Posted on Apr 26, 2016
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https://warisboring.com/it-s-hard-to-tell-war-heroes-from-paper-pushers-when-everybody-gets-so-many-dumb-ribbons-9880c02e718c#.pm9dk9ofb
This article makes a compelling case for redesign of the DoD medal and ribbon policies. The solution offered, wearing valor awards on the right side of uniform, may not please many service members, but it's one idea. Please read the article and take the survey.
This article makes a compelling case for redesign of the DoD medal and ribbon policies. The solution offered, wearing valor awards on the right side of uniform, may not please many service members, but it's one idea. Please read the article and take the survey.
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 85
Truth be told, I worked very hard to earn the awards that were presented to me during my entire career. I am very proud of what I have accomplished. Many deserving service members were presented with a lesser award than what they deserved based on the fact that they were of lower rank. I say we get rid of the mentality that somehow awards are tied to a certain rank/grade.
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It's medal creep. Years ago, the joke was "He has more medals than a General in the Mexican Air Force"...now, the Mexicans have turned that around on us.
Also, My great uncle was a SeaBee who built mulberrys at Normandy while under fire by Germans, then got shipped to the Pacific to get shot at by Japs while building runways for B-29's during the "Island Hopping" campaign. He retired as a Chief after 20 years with 8 medals/ribbons. I know E4's who have that before they re-enlist or go on any arduous deployment.
Yeah...it's changed alright.
Also, My great uncle was a SeaBee who built mulberrys at Normandy while under fire by Germans, then got shipped to the Pacific to get shot at by Japs while building runways for B-29's during the "Island Hopping" campaign. He retired as a Chief after 20 years with 8 medals/ribbons. I know E4's who have that before they re-enlist or go on any arduous deployment.
Yeah...it's changed alright.
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A quotation my Napoleon comes to mind: "A soldier will fight long and hard for a bit of colored ribbon."
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I remember when General Myer became CofS of the army and made the statement that he would like to see more awards and accoutrements designed. Course this was peace time and the officer corps wanted a little more salad on their uniform so they could feel better in formation beside Vietnam vets, I guess. So, we got the Overseas Ribbon, Army Service Ribbon that basic training ribbon, NCODP Ribbon and a slew of others. They're worthless. After forty years I look like a Bolivian General and only three are worth anything to me out of the 34.
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One thing that's thrown off by the pictures is that in the marines and the navy you can wear only your top 3 awards. You don't have to wear them all. I don't know if the Army used to allow it, but if they did that would be why you only saw the 3.
On a side note. When a brand new LT that's hasn't done a damn thing but but a couple of patrols gets a bronze star just for being on a deployment, something needs to change. A bronze star used to have meaning. Now it's a gimme award for a PSG or higher on a deployment, while junior joes who do amazing acts of valor get an ARCOM with a V. Big gap there.
On a side note. When a brand new LT that's hasn't done a damn thing but but a couple of patrols gets a bronze star just for being on a deployment, something needs to change. A bronze star used to have meaning. Now it's a gimme award for a PSG or higher on a deployment, while junior joes who do amazing acts of valor get an ARCOM with a V. Big gap there.
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SGT Beau Thomas
I’m 1946 or 1947 Congress made a law that awarded every soldier to be awarded a Bronze Star if they had a CIB or CMB. The soldier or next of kin had to apply for it though, so even back then, it didn’t have that much value unless it had a V device.
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Get rid of ribbons earned in training...boot camp stuff etc. Convert marksmanship awards to badges (see Marines).
It was once explained to me that, for example, USAF has training related ribbons because it inflates their overall stack to be a bit closer in total amount to other branches.
I do not agree with it.
Part of Valor includes the measures of both potential risk, and real risk, one has subjected themselves to. You shouldn’t benefit by joining the safest/least deployable branch to the safest/least deployable job within it.
Furthermore, what you did “in training” was preparing to serve, but you were not serving (yet). All of these awards are supposed to be Service Awards.
You don’t get the Valor awards without putting yourself into a position where you chances of ever needing to handle a “shit-sandwich” might ever become relevant.
