Posted on Jul 24, 2020
Why do so many people in the military have useless degrees?
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I have met many people I served with who have degrees in: interdisciplinary studies, weapons of mass destruction, counter terrorism, English, psychology from online degree mills.
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 149
Why would you say a counterterrorism degree is useless? I put my degree to very good use as a counterintelligence officer. Now that I'm retired, I'm putting it to even better use as a consultant.
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Two things. [1] The degree does not guarantee you a job. For the most part, the military does. [Bottom Line: Survival.] [2] With "SOME on-line degrees" and $5.50 you can get a cup of coffee at Starbucks. [A worthless piece of costly paper. Also with some degrees, you can't get a job unless you get a Masters or PhD in the field of study.] The O-6 summed it up best: My History degree got me a one way ticket to flight school. [I bet the O-6 went to a real university.]
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The easiest way to earn points for advancement is to have a degree. Now, I know in the Navy, at least while I was in, if you had a degree that matched your Rate (MOS) you were much better off. For example, as an IT1 if I had a degree in business, Computer Science, or Electronics Engineering (Network Engineering) you would advance faster. I also know as an IT, we had to start acquiring our civilian certifications. Which is the way it should be. However, I have met several Officers with degrees that make you wonder how they're in the position they're in. Like a Communications Officer that had a BS in Equine Sciences or a Combat Systems Officer that had a degree in Culinary Arts. As for the English Degree, COL Harris is right on the money. While not completely useless in the civilian world, being able to communicate is essential and a psychology degree helps you understand and handle people. I honestly believe that Senior leadership, E6 and up, should be required to take Psych courses to help interact with personnel and Child Psych to handle and control the 17-21 year old children under their command.
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SMSgt Bob W.
Eric, you hit the nail on the head. "Child Psych to handle and control the 17-21 year old children under their command" is greatly needed. In some cases, away from home for the first time and they think they are "bulletproof". All enlisted leadership needs to understand people and treat people as human beings. Many people in leadership believe subordinates are pieces of machinery. They treat them as such. With a little education and practical experience directing people you can identify goof-off immediately.
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PO3 Justin Bowen
"and Child Psych to handle and control the 17-21 year old children under their command."
Look at what you wrote and let that sink in for a moment...
Look at what you wrote and let that sink in for a moment...
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There are millions of useless degress in the civilian world as well. The degrees you mentioned with the exception of English are important to the Army while while serving. Almost any degree will get you an entry position with the government, US and States. Jobs are competive and life is not fair.
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Lots of folks have brought up valid points regarding degree majors, and I can see how these disciplines can augment military careers and check blocks for specific job requirements. But your comment regarding "degree mills" is 100% accurate.
A good friend of mine is a hiring manager for a Fortune 500 company, and he will not even look at a resume if the individual has not attended a major state university or private institution. Jobs at his company are coveted and pay well. He told me that people with degrees from for-profit colleges go immediately to the trash without consideration.
This is honestly a problem in the military. For-profit universities work hand-in-hand with military infrastructure to sell these cheap, low-quality degrees to service members at or below the tuition assistance rate. They don't provide the brand recognition or stature that is afforded through other programs, and are often discounted by employers as degree mills.
Soldiers need to be educated that their options for online college are not limited to these shady universities. Many colleges are now offering the exact same degree from their flagship school 100% online. They also give military discounts and don't charge out-of-state tuition rates. I know firsthand because it was important to me when pursuing my BS and MS. Colorado State allowed me to earn a business degree that is exactly the same as the one earned at the home campus. My MS says "The University of Missouri at Columbia" despite never setting foot near the flagship campus.
Quality matters. More mainstream schools are offering nationally-recognized degree options without any special "online" asterisks attached. Those of us who are aware of such opportunities have the responsibility to make them known to others.
Examples:
University of Florida at Gainesville
https://ufonline.ufl.edu/degrees/undergraduate/
Oregon State University
https://ecampus.oregonstate.edu/
Loyola University Chicago
https://www.luc.edu/online/index.shtml
A good friend of mine is a hiring manager for a Fortune 500 company, and he will not even look at a resume if the individual has not attended a major state university or private institution. Jobs at his company are coveted and pay well. He told me that people with degrees from for-profit colleges go immediately to the trash without consideration.
This is honestly a problem in the military. For-profit universities work hand-in-hand with military infrastructure to sell these cheap, low-quality degrees to service members at or below the tuition assistance rate. They don't provide the brand recognition or stature that is afforded through other programs, and are often discounted by employers as degree mills.
Soldiers need to be educated that their options for online college are not limited to these shady universities. Many colleges are now offering the exact same degree from their flagship school 100% online. They also give military discounts and don't charge out-of-state tuition rates. I know firsthand because it was important to me when pursuing my BS and MS. Colorado State allowed me to earn a business degree that is exactly the same as the one earned at the home campus. My MS says "The University of Missouri at Columbia" despite never setting foot near the flagship campus.
Quality matters. More mainstream schools are offering nationally-recognized degree options without any special "online" asterisks attached. Those of us who are aware of such opportunities have the responsibility to make them known to others.
