Posted on Jul 14, 2015
Should the Army switch to hollow point ammunition?
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What happens if we switch? What will our adversaries do in the future? Is this throwing the Geneva Convention out? Are we going to come with more in-humane ways of killing each other? Or is it time to retire the ancient ball round and move forward with something that puts the bad guy down once and fore all?
Posted in these groups: Ammunitions
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Responses: 7
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I've heard the stories of what our adversaries are doing and have found them quite barbaric. I think any type of round we use wont matter...
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We (the United States) will be considered cruel and inhumane if we use them just for the mere fact that some (our citizens) would consider wounding or killing an adversary with anything other than ball ammunition excessive. Not going to chime in on my opinion, just stating fact given the recent PC world in which we live that is like GEN Perkins says, "Unknown, unknowable and ever changing".
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CW3 Kevin Storm
Chief, I worry about the implications on the battle field. What will the our friends and adversaries develop? Having been a street paramedic in the civilian world I have seen what a lot of these rounds can and will do. I may not like the ball round, but I sure as hell don't want to receive some of the types of rounds out there that could be coming back at us.
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CW5 Sam R. Baker
CW3 Kevin Storm - Totally agree, there in lay the issue. Shape charges were developed and utilized causing havoc on our up armored vehicles to get to the Soldier. It would be only a matter of time before they come up with something else, but lets take it back to Vietnam were the booby traps were set for us. No matter the ammo used, there will always be someone trying to kill an American, regardless of the weapon or tactic used. When it comes to US using a particular ammo, I think the retribution for the hollow point will come from our OWN country more than the adversary.
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The "can't use hollow points because it's against the Geneva Convention" is actually one of the oldest and false myths that some people still perpetuate. There is nothing in the Geneva Convention about hollow point versus non-hollow points. The convention just says we can't use something that causes "excessive" injuries, but where does it say that a hollow point causes excessive injuries? Hollow points are actually more likely to be deadly, which is of course in keeping with the convention to prevent unnecessary suffering (not death).
There is simply nothing in the Geneva Convention which prevents the use of hollow points. It's something you hear about in boot camp, but it doesn't make it historically accurate.
There is simply nothing in the Geneva Convention which prevents the use of hollow points. It's something you hear about in boot camp, but it doesn't make it historically accurate.
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Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS
It ties into the Hague Convention which the US was not a Signatory.
We however "honor" the Hague Convention, "however" anytime the US enters a conflict, any signatory of the Hague Convention can feel free to ignore it as well, since a non-signatory is present.
The confusion is because of all the various conventions of armed conflicts and how they apply.
We however "honor" the Hague Convention, "however" anytime the US enters a conflict, any signatory of the Hague Convention can feel free to ignore it as well, since a non-signatory is present.
The confusion is because of all the various conventions of armed conflicts and how they apply.
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The US is not a signatory to any agreement with any person or nation that bans hollow points. That's a non issue.
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As far as the Geneva convention I don't care.
Our advisories don't follow it anyway.
On a function side I think whatever ammo we use had better have the ability to function as well as ball.
Ball has the ability to be more reliable. If it can stand the test I am fine with it.
A jam due to ammo when you are in the heat is the wrong time to have a jam.
One standard.
Our advisories don't follow it anyway.
On a function side I think whatever ammo we use had better have the ability to function as well as ball.
Ball has the ability to be more reliable. If it can stand the test I am fine with it.
A jam due to ammo when you are in the heat is the wrong time to have a jam.
One standard.
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Yes. It is more lethal and we have never signed any international agreement to not use it. Many of our snipers routinely shoot what is legally defined as hollow point. Use the most lethal ammo available and let the enemy respond as they will.
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