Posted on Apr 26, 2017
SN Greg Wright
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Where the Army has fixed-wing aircraft (they do), those pilots are Commissioned, so I got to wondering what the deal is. All other services, rotary-winged pilots are Commissioned.
Posted in these groups: Rank RankSpyplane AviationAmerican flag soldiers SoldiersPilot logo Pilot
Edited >1 y ago
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CPT Nicholas D.
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Most Army Aviators are Warrant Officers. Even in the Fixed Wing side of the house, most of our airplane pilots are Warrants. (In the OSAA Detachments, they were originally ALL Warrant Officers, commanded by CW5's. Then someone decided to change the organization, give them an MTOE, and now I have to face a 2LT every morning when I am shaving in the mirror). The reason the Army chose to make the bulk of its Aviation personnel Warrant Officers was because they wanted an appropriate grade and courtesy bestowed upon its pilots, but did not want the O-Grade promotion/assignment process to disrupt continuity. The idea is that you have a technical officer who can devote his career to becoming an expert in his craft. Our O-Grade Officers (O-Grade is a term we use since CW2's and above are "legally" commissioned officers) are still pilots, but unfortunately that role is often times secondary to their chosen path to be managers of the organization. At least we have a Branch now. There was a time that other branch officers (Infantry, Engineer, Artillery,etc) would be "Branch Detailed" to Aviation to serve as the leadership. The problem was you had an Infantry Officer who just wounded his competitiveness with other Infantry Officers by spending valuable years of his career doing "non-Infantry" things. The creation of the Aviation Branch was intended to correct that issue.

An Army Warrant Officer will spend most of their career in operational flying positions, whereas our O-grades will do their platoon and company time and spend the rest of their careers in Staff positions. A few will become Battalion and Brigade Commanders. A microscopic few will ever see General Officer, but most of our hemorrhage on the O-Grade side of the house comes around the O-3 level. Many Army Captains will have fulfilled their mandatory service obligation after 6 years, see the proverbial flying desk ahead, and will separate, branch transfer, or some will revert to Warrant Officer (happens a lot more in the Guard and Reserves than in the Active Component.) Those that stay to see the oak leaf aren't spending too much time in a cockpit.

Having seen both sides of the coin, I see the intent. The idea was to create a system where guys aren't promoted out of a cockpit too fast. For the most part, it works, but as a Warrant Officer sees CW3 and above, he starts seeing the Staff Monster creeping around the corner more and more. At least he still gets to fly once in a while.
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CPT Nicholas D.
CPT Nicholas D.
6 y
SGT Mustafa Stokely I tried doing a quick research on “when” this happened. Couldn’t find a date. CW2 and above are “commissioned”, meaning they derive their authority through a commission by the President of the United States. The rank of Warrant Officer (WO1) is an appointment by the service secretary (i.e Secretary of the Army). What this allows is for Chief Warrant Officers to perform certain duties that other commissioned officers can do such as swearing people in (under oath or into an enlistment) and other command functions. The Warrant Officer is still a subordinate grade to the O-Grade officers, but by giving Chief Warrant Officers a commission, it provided more authority for them to execute their duties. All Warrants WO1-CW5 rate a salute from enlisted. All O-Grades, 2LT-COL rate a salute from all Warrant Officers. (Generals get saluted by everyone). But I just wanted to clarify that even though Ws are commissioned, that doesn’t disrupt the order of rank. That is... until you have a CW2 who is the Pilot in Command and his “PI” (Copilot) is the Battalion Commander (O5). There’s a lot of leadership dynamics coming together at that moment!
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CW2 Fred Baker
CW2 Fred Baker
6 y
Most of what I have read here rings true, but another reason for Warrants existed. Back in my day, there was a need for a massive amount of pilots. At that time Warrants had their own branch and they were paid less than the regular officers. Of course, most Warrants only had an high school education and the pay was respectable. Also, we only had four grades and there were no command Warrants. In my case, I didn't see it as a career as much as today's Warrants. I was a technical officer, who was constantly learning about my profession. I loved flying and everything attached to it. Bear in mind, I left the service due to a reduction in force in 1971. There have been a lot of changes since.
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SCPO John Schneider
SCPO John Schneider
6 y
Seems to me as an outsider (Navy), Warrants can stay at the job they do best, being pilots. Whereas, JOs when promoted may run into an overhead problem at their unit & also have to accept more responsibility outside of being a pilot. Much simpler to provide an efficient manning level with Warrants.
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MAJ Ronnie Reams
MAJ Ronnie Reams
5 y
SFC (Join to see) - Makes one wonder why the Army did away with the PSG rank if they promote to SFC and then become a PSG. LOL USAF kept Technical Sergeant but did away with CPL (airman 2d class) and Sergeant (senior Airman, although this was later than they added two enlisted grades) in the 1950s.
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LCDR Keith Trepanier
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Edited >1 y ago
Having served as an Army Warrant Officer pilot and as a commissioned officer pilot in the Coast Guard, I can tell you that a lot of the reasoning has to do with sheer numbers and cost. Congress mandates how many commissioned officers each service can have. It doesn't mandate how many warrant officers it can have so the Army takes advantage of that. The Army has more aircraft than the Air Force and a lot more pilots. So having them as warrant officers helps a few things.