It was once explained to me that, for example, USAF has training related ribbons because it inflates their overall stack to be a bit closer in total amount to other branches.
I do not agree with it.
Part of Valor includes the measures of both potential risk, and real risk, one has subjected themselves to. You shouldn’t benefit by joining the safest/least deployable branch to the safest/least deployable job within it.
Furthermore, what you did “in training” was preparing to serve, but you were not serving (yet). All of these awards are supposed to be Service Awards.
You don’t get the Valor awards without putting yourself into a position where you chances of ever needing to handle a “shit-sandwich” might ever become relevant.
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My opinion on awards is this: everything is relative.
Take the one award EVERYONE has: the Army service ribbon. We don’t make it a big deal because, again everyone has one. Some even call it a participation trophy, and I can see their point. But look at it another way, and how many people in the COUNTRY have one? I think it’s 2% now? That’s allot of people who DONT have one. I wouldn’t recommend putting an ASM bumper sticker on your car, but it’s something to think about.
Same goes for campaign medals, service medals and achievement medals. A lot of people in the Army have them, but there a whole lot more out there who can’t make the same claim.
Folks don’t think too much about their awards and such when they’re in, but 20 years after they’re out, it might be different.
To answer the specific question at hand: keep em. With all going on in the Army and the world, they are physical manifestation of a lot of hard work.
Take the one award EVERYONE has: the Army service ribbon. We don’t make it a big deal because, again everyone has one. Some even call it a participation trophy, and I can see their point. But look at it another way, and how many people in the COUNTRY have one? I think it’s 2% now? That’s allot of people who DONT have one. I wouldn’t recommend putting an ASM bumper sticker on your car, but it’s something to think about.
Same goes for campaign medals, service medals and achievement medals. A lot of people in the Army have them, but there a whole lot more out there who can’t make the same claim.
Folks don’t think too much about their awards and such when they’re in, but 20 years after they’re out, it might be different.
To answer the specific question at hand: keep em. With all going on in the Army and the world, they are physical manifestation of a lot of hard work.
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The only problem that I have about the system is the downgrading of initial awards. For example after a prolonged firefight in Vietnam where I had command of the 43rd Company out of A-401, IV Corps Mobile Strike Force (Mike Force) with 112 Cambodians as an E-4 just 5 months out of the Special Forces Training Group August 2, 1969 (now called the Q Course) I was facing a NVA human wave attack. I called in artillery and CAS which blunted the assault and during the contact I was moving across open ground to direct fire and to make sure every fighting position was up. Our B-40 commander submitted the paperwork for a Silver Star but the S-1 Captain told me that it’ll certainly be downgraded because (1) I wasn’t wounded and (2) I wasn’t an officer. He said it could drop down to an ARCOM with V. It only went down to a Bronze Star with ‘V’. Later I was put in for three MSM’s but all three were downgraded to ARCOM’s. I had a total of five ARCOM’s and five AAM’s. Apparently the higher HQ didn’t like me that much. I’m not bothered by the snub because I simply wanted to do the best I could. One other point we considered the Bronze Star for meritorious service a participation trophy, something nice for all the staff guys in the rear with the gear (REMF/POGs). The I love me shadow box the ARCOM and AAM are switched. Photo taken by my mother after I returned from the Nam Sep 16, 1970. The Cambodian troops were in a formation prior to deploying on a 30 day mission. The phot shows the fourth platoon. The last photo was taken the morning after vthe contact I wrote about; it was day 7 of a 30 day op. All of our ops were 30 days long. The Mike Force was a MACVSOG program called ‘Eagle Flight’ it was so successful that in each of the four corps every C-Team designated one of their subordinate B-Teams as the Mike Force. A-401, B-40, C-4, 5th Special Forces Group.
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SFC (Join to see)
I kept this in mind during my career, especially during my National Guard time. It helped:
“It is better to deserve honors and not have them than to have them and not deserve them.”
― Mark Twain
“It is better to deserve honors and not have them than to have them and not deserve them.”
― Mark Twain
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CPT Jephro Kimbo
Looks very similar to my Uncle's Rack from the Vietnam era. Is the ARCOMM and the AAM reversed in order of precedence?
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