Posted on May 23, 2017
SSG Team Leader
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Responses: 23
SFC Michael Hasbun
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There isn't a rank or promotion system in the world that can make you a real leader. You either are, or aren't. There are more than enough zebras in the military to illustrate that rank and boards do not confer or validate any leadership ability. You are who you are. Swapping out the cloth on your chest will not magically imbue you with any additional knowledge, wisdom, experience or competence. It's the person that matters.
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PO3 John Keas
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Promotions/Advancements should be earned by the qualified. Not just handed out. We always looked down on the E4s that came out of school. We called them "Pushbutton 3rds" They were given 3rd class just for completing A School. Hardly any of them were ever taken seriously in the fleet. I earned my crow in the Fleet. I honestly think only those who deserve advancement should get it. It isn't candy.
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Sgt Dale Briggs
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We were automatically promoted up to E4 unless you screwed up of course, from there only on merit. It helps younger married earn a bit more money, and even that’s tough on the budget, don’t know how they make it.
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CPL Kevin Bright
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Being a Desert Storm era soldier I received Specialist at 2 years of service and went to the promotion board at 4 years. After returning from Desert Storm Being promotable I never sought out sergeant stripes because I knew I had to make cutoff but my primary MOS every month was maxed at 999. Which to everyone knows means overstrength no promotions. I maintained a max score on my promotion points and let my performance speak for itself. Well after another 4 years and a combat tour under my belt I was at my 8th year and got caught in the drawdown after Desert Storm. So because the promotion ladder was clogged up with so many NCOs I could not make sergeant by my 8th year and was discharged. I enlisted into the Army right after High school and a soldier is all I knew what to be unfortunately I was researching my records and noticed that after I went to the promotion board I was recommended for sergeant 5 times! Some people will say you should have went into a secondary MOS well I did. No luck there. I always tell my wife that I woukd have stayed in for 20 and there isn't a day that I dont miss being a soldier.
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MSgt Owner
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In the Air Force E-1 to E-4 are automatic. Is that what you are talking about? Its not worthy of the cost of boarding and testing. Those can be delayed by disciplinary action.
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SSG Team Leader
SSG (Join to see)
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Negative, MSGT. What I mean was lower enlisted in Active Duty Army get automatic promotions to Sergeant (hence the term I used, stripes). It seems like an ongoing trend that the ones that know they are going to get an automatic promotion don't tend try (most cases but not all) and max out other requirements while others like myself have to max everything to barely get picked up due to MOS demand, slots and other factors. Read my response to my question below to get a better idea of what I'm talking about.
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MSgt Owner
MSgt (Join to see)
7 y
SSG (Join to see) - Ah, automatic promotions in the Air Force have no bearing on MOS, we call AFSC. Obviously commanders have last say though.
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COL Charles Williams
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Can you explain... ? Yes, I am few years removed... SSG (Join to see) .... Nothing is automatic... Junior enlisted promotions (are/were) are based on slots available and then merit based. For 1LT, you meet the requirements 1st.... E-5/6 you have to be recommended, do well on the board, and have the required points... CPT and above, and E-7 and above all based on centralized selection boards, as are Battalion and above Command selections, and now CSM positions.
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SSG Team Leader
SSG (Join to see)
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Sir, you're correct and those requirements still stand. The issue that I've been seeing is for awhile is that some individuals can pass all the requirements (I'm talking about E4 -> E5 -> E6+ in this case) but are not so good Soldiers from the get go and yet still get promoted to those ranks/positions, even with their points being so low while others are killing (trying to max every requirement) themselves to barely get promoted. From other people's responses in fact correct as well as the slots are based off the needs of the Army and what is available as a whole. Now not everyone who gets picked up by either barely needing points or get automatic (+/-) are total scum bags but from what I've seen, it seems to be more about quality than quality. I even thought the whole reason everything was getting revamped in the Army was to keep the good Soldiers in and the bad ones out.