It allows them to have more pilots at an overall lower cost than if all the pilots were commissioned and they don't have to have a bunch of officers competing for a very limited amount of leadership positions.

In other services, the commissioned officer pilots are always looking for additional jobs to do outside of aviation so they have something to show when it becomes time to get promoted or get looked at for command. A warrant officer pilot does his best to avoid additional jobs or even get looked at by the command. That way they can focus on doing the job of flying and figuring out how to leave early and avoid PT.

In other services, the youngest pilot in the unit will be about 23 years old, college educated, ponders decisions, and looks down on those who are not as gentlemanly as they are. A warrant officer pilot could be as young as 19, with no college education, tends not to over think things, says "watch this" a lot, and gives a big F U to those who think they are better than they are.

In other services, the pilots eat their own. It is a struggle to get the support you need from your fellow officers especially those at the same rank because they see you as competition. Warrant Officer pilots create a pack. Often known as the WOLF pack or Warrant Officer Liberation Front. If you mess with one, you mess with the who pack and have been known to make or break commissioned officer's careers. But be warned, if you are a warrant officer that is not deemed worthy, you will be fed to the commissioned officers as an offering.

In other services, the pilots have to stay in nice lodging wherever they go and scorn anything less than a four star hotel. In the Army, the warrant officer pilots get a GP medium and brag they don't have to sleep on the ground. If given the opportunity to stay in something with four solid walls and a roof, they constantly worry about when someone will come in and tell them there was a mistake and be told to move. Because of that, they never unpack their bags.
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SMSgt Mark Miller
SMSgt Mark Miller
>1 y
The Air Force has been mentioned a couple times, sort of "in passing" [a flyby?]. Just some background on the AF and Warrant Officers -- the AF inherited WO's in 47 from the Army, but the AF didn't never established a clear understanding of their role. On 1959-60 the top two enlisted ranks were established. Although not acknowledged for many years, AF leadership decided the new E-8 and E-9 "super" grades could fulfill the duties then being performed by the warrant officers. With the decision, the AF designated these ranks as "superintendents" instead of following the Army and Marine practice of calling them "staff or senior" NCOICs. There was some discussion within the larger AF about on 2017. That year's National Defense Authorization Act included a request from Congress to evaluate restoring WOs as a solution to the pilate shortage. They AF determined that it would not. One factor contributing to the shortage is a lack of cockpits for the current pilots and flight time restrictions imposed by budget shortfalls.
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CW4 Brian Haas
CW4 Brian Haas
6 y
You REALLY think Warrant officers aren’t eating their own? Man, unfortunately, the days of the Wolfpack tend to be gone. Very few good senior warrants that are actually looking out for the Warrants anymore. They tend to be more worried about their next rank and making CWOB.
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LCDR Keith Trepanier
LCDR Keith Trepanier
6 y
CW4 Brian Haas - I wrote this over a year ago and I left the Army many years before that. I can only speak of my own experience.
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CW4 William Kessinger
CW4 William Kessinger
6 y
Except in my day it was WOPA (warrant officer protection association) a fictional organization to protect each other (warrants).
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LtCol Robert Quinter
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Edited >1 y ago
My understanding is it was originally the Army's way of working around the congressional restrictions on the number of officers between the O-1 and O-4 as well as the advantage of having a Warrant specializing in flight duties without being distracted by other duties associated with the O ranks. Warrants were also paid less base and flight pay until the 70s. They also had a faster and more responsive fill rate than the O officers.
I don't know the current status, but during VN their was also a difference in the training level, with the Warrants not getting some of the advanced training provided to other pilots and aviators (instruments)
All that aside, Warrant Officer pilots have proven their skill, bravery and dedication since they were established after WWII
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Sgt Dan Catlin
Sgt Dan Catlin
6 y
Ya'll don't mean to tell me it's all driven by POLITICS!? Who'd of thought that ...
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LTC Jason Mackay
LTC Jason Mackay
6 y
CPT Clifford Simpson - flight school I see flight school. Airframe training is airframe training. The O grades fly then become staff officers, go to non-flight assignments, and commanders. The Warrants fly their whole career, for the most part.