Examples:
University of Florida at Gainesville
https://ufonline.ufl.edu/degrees/undergraduate/
Oregon State University
https://ecampus.oregonstate.edu/
Loyola University Chicago
https://www.luc.edu/online/index.shtml
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Because Big Army loves to see Degrees.....HEY THIS GUY HAS a degree in underwater basket weaving, he MUST be the best guy to make Sergeant First Class.....WHAT he has never been in a unit doing his MOS...OK but He has this bachelors degree in European Nose Picking....
"Big or tall, short or small, we will all have a ball on the Dog and Pony Show" (Sung to the tune of Tom and Jerry")
As for Officers, it is not the college degree that preps them for Service. It is the military training that they take, ROTC, Academy etc.
I have had officers that I would follow to hell and back and some that I would rather never see again.
IN ANY EVENT, it is not for us to weed this out, NOT YOUR JOB...BUT for EVERY SINGLE Officer that I had that was poorly trained or did not trust his NCOs there was an NCO that did not do His or Her Job or earn that Officer's trust.
If you as an NCO put a bad feeling about NCOs in the mind of an Officer then you are part of the problem not the solution.
"Big or tall, short or small, we will all have a ball on the Dog and Pony Show" (Sung to the tune of Tom and Jerry")
As for Officers, it is not the college degree that preps them for Service. It is the military training that they take, ROTC, Academy etc.
I have had officers that I would follow to hell and back and some that I would rather never see again.
IN ANY EVENT, it is not for us to weed this out, NOT YOUR JOB...BUT for EVERY SINGLE Officer that I had that was poorly trained or did not trust his NCOs there was an NCO that did not do His or Her Job or earn that Officer's trust.
If you as an NCO put a bad feeling about NCOs in the mind of an Officer then you are part of the problem not the solution.
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A lot of it in my experience has to do with getting as many promotion points as possible to max out at the promotion board. However, a degree IS NOT useless in my mind as it identifies you as having devoted yourself to getting smarter. Not to mention that most humans don't possess one. I guess getting the degree is the easy part. Applying it to something useful, worthwhile, or money-making is the hard part.
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No degree is useless no matter the course of study, you learn many things along the way.
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The degrees individuals receive from Colleges, Universities, and Academies aren't useless, so much as they may not be used while in a specific field or MOS. The gaining of a degree also indicates that a individual has the ability to learn other skills.
Having a degree in the Arts or English Literature, may not seem useful for an Infantry Officer from one perspective. But that may be the very background needed for him or her to request specific support from a Civil Affairs Team in regards to documenting and protecting items or locations of historical significance.
Similarly a Soldier with a degree in Fire Protection or Journalism may not seem like a likely fit for a CIMIC Team. However, it enables them to fill roles the Senior Commander may not have the background for. The Journalist might be the PAO the commander needs to deal with reporters, while the Fire Protection Specialist can explain in simplified terms what a 530C's function is and how that type of vehicle can be of support in Civil Relief roles besides fire fighting. (A 530C is an obsolete firefighting vehicle based on the M35 2&1/2 ton chassis).
A degree in Culinary Arts, may seem like the last thing an Engineer Officer needs, however if during a Humanitarian Mission he or she needs to set up a multifunctional Industrial Kitchen on a field site due to destruction of infrastructure. The Culinary background may be the most pertinent aspect required to lay out the most efficient and sanitary set up.
The Square Peg only fits a square hole designed to accept it, formula pretty much only works with Napoleonic Warfare modes of thought. Where in our modern era we need people who can adapt to asymmetric operations, and sometimes that requires we have individuals who don't fit the mold in various positions.
Having a degree in the Arts or English Literature, may not seem useful for an Infantry Officer from one perspective. But that may be the very background needed for him or her to request specific support from a Civil Affairs Team in regards to documenting and protecting items or locations of historical significance.
Similarly a Soldier with a degree in Fire Protection or Journalism may not seem like a likely fit for a CIMIC Team. However, it enables them to fill roles the Senior Commander may not have the background for. The Journalist might be the PAO the commander needs to deal with reporters, while the Fire Protection Specialist can explain in simplified terms what a 530C's function is and how that type of vehicle can be of support in Civil Relief roles besides fire fighting. (A 530C is an obsolete firefighting vehicle based on the M35 2&1/2 ton chassis).
A degree in Culinary Arts, may seem like the last thing an Engineer Officer needs, however if during a Humanitarian Mission he or she needs to set up a multifunctional Industrial Kitchen on a field site due to destruction of infrastructure. The Culinary background may be the most pertinent aspect required to lay out the most efficient and sanitary set up.
The Square Peg only fits a square hole designed to accept it, formula pretty much only works with Napoleonic Warfare modes of thought. Where in our modern era we need people who can adapt to asymmetric operations, and sometimes that requires we have individuals who don't fit the mold in various positions.
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My goal was to be an army officer and serve for life. If the army would have required a certain degree, I would have earned it. The army didn't care what degree I earned, so I picked a field that I was interested in. I chose journalism. You might say I majored in military science and minored in journalism because the army was the only thing that was really important to me, journalism was just a way to get a bachelor's degree. I suspect that is true for many officers. The BA in whatever was just a way to get a degree, they really "majored" in ARMY.
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