Posted on Jul 7, 2024
What are your thoughts on the Army eliminating the MP Corps?
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I have seen many posts on Facebook in the Oldschool 95B page talking about the Army either eliminating the MP Corps or eliminating Garrison Law Enforcement from the mission.
I've heard this rumor before, even when I was still in 35+ years ago. I do believe base law enforcement duties stateside will become more and more commonly handled by DOD Police allowing more personnel assigned to units to handle the changing and evolving wartime mission. There's been criticism about "civilian" police enforcing the laws on base, but the DOD Police aren't civilian. They work under the same authority and enforce all military regulations and policies as the MPs do. They also have the same responsibility to the UCMJ as any military member. I see no issues here. What do you say?
I've heard this rumor before, even when I was still in 35+ years ago. I do believe base law enforcement duties stateside will become more and more commonly handled by DOD Police allowing more personnel assigned to units to handle the changing and evolving wartime mission. There's been criticism about "civilian" police enforcing the laws on base, but the DOD Police aren't civilian. They work under the same authority and enforce all military regulations and policies as the MPs do. They also have the same responsibility to the UCMJ as any military member. I see no issues here. What do you say?
Posted in these groups: 
Military police
Law Enforcement
31B: Military Police
31A: Military Police
95B: Military Police
Military police Law Enforcement 31B: Military Police 31A: Military Police 95B: Military Police
Posted 1 y ago
Responses: 27
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I was Military Police for thirty-years, as I also served in Correction, attended Military Security as well as Special Operation and I also served with DOD Police, they are just as qualify as military police and that free up Military Police to participate in field training, preparing them for the Battlefields condition.
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Personally I think it is stupid, reckless and an invitation for problems. This smacks of political maneuvering and some pencil pushing number cruncher selling this as a great idea because it means that they are delegating these functions to non war fighters and shifting military personnel over to different areas.
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PFC Pamala (Hall ) Foster
SPC Richard White I am in full agreement. The decision is truly stupid, narrow-minded, and ignorant. Are these DoD cops well-trained Combative fighters if the need arises-like say, someone "rams the gate" and then goes to fight with one of them? Many have trained in Moi Thai, Bah Ritsu, Judo, Karate, just to name a few styles of fighting, and I have seen a few fights and sparring matches, where some of the MPs look like they could have put Brock Lesnar and Conor McGregor to the ground if they had the chance because they were that well trained! I have also been reading, and now that I am a Paralegal, I am understanding the vital necessity for a well-trained Military Police Officer because detail means everything when you are preparing for any court case.
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The navy does things like this on occasion, too. "We can save money by eliminating/merging this rating!!!"
Eventually, we re-introduce the rating. I'm still waiting for someone to have the common sense to split the LS ratings back into AK/SK. At that point, I can retire, since clear heads will have finally returned.
Eventually, we re-introduce the rating. I'm still waiting for someone to have the common sense to split the LS ratings back into AK/SK. At that point, I can retire, since clear heads will have finally returned.
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DOD Police will protect the Troops and installations for their paychecks and overtime Military Police will protect the same based on honor, espirit de corps, soldiering and most of all with their lives OF THE TROOPS AND FOR THE TROOPS!!! Garrison Law Enforcement should be handled by MP’s, MPI, and CID civilian and government departments should be used in a secondary role or for ground and air transportation to permanent correctional facilities
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I think that it was a bad decision. I was a 95B10 and you need people that are of the troops to police the troops. These Dod are just rent a cops.
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SGT Greg Knytych
I was also old school 95B and worked with the DOD police in 2 posts stateside and they are fully authorized to enforce UCMJ, and most are former MP or SP in the Army, Marines or Air Force. A lot of it depends on what the Provost Marshal; allows them to do. Some only allow guard duties and others allow full law enforcement. They were on patrol with me and the other MPs and did a great job.
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Or, they can do what they did to us in the Air Guard. They made us (USAF Security Police) attend a 2 week Peace Officers course with the Sheriff’s Department. Which indemnified us on the civilian side of the house for civilian incidents, and to enforce the UCMJ on the military side of the house.
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SGT Greg Knytych
The MP School covers all of that and we were fully trained law enforcement as well as trained in the various wartime missions, such as POW Camps, Scouting and Reconnaissance, Traffic Control of troop movement, etc...
In my CONUS stations I was allowed to attend the 13-week Arizona Law Enforcement Academy (ALETA) in Tucson, AZ. This helped with enforcing Civilian Laws on base and made us equal to US Marshals.
In my CONUS stations I was allowed to attend the 13-week Arizona Law Enforcement Academy (ALETA) in Tucson, AZ. This helped with enforcing Civilian Laws on base and made us equal to US Marshals.
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As a former enlisted man, I HATE MPs! But someone has to do this kind of duty, so it's unlikely to ever happen. Remember, MPs don't just persecute poor, innocent soldiers. They also serve as traffic cops, provide rear-area security, and guard POWs.
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I don't see how they could remove military police units. One huge problem would come in combat zones. It is the MP units that deal with prisoners of war and others. They are also responsible for flow of military traffic and checkpoints for that traffic. Who do they think they will use in the next war? Civilian DoD employees in a combat zone? Yea good luck with that.