Pilots are pilots.
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CW2 Fred Baker
CW2 Fred Baker
6 y
I graduated from flight school in September 1969 and the training for Warrants was identical as for Officers. After 'Nam, I found that extra qualifications became available, more so for Warrants. I loved being a Warrant and I don't regret it one bit.
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MAJ Ronnie Reams
MAJ Ronnie Reams
5 y
CPT Clifford Simpson - < IDKBIBT that WOs only got tactical IFR cards out of flight school. This was in mid 1960s.
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Why are Army Helo pilots Warrant Officers, rather than Commissioned?
SFC Senior Small Group Leader (Ssgl)
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We have commissioned as well as warrant officer pilots. Majority of a unit is warrant pilots however. Duties and responsibilities of commissioned officers take them off the bird most of the time. They don't get nearly the flight hours the warrants do
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CW3 Kim B.
CW3 Kim B.
>1 y
Warrants are commissioned at CW2.
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SFC Senior Small Group Leader (Ssgl)
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Yes, this is true.
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MAJ Contracting Officer
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Because the Army is cheap.
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LTC Jason Mackay
LTC Jason Mackay
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I think the truth is closer to what LtCol Robert Quinter said....although I don't think the ABO slunk off crying about it.
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CAPT Kevin B.
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Too bad the "humor" tag wasn't used too. Does the Army really need Zipper Suited Sun Gods like the Air Force. Ohhh, flying below 200 feet, nooooo. Being forward? No Cable TV? Now down to business. W-1s are not commissioned but given a warrant authorizing their rank by their Service Secretary. Chief Warrant Officers (W-2 through W-5) are commissioned by the President. If you take a look at history, you'll see the use of the warrant ranks to fit specialties. Flying historically has been done by commissioned officers. But then helos came on the scene; lots of them. So do you bust the commissioned officer rank progression structure overall by a slug of helo pilots? The easy way out was to use the "Other Rank" method and voila, you're done and go have a beer. The rub is you have a group of people who are stuck between O-2/3 pay, so no matter how good you get, the grass is absolutely greener going commissioned or more often getting out. I recall lots of W-1 helo types during 'Nam. But I'd defer to the AR helo types to clarify this better. Did see a comment about commissioned officer body count caps but I don't know how that played out in the early '60s.
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CPT Nicholas D.
CPT Nicholas D.
>1 y
I enjoy your humor, and yes, I wish they'd give us the pickle suit back so we can look the part just as everyone else. The only two discussion points you made that I will politely disagree with is the topic of pay and the incentive to stay. I know the pay chart has made a lot of evolution, but generally our Warrant officers are pretty well paid. I was a W3 before taking a direct appointment and will receive SAVE PAY to make up the difference between my current pay grade and what I was getting paid through CPT. The senior Warrants, W4s and W5s are solid 6 figure pay brackets. Additionally, Warrant Officer Aviation Career Incentive Pay only goes up and never goes down like the O grade side. But I am telling you about guys with 13-30 years wearing pips. Brand-new WaWaWa One who went Highschool to Flightschool makes less than any Officer in the history of officerdom.

