that you will be placed on a weight-monitoring program. The program will require you to loose a specified number of pounds per month. You will also receive personal counseling to help you develop a fitness and nutrition routine to help you reach your weight loss goals. Failure of the program can lead Chapter 18 separation. Exceptions may be allowed if a medical condition is the reason for not being able to make progress via a weight control program.
"I. WHAT MUST THE COMMAND DO BEFORE THEY CAN INITIATE A CHAPTER 18 FOR FAILURE TO MEET ARMY BODY FAT COMPOSITION/WEIGHT CONTROL STANDARDS?
The following must take place, unless waived:
a. You must be weighed and shown to exceed the screening table weight. If so, you must be taped in order to determine if you exceed the body fat standard.
b. If you fail the tape test, your commander will then initiate a flag. After initiating the flag, your commander must enroll you into an overweight program. Your commander informs you of this fact by memorandum. Once you acknowledge receipt of this memorandum, the clock starts for the purposes of the possible chapter action.
c. Your commander must refer you to a nutritionist for nutritional counseling and proper weight-loss counseling. This is also done by memorandum and must take place as soon as you are enrolled into the program.
d. Your commander must also refer you to the TMC for medical screening to ensure that you do not have a medical condition which would precluded you from losing weight. This is also done by memorandum and also must take place when you are enrolled into the program.
e. After being enrolled in the program, you will be tracked on a monthly basis. The command will conduct monthly weigh-ins. If you fail to show improvement in any two consecutive monthly weigh-ins, the command will initiate separation. If after six months, the commander determines that you have not shown adequate improvement, the commander can either impose a bar to reenlistment or can initiate separation action.
f. If you meet the body fat standard or the screening weight table as prescribed in AR 600-9, you will be removed from the overweight program. This removal is done by memorandum and will be kept on file in the unit for the following 36 months. "
II. WHAT ARE YOUR RIGHTS?
a. You have the right to consult with counsel within a reasonable time.
b. You have a right to submit statements on your own behalf.
c. You have a right to obtain copies of documents which your commander will forward in support of his separation recommendation.
d. If you have six or more years in the active service, you have a right to an Administrative separation Board.
e. You have a right to waive the above rights in writing. Failure to respond in seven days (not signing the form) means you give up all your rights.
I'm glad to hear this. Here is what comes next if you fail the test and retape.
If you exceed the Army's body fat percentage requirements you will receive an official letter stating that you will be placed on a weight-monitoring program. The program will require you to loose a specified number of pounds per month. You will also receive personal counseling to help you develop a fitness and nutrition routine to help you reach your weight loss goals. Failure of the program can lead Chapter 18 separation. Exceptions may be allowed if a medical condition is the reason for not being able to make progress via a weight control program.
"I. WHAT MUST THE COMMAND DO BEFORE THEY CAN INITIATE A CHAPTER 18 FOR FAILURE TO MEET ARMY BODY FAT COMPOSITION/WEIGHT CONTROL STANDARDS?
The following must take place, unless waived:
a. You must be weighed and shown to exceed the screening table weight. If so, you must be taped in order to determine if you exceed the body fat standard.
b. If you fail the tape test, your commander will then initiate a flag. After initiating the flag, your commander must enroll you into an overweight program. Your commander informs you of this fact by memorandum. Once you acknowledge receipt of this memorandum, the clock starts for the purposes of the possible chapter action.
c. Your commander must refer you to a nutritionist for nutritional counseling and proper weight-loss counseling. This is also done by memorandum and must take place as soon as you are enrolled into the program.
d. Your commander must also refer you to the TMC for medical screening to ensure that you do not have a medical condition which would precluded you from losing weight. This is also done by memorandum and also must take place when you are enrolled into the program.
e. After being enrolled in the program, you will be tracked on a monthly basis. The command will conduct monthly weigh-ins. If you fail to show improvement in any two consecutive monthly weigh-ins, the command will initiate separation. If after six months, the commander determines that you have not shown adequate improvement, the commander can either impose a bar to reenlistment or can initiate separation action.
f. If you meet the body fat standard or the screening weight table as prescribed in AR 600-9, you will be removed from the overweight program. This removal is done by memorandum and will be kept on file in the unit for the following 36 months. "
II. WHAT ARE YOUR RIGHTS?
a. You have the right to consult with counsel within a reasonable time.
b. You have a right to submit statements on your own behalf.
c. You have a right to obtain copies of documents which your commander will forward in support of his separation recommendation.
d. If you have six or more years in the active service, you have a right to an Administrative separation Board.
e. You have a right to waive the above rights in writing. Failure to respond in seven days (not signing the form) means you give up all your rights.
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The current tape test is a joke. As long as you have a fat enough neck, you can pass tape. I knew a female MAJ once who, quite literally, looked like she was 9 months pregnant. But she made tape every time because she had a 22 inch neck.
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We need more precise tools for measurement and then we need to increase the standards. If you increase the standards and enforce the standards, people will become motivated to get into the gym and lay off the fattening foods. I used to use the Air Force gym because it was always empty. When they started kicking people out using PT standards, it became standing room only overnight.
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Yes the Army should revise their height and weight standards. We are in the 21st century and should be using 21st century technology to determine this. This would take our the human error factor and eliminate the archaic measuring tape method. But the big army won't change add they want to downsize the force.
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Why not eliminate the standards entirely? We keep cutting benefits so why insist on a healthy force? In the 70s with all the smoking and drinking enlisted guys died, on average 18 months after retirement and officers lasted 3 years. That would reduce health care costs and retired pay.
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Capt Jeff S.
Daaang! Those stats seem a bit overblown. We only get one body and one shot at life so its best to take care of the body God gave us. We don't get to pick our gender, race, appearance, etc. You just do the best with what you were given and instead of complaining about what you think you lack, be grateful for what you have.
I retired at 40 yrs old with 21.5 yrs in and very soon I'll be retired as long as I was in on Active Duty. It seems like a lifetime ago. I'm starting to feel my mortality but IF the good Lord sees fit, I'd like to do another 21.5 yrs retired! That would put me at 83 yrs and some change. It's doable.
I retired at 40 yrs old with 21.5 yrs in and very soon I'll be retired as long as I was in on Active Duty. It seems like a lifetime ago. I'm starting to feel my mortality but IF the good Lord sees fit, I'd like to do another 21.5 yrs retired! That would put me at 83 yrs and some change. It's doable.
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It definitely has to be revised, I was never taped because I was skinny as a rail but at 74" and 225LBS I was borderline obese, I have a 32" waist and am definitely not obese. It should be about fitness not waist size any way.
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Which brings to the point after I checked out marine's standards for body height and weight. Army should implement the same standard. - If someone who fails height and weight standards by scores over 285 points on PT test, there should be no reason for that person to be taped whatsoever. If someone can perform just fine, meet and exceed military standards on duty and off, circumference tape shouldn't be the yard stick of no go in either case.