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In basic, I was told to escort an prisoner to the brig. He sat across from me in the back of a 3/4 ton. They handed me a 45 and said, If he escapes I would serve out his sentence. I put a round in the chamber, turned the safety off, and told him, "I'm not going to serve out your sentence.
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Unless things have changed over the last twenty years, military police are not just post police officers, they have a combat mission, which ranges from glorified infantry to rear area security. Then there the conflict resolution part.
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SGT Greg Knytych
True but there are useful skills learned in the Garrison (CONUS) duties, which is the area of change I've seen discussed.
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The USCG has seven different roles, including:
Maritime Law Enforcement: The Maritime Law Enforcement mission program protects America's maritime borders, defends the Nation's maritime sovereignty, facilitates legitimate use of the waterways, and suppresses violations of U.S. Federal law on, under, and over the seas to include illegal migration and Transnational Organized Crime.
The Army also has the United States Army Criminal Investigation Division (CID), which I always thought was part of the MP Corp, but I suppose it isn’t really.
Why not transform the MP Corp into something like what the USCG does in the area of law enforcement, including what MP’s do during war time?
Maritime Law Enforcement: The Maritime Law Enforcement mission program protects America's maritime borders, defends the Nation's maritime sovereignty, facilitates legitimate use of the waterways, and suppresses violations of U.S. Federal law on, under, and over the seas to include illegal migration and Transnational Organized Crime.
The Army also has the United States Army Criminal Investigation Division (CID), which I always thought was part of the MP Corp, but I suppose it isn’t really.
Why not transform the MP Corp into something like what the USCG does in the area of law enforcement, including what MP’s do during war time?
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SGT Greg Knytych
The problem is that the USCG wartime and peacetime missions aren't very different in their AO and the tactics are not that different, whereas the MP in CONUS are almost opposite. Wartime duties are POW Operations, traffic control, battlefield and rear area security, and recon/small unit incursions. Law enforcement is at the bottom of the list.
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SGT Greg Knytych
That's what I thought too, but I've seen this story in a few different places reported slightly differently.
The common component is changing duties in CONUS posts away from Garrison Duties (law/traffic enforcement, criminal investigations, etc) towards combat training and mission oriented activities while keeping overseas duties similar to current duties.
Most stories talk about manpower needs and mission readiness. Not sure what to believe at this point.
The common component is changing duties in CONUS posts away from Garrison Duties (law/traffic enforcement, criminal investigations, etc) towards combat training and mission oriented activities while keeping overseas duties similar to current duties.
Most stories talk about manpower needs and mission readiness. Not sure what to believe at this point.
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Let me pose a completely different possibility.
Suppose we completely restructure the MP Corps, replacing it with a properly organized and properly equipped Constabulary Corps.
Yes I realize this proposal is just 20 years late -- we should have seen the coming need after Gulf War I, and even the completely deaf dumb and blind should have seen it in the aftermath of Afghanistan and Gulf War II when we spent decades trying to use random combat arms units as Constabulary.
Suppose we completely restructure the MP Corps, replacing it with a properly organized and properly equipped Constabulary Corps.
Yes I realize this proposal is just 20 years late -- we should have seen the coming need after Gulf War I, and even the completely deaf dumb and blind should have seen it in the aftermath of Afghanistan and Gulf War II when we spent decades trying to use random combat arms units as Constabulary.
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MSG Thomas Currie
SGT Greg Knytych - look at the first several years after the end of WWII in Germany -- we were an occupying power in a country where there still existed some diehard resistance, plus a significant amount of various criminal activity (mostly black market), and a population who mostly didn't trust us. We needed a force that combined the skills of law enforcement and the ability to conduct localized combat operations rapidly. What we came up with was basically a mix of cavalry and MPs.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Constabulary
https://history.army.mil/Unit-History/Force-Structure-Support/The-US-Constabulary-in-Post-War-Germany-1946-52/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Constabulary
https://history.army.mil/Unit-History/Force-Structure-Support/The-US-Constabulary-in-Post-War-Germany-1946-52/
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SGT Greg Knytych
MSG Thomas Currie this sound similar to what the 2nd MP Co started training with the 5th Striker Force to enhance our ability to respond to situations quickly. Almost like a mix of SWAT and Special Ops. The plan was to expand that out of 2nd Infantry Division but it never sedmed to materialize.
I agree this could, in the non-garrison duties, help but the issue is garrison duties mostly in stateside assignments.
I agree this could, in the non-garrison duties, help but the issue is garrison duties mostly in stateside assignments.
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MSG Thomas Currie
SGT Greg Knytych - Yes, what to have MPs do in CONUS is a problem area.
When a combat arms unit is in CONUS, they train for their combat mission, we don't have a completely different set of duties for Infantry in CONUS
When a combat arms unit is in CONUS, they train for their combat mission, we don't have a completely different set of duties for Infantry in CONUS
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SGT Greg Knytych
MSG Thomas Currie very true but those duties are still a part of the combat mission, depending on which unit you're assigned to. Of course there's more opportunities to train like this overseas than stateside. Most MP units stateside are strictly garrison.
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Been over 35 years since my ETS buy we fulfilled a role in central America no other type of unit could have. Back then in some 3rd world countries they are willing to accept MPs vs infantry because they saw them as less of a threat even though our MTOE was heavier than a light infantry unit. If this still holds true, I don't see how they can be eliminated. Not to mention the POW and battlefield traffic ops.
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