I've even tried helping a newly promoted NCO (which also happened to have a low promoting point requirement) one time on how to write a monthly counseling because they didn't know how. All that NCO knew was bad leadership which was given to them before and is now giving it to their Joe's beneath them and that's wrong. It's getting tiring to see people getting promoted into these positions that barely had to work for it, passed everything from the boards and BLC requirements, puts on a show when upper echelon is present (pretending or faking as you will), while others got to go above and beyond just to barely make the cut.

I know the promotion system is not perfect for the Army (Active Duty) but I was also trying to here others opinions on how they would like to change it for the better so that way we can retain the Solders the Army really needs. All this is opinion based off my experiences and as some other responded with the same as well. I would just like for the good Soldiers who know their jobs and know how to lead to stay in rather than not so good ones wanting hand outs and trying to get ranked up just to solely have more money in the bank.
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SFC Intelligence Analyst
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The only time there are those who get promoted from the CLI (Command Liste Integration) I believe usually depends on MOS. "Soldiers who meet the established criteria will be integrated onto the SGT/SSG standing list and awarded 39 and 14 points respectively. However, in order to attain more points, Soldiers with CLI status must appear before a promotion board." So you only get "automatic promotion" if your commander circles "yes" and your cutoff is the minimum. If it's not the minimum cutoff then that person still has to make points. So I'm trying to understand the shade thrown at those on CLI.

I have seen very few people come up on the CLI. Someone I worked with two units ago she came up on the CLI or "automatic promotion." The CSM who was there still had her go to a board because the commander can remove someone from CLI.

I don't think you can say someone isn't a real leader because they came up on that list and got promoted that way because they only are getting that promotion if the cutoff scores are super low.

http://www.cutoffscores.com/enlisted-promotions/command-list.html
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SSG Team Leader
SSG (Join to see)
7 y
Well that's the thing SFC, sometimes the unqualified ones manage to slide their way through. I've seen it a lot, especially when the upper echelon has not seen the Soldiers true side. A lot of times (speaking on what I've seen for a very long time) they throw a pony show when higher ranking Soldiers are around which gives them a very good impression. Granted what you've told me is correct and I'm aware of that but even some leadership just put a check in the box anyways. I don't want to continue to discuss this specific event(s) because it'll be unprofessional of me to call out so many Soldiers and throw them under the bus.

I'm trying very hard to avoid being a salty Soldier but believe it or not, the shenanigans can be real. The sad part is no matter what the Army has implemented in the current regs and procedures, the unqualified ones still make their way up.
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SGT Dave Tracy
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Yours is the classic example of a statement disguised as a question; not that there is anything inherently wrong with that. But in answer to your question, perhaps there are certain circumstances, but as a general rule, I never liked the concept.
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SSG Team Leader
SSG (Join to see)
7 y
Yeah kind of morphed into several different discussions. I guess it's because when I intentionally tried to type in the limited question that's what was the best I could do at the time.
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SGT Dave Tracy
SGT Dave Tracy
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SSG (Join to see) - Yeah, sometimes how one wants to frame a question or generate thoughts on a topic doesn't fit well with the site. Happens.
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SSG Unit Administrative Technician
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E-1 to E-4 I understand. E-5 and above, I think the Soldier needs to do their own packet so they can teach others how to do it (for the Reserve side). If it's Active Duty and they have to stand in front of the board, that's all on the Soldier as well. I personally don't feel that E-5 and above should be automatic.
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SSG Infantryman
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dude if youre stuck on points, especially since it seems your mos is always maxed on points, ypu probably should have chosen a different mos. the way the system works is the army only needs a certain number of that rank each month so they fill that number by promoting x number of people. if x is 30 that month then the 30 people with the highest points get promoted and whoever had the lowest points of the 30 is the points limit put out by the army. I know for E5, infantry has been at the minimum or less than 300 or like 3 years straight now, sucks but should have chosen a different mos
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