On the incentive piece, I get this all the time since my AGR position involves Aviator Accessions in my State... it all depends what do you want to do. If you want to fly fly fly, you need to consider being a Warrant. If you want to be a "hard bar" in the Army and wear wings on your chest, know that minimums are the plan for you when it comes to flying. Our O grades manage the business, and our Ws do the execution. Most of our Warrants aren't attracted by slightly higher base pay (which is offset by flight pay) to give up the cockpit.
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CAPT Kevin B.
CAPT Kevin B.
>1 y
Ah yes, flight pay. Senior moment.
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SPC Infantryman
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Being Enlisted Officers (Warrent Officers) it allows the flexibility to be concerned in fine tuning a specific skill IE Aviation rather then be forced into the politics of being a Commisioned Officer. A Commisioned Officer is a leader of the Formation, An Enlisted Officer is an expert of a skill. It also allows the Army to keep highly skilled professionals that don't have a degree in the Army with better benefits and pay to compete with the civilian market.
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CPT Nicholas D.
CPT Nicholas D.
>1 y
I'm sorry SPC Arnold, the US Army does not have "Enlisted Officers" except for Non-Commissioned Officers. Warrant Officers are not enlisted. They are not serving an enlistment. Warrant Officer 1 is a rank that is appointed by the authority of the Secretary of the Army. Once a Warrant Officer is promoted to Chief Warrant Officer 2 and above, they are commissioned by the authority of the President of the United States, making them essentially "commissioned officers." Additionally, although not required for initial appointment, most of the Warrant Aviators that I have served with possess at least a Bachelors Degree. Every Warrant in my current flight Det has their degree. But you are correct that the increased pay and benefits is a great way to keep talent wearing a uniform.
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SPC Infantryman
SPC (Join to see)
>1 y
I apologize about the confusion I was just referring to the Author of the question without correcting the mistake. Thanks for clarifying that.
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CW4 William Kessinger
CW4 William Kessinger
6 y
There is no such thing as "ENLISTED OFFICER" the Warrant is NOT enlisted and is considered a officer by all branches of services that I know of. Maybe not the Air Force. They have none but will always want to butt in with their 2 cents.
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CW5 All Source Intelligence Technician
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They really aren't Warrant Officers in the true sense, but are Flight Officers. Technical Warrants require years of experience before becoming a Warrant Officer, read technical expert. A "Flight Officer", at least in theory, could be an 18 year old just out of high school, hence the term "high school to flight school".
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CW5 John M.
CW5 John M.
>1 y
I’ll admit it. I was one of those “warm bodies” that got my wings in 1970 at 19. The techs put a lot in to get their Warrant, and I always respected that. I just played the hand I was dealt and stayed away from “family feuds”. Later, in the NG, I think those issues had about died out. Good posts
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TSgt Technician
TSgt (Join to see)
>1 y
You can fly at 19, go for it. Get degree later. Wish I know about it, I would had try.
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CW4 Roger Pettner
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As a Warrant Officer from 1969 Through 2009 I agree with most of the comments above. I lived through all the changes in that time period. In 1969 all warrants 1-4 were true warrants given their rank buy the Secretary of Defense. In the 80's thing began to change. All warrants 2-5 were Commitioned and give a small pay increase and more responsibilities. The enucation requirements increased commensurate to the rank held a CW4 was required to have at least a BS/BA; CW5 a MS/MA. There was also a battery of training courses military specific all Warrants grades had to pass to be promoted to the next grade. This was all additional training imposed on top of our MOS training and additional duty identifier (Safety, Standards, Maintenance, etc.) In 2005 Warrants got a huge pay increase that placed us within our Commitioned Officer's (hard bars) payscal. As a CW4 with 38 years I was earning midscale LTC pay. From being considered the senior enlisted ranks to parity in rank and privileges we have come a long way.
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COL Charles Williams
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Edited >1 y ago
Good question... As you know we have Commission Officer pilots too, but the vast amount of our aircraft are flown day in and day out by Warrants. I am interested in the answer. SN Greg Wright

It appears it was due to personal caps and funding.

https://warrantofficerhistory.org/Hist_Avn_WO.htm
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SN Greg Wright
SN Greg Wright
>1 y
I was interested that that was the reason as well, Colonel.
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CW4 William Kessinger
CW4 William Kessinger
6 y
Thanks Col William. I saved the file to my desktop. CW4 Retired.
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