Posted on Feb 17, 2017
Similar to the E-2 question, how would you react to a young 2LT who is being unprofessional with a strong sense of entitlement?
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Here's the background. You are an experienced Soldier. You walk in to the commissary to see a young 2LT shopping with a headset on. You professionally and politely get the 2LT’s attention and address the deficiency. They blatantly are rude, dismiss your comment, and tell you that those rules do not apply to him as an officer. Whether you are an Officer or Enlisted, how do you react?
Military bearing
Discipline
Supervisor
Leadership
What Would You Do
Posted 9 y ago
Responses: 445
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I state that he is not exempt from installation, organization nor Army Polices. Make note of their name and provide it to your Company Command.
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Oh I'm not sure about today but when I was a NCO correcting Lt's behaviors were considered part of the job. They can threaten belittle whatever but you go find a senior NCO if you aren't one and they will gladly "explain" to that young officer why it behooves them to comply with regulations, quoting said reg if needed.
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I had a similar event that happened while I was working the swing shift in the USEUCOM Patch Barracks Communications Center in Stuttgart in 1969. I was the shift supervisor otherwise known as the Trick Chief. The 2LT had come in and quickly criticized the way I was managing trash removal--of all things.
Nevermind I was working with Top Secret messages that had to get logged in correctly and have them relayed to other stations in Germany--many of which were of high precedence.
I asked, "Are you serious, Lieutenant?"
"Yes, I am, Sergeant! Now do as you're told!"
I didn't argue as there were subordinates nearby and did as he ordered.
The next day I visited the OIC, a CW3 who was known to be fair, but stern, if need be. After my interview with the OIC I never saw that lieutenant again.
Nevermind I was working with Top Secret messages that had to get logged in correctly and have them relayed to other stations in Germany--many of which were of high precedence.
I asked, "Are you serious, Lieutenant?"
"Yes, I am, Sergeant! Now do as you're told!"
I didn't argue as there were subordinates nearby and did as he ordered.
The next day I visited the OIC, a CW3 who was known to be fair, but stern, if need be. After my interview with the OIC I never saw that lieutenant again.
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Remind him that the root of the word discipline comes from disciple. While he does still have legal authority, he has no moral authority to expect compliance with regulations while he isn't following them. Without moral authority he is not a leader, just an order giver.
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Ooooohhhh...
Do NOT make me pull out the dreaded Chief's Coffee Mug and say "Noted"!
An exchange of information would ensue...his name, command, and immediate superior for my name, command, and immediate superior.
A 2LT is a Junior Officer, and it is the purview of Chiefs to develop JO's. I rather suspect that is also the purview of the senior enlisted of the other branches, as well.
The standards of our subordinates will be as high as our lowest standard. You cannot be an effective leader and take others to task for standards that you, yourself, do not uphold. An officer who does not understand this MUST be corrected, because that person is not doing our military service any good otherwise.
Do NOT make me pull out the dreaded Chief's Coffee Mug and say "Noted"!
An exchange of information would ensue...his name, command, and immediate superior for my name, command, and immediate superior.
A 2LT is a Junior Officer, and it is the purview of Chiefs to develop JO's. I rather suspect that is also the purview of the senior enlisted of the other branches, as well.
The standards of our subordinates will be as high as our lowest standard. You cannot be an effective leader and take others to task for standards that you, yourself, do not uphold. An officer who does not understand this MUST be corrected, because that person is not doing our military service any good otherwise.
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LTC John Wilson
Agreed, the standards you keep will either make or break a new officer or enlisted man in the service. Imitation is the best part of flattery!
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I would jerk his butt into my office and have a come to Jesus moment, reminding him, I write his OER. Took command of company in 73, from officer drummed out of service. First formation, no platoon officers present. Inquired if officers were assigned to company, 1st Sergeant indicated affirmative. I began to search the post for them, finding them in the officers club at 9:00 am. This combat hardened officer now commander, being a OCR drill instructor, reduced these 2nd lieutenants to maggots and from that day forward, not one missed morning roll call, there was no question whether to salute or not and "sir" was used extensively.
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CPT Larry Hudson
Thank you SSG Hill. I see by your picture you were/are a DI. You are a SSG commanders strived to get. You made things happen.
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LTC John Wilson
another officer filled with the power craving and not the good of the service. No one has to look bad to accomplish good results. Setting up an officers meeting and tactfully presenting the changes you wanted would be more to the good of the Service than making anyone regardless of rank look bad.
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I would ask them to step aside and speak to me. Once off to the side, I would explain to them, that as an Officer in the US (enter Service) that the enlisted soldiers look to them as a person of authority. That, as an officer they lead the way. Also would mention that how the REGS do apply to them. They are the people that write and institute the regulations, as an officer. As an NCO , along with officers, that we enforce the regs. Although, they might be an officer, and out rank me, that they are also charged with following the regs like everyone else. We are the standard.
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SGT Bryon Sergent
I was a young E-3 at Ft. Campbell. I was exiting the PX. The old PX had a canopy out the main entrance. There was a 2Lt that I passed under cover, and I had my PC off. I gave him the greeting of the day, as I passed him. He went about 3 steps passed me and spun. Started chew my ass on how I was supposed to salute an Officer and RANT, RANT, RANT. Out of now where this LTC came up. I gave the greeting of the day again. The LTC wanted to know why this LT was chewing my ass, in public, and was he in my CoC. I stated the issue at hand and that I didn't know the LT. the LTC then turn to the LT. 1st off them Private is under cover, we only salute LT under cover when being reported to, 2nd I saw what was happening, and he gave you the greeting of the day as well to me the senior officer. Since we are talking about this you fail to salute a senior officer, why is that? the LT stammered, LTC said that is the wrong answer, turn to me and said to carry on Private. As I do an about face, I here the the LTC telling the LT, I want you to stand here as everyone enters the PX and give the greeting of the day. I looked back and noticed that he was out form under cover. The LTC continued to say, that you are to salute EVERY officer till I come back out and relieve you from your post. I returned to my car and watched of at least 15 min before I left and the LT was still there when I left! Karma is a bitch!
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I hunt down his parents-l and kneecap both of them for doing such a terrible job raising the brat. Then I find a way to become his senior rater. That first OER counseling goes something like this: “Son, part of my job is to protect the Army against detritus like you.”
Back in the real world, have a word with his 1SG. He’s got the commander’s ear. Unless the commander is similarly brain dead, he’ll crush the maggot… and if he’s any good, he will work with the PSG to try and salvage the Army’s investment by mentoring the brat into something resembling a useful human being.
Back in the real world, have a word with his 1SG. He’s got the commander’s ear. Unless the commander is similarly brain dead, he’ll crush the maggot… and if he’s any good, he will work with the PSG to try and salvage the Army’s investment by mentoring the brat into something resembling a useful human being.
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As a new 2LT, I remember another battalion’s CSM privately addressing my uniform infraction in a terse manner in our company area. I corrected the infraction and stewed on an NCO addressing me like that. I realized he did the right thing. As time progressed, I realized his position as CSM compared to me as a 2LT. I learned from that.
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I’ve walked both sides of the fence, enlisted in ‘83, commissioned in ‘88. I had a 2LT threaten me, an E-3 then, with UCMJ for not having something he never gave me. Took it straight to Top, and he straightened out the 2LT. Never forgot that, and always stayed close with my platoon sergeants and Top to keep me honest with the troops